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The Turkish truck driving companies transport mainly fuel (Jet A) from the Airbase to Iraq through the northern border. That is one of the three routes for US to bring supplies in and the Turkish route has been considered the safest even though a few Turks have been shot or kidnapped. No, there is no Truck route from Turkey to Afghanistan, I guess I should have been more specific but the Airbase itself is a key strategic point for the war efforts in that country. Without it would be very hard to support that war. Turkey was one of the first countries to jump on the Afghanistan war wagon in 2001. You can google both informations I provided.
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Sure! Let's remember that the United States already recognized the armenian genocide in 1951! A shame Bush has such a bad memory!Originally posted by JosephComment
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You are right but Mc Cain didn't make any promise of recognizing the armenian genocide during his campaign!Originally posted by Anomaly View PostComment
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US have allready accepted , both officially and unoficially (as a result of the last bill that passed the foreign relations comitee)the Armenian Genocide.To make this desicion oficial again against this Turkish goverment will be unfruitfull for all concerned at this time,and Turkey fully acknowledges this! Imagine little Armenia flexing its muscles and forcing the "Turkish Nation" to the table!
How proud I'm to be Armenian!!"All truth passes through three stages:
First, it is ridiculed;
Second, it is violently opposed; and
Third, it is accepted as self-evident."
Arthur Schopenhauer (1788-1860)Comment
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I'm not disagreeing with this. BUT, regardless of that, had people not been extremely retarded with their money, it wouldn't have mattered what the Federal Reserve did. EVERYone should have seen this mortgage crisis coming. The Federal Reserve, the lenders, and most importantly, the BUYERS. I mean...how long did they really think house prices were going to keep going up? How could anyone not see that continuing at that rate, sooner or later, the price of housing was going to far exceed what most can afford, leading to a crash? How long did they think the interest was going to stay that low? If not forever, then how were they planning on affording the house when the interest went up? The sheer stupidity of going with interest only loans, and non-fixed mortgages is mind-boggling, and again illustrates just how stupid the mass public is in this country, and/or how irresponsible they are with their money (i.e. they'd do whatever it took to get into a house, even if they couldn't really afford that house).Originally posted by Edoman View Post
My point exactly. At least McCain doesn't lie. He tells you upfront that he won't recognize it, where as Obama is taking you for a gullible idiot by making empty promises, and you're proving him right by believing in them.Originally posted by SEVAN View PostComment
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So, Incirlik has no relevance to operations in Afghanistan or Pakistan....that's what I thought.Originally posted by Edoman View Post
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The safest way to consider politicians is that none of them are there for the people, only for themselves.Originally posted by Anomaly View Post
Regardless of political persuasion they have all got their snouts in the same trough.
BTW, I'm definitely in favour of the two party system, with the first one preferably on Friday night.Comment
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Obama, Turkey And The G-Resolution
Asli Aydintasbas 09.29.08, 4:00 PM ET
There is no doubt that much of the Muslim world is rooting for Barack Obama in the U.S. presidential race. The 47-year-old Illinois senator is a favorite son to many in the Middle East who are enamored of his middle name "Hussein" or even harbor the belief that the senator is a closet Muslim having to hide his true colors to get a place in the American political establishment. Still others welcome the idea of an Obama presidency as a shift from the unpopular Middle East policies of the Bush administration.
But here in Turkey, the Obamania in the rest of the Muslim world was quick to fade early in the race. Once intrigued by the young senator and his life story, much of the Ankara establishment and the Turkish elite now say they prefer John McCain to snatch the presidential seat.
And all this has little to do with Barack Obama himself.
Modern Turkey is a nation still sorting through the cultural and political clashes that have emerged with the foundation of a secular modern republic from the ashes of the Ottoman Empire in 1923. It is a nation accustomed to both domestic and foreign conflict and obsessed with the idea of its loneliness on the world stage. So it is no surprise that, on any given subject under the sun, most Turks would ask, "But is it good for Turkey?"
In this case, the political establishment in Ankara and Turkey's secular elite seem to think that Barack Obama is not good for Turkey.
"It all has to do with the Armenian issue," a senior Turkish politician tells me, referring to what is essentially a semantic problem, but one with ripple effects far beyond the confines of this region. Turks and Armenians have long disagreed on what to call the tragic events that took place in the eastern provinces of the Ottoman Empire in 1915. Turks say the forced deportations and massacres of Christian Armenians took place in the context of a civil war and do not amount to "genocide." For Armenians in the neighboring Armenia or spread around the world in a large diaspora, this is the first genocide of modern times and as such deserves a universal recognition.
What does all this have to do with Barack Obama? With almost no direct contact, Turks and Armenians have long been fighting the issue out in distant national forums--most notably in the U.S. Congress. Almost every year, the powerful Armenian-American lobby attempts to pass a resolution from Congress marking the events of 1915 as "genocide." The government of Turkey has its own lobbying effort in Washington, almost solely dedicated to the "Armenian issue," and prevents the bill at the expense of threatening to sever strategic ties with the United States. (Having seen Turkey significantly reduce economic and military relations with France when the French Senate passed a similar bill, Washington knows the issue goes far beyond a semantic exercise.)
Successive American presidents have intervened in the 11th hour to kill off the g-resolution in order not to damage relations with a key ally and next door neighbor of Iraq's. Last year, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi and other congressional supporters had to drop the resolution at the last minute when the White House warned it would cripple ties with Turkey and impact the war effort in Iraq.
Yet Barack Obama has pledged he would support a genocide resolution. Worse for Ankara, his running mate Senator Joe Biden has long been an ally of Greek and Armenian lobbies in Washington and sponsored bills questioning Turkish policies on Cyprus and Armenia.
"John McCain on the other hand knows Turkey well and can understand our strategic value," the same Turkish politician tells me. Ankara essentially prefers a man who would have a nostalgic appreciation of Turkey's role in the Cold War and in containing Saddam Hussein, and not push for a "paradigm change" in that equation.
"There is also the Clinton factor," a western diplomat notes. Most Turks were enamored of Bill Clinton when he visited Turkey in the wake of a major earthquake in 1999 and pushed for policies that elevated the Turkish-U.S. relationship to a strategic partnership on energy and regional issues. Bill and Hillary Clinton have since visited Turkey and maintain ties with the Turkish government. (Turkey's prime minister, Tayyip Erdogan, makes a point of seeing the former president or his wife on nearly all his U.S. trips.)
"Obama defeating Hillary did not go down well here," says the diplomat.
When Turks watch the results of U.S. elections in November, they will do with an eye toward April 16, the day Armenians commemorate what Turkish officials call "the so-called genocide," and hope Obama will not win.
Asli Aydintasbas is an Istanbul-based journalist and former Ankara bureau chief of the newspaper Sabah .General Antranik (1865-1927): “I am not a nationalist. I recognize only one nation, the nation of the oppressed.”Comment
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McCain Efforts to Win Over Armenian American Voters Falls Short
September 30, 2008
Washington, D.C. – Clearly concerned about the key role Armenian American voters are set to play in battleground states across the nation on November 4th, Republican nominee John McCain issued an open letter to the community yesterday in the hopes of garnering the support of this key constituency for his floundering presidential campaign.
In only his second attempt to reach out to Armenian-American voters in this more than 20-month election season, Senator McCain failed to coherently outline any solid policy proposals or commitments to the community.
While noting that a “horrific tragedy” befell the Armenian people, Senator McCain did not use the word ‘genocide' when describing the events of 1915, a stance that is not only morally tenuous but also offensive after 8 years of President Bush's refusal to honor his promise to recognize the Armenian Genocide.
“I would rather Senator McCain re-suspend his campaign and try to learn more about the American economy than have him write superficial letters to the community,” stated Areen Ibranossian, Chair of Armenians for Obama.
“For his campaign to utilize the same tactics President Bush has used these past 8 years in reference to the Armenian Genocide is just another example of how Senator McCain will be a 3rd Bush term. It's unfortunate that after 26 years in the Senate, John McCain still abides by Turkey's gag rule on the Armenian Genocide and refuses to honor a historical reality,” added Ibranossian.
Senator McCain's letter comes in the wake of regular criticism by Armenians for Obama and other community members and organizations for John McCain's lack of engagement with Armenian-American voters and on issues important to the community.
His outreach stands in stark contrast with the efforts of Senator Barack Obama's campaign, which has distributed numerous statements along with directly engaging Armenian-American voters. To read Sen. Obama's statements and learn more about the stark differences between the two candidates visit: www.armeniansforobama.com
“The past two presidential elections have been decided by less than 10,000 votes and in states where significant numbers of Armenian-Americans reside. It's not only disrespectful and shameful of the Senator to neglect the Armenian-American community, it's also a strategic error since Armenian-American voters may well prove to be the difference in this election,” concluded Ibranossian.
Armenians for Obama is a nationwide voter registration, education, and mobilization effort dedicated to electing Barack Obama President. Based in Los Angeles, and with chapters and affiliates across the nation, Armenians for Obama will harness the energy and enthusiasm for Barack Obama's candidacy to ensure record high Armenian American turnout in critical battleground states.
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Text of September 29, 2008 McCain campaign open letter
To the Armenian-American Community of the United States
Dear Friends,
The Armenian-American community has contributed richly to the American fabric and has been instrumental in ensuring that a terrible tragedy is never forgotten.
It is fair to say that one of the greatest tragedies of the 20th century, the brutal murder of as many as one and a half million Armenians under the rule of the Ottoman Empire, has also been one of the most neglected. The suffering endured by the Armenian people during that period represented the prologue to what has come to be known as humanity's bloodiest century. It is our responsibility to recognize those tragic events and to ensure that our world never experiences the impact of the bloody conflicts that so filled the 20th century.
In light of that history, the rise of the independent Republic of Armenia from such painful experiences is inspirational, as is the vibrancy of the Armenian diaspora. In particular, I deeply admire both Armenia's support of coalition operations in Iraq and NATO peacekeeping efforts in Kosovo. In my visits to Armenia, I have been deeply impressed by the resilient and hard working Armenian people who have made tremendous progress in very difficult circumstances.
Our country is greatly enriched by the descendents of the victims and survivors of the horrific tragedy that befell the Armenian people. Today Armenian-Americans represent that indestructible spirit of a people and embody the principles of freedom and democracy that all Americans prize above all else. I am grateful for all of the contributions that Armenian-Americans have made to our wonderful country and I greatly value the opportunity to stand with the Armenian-American community in my campaign and as the next President of the United States.
Sincerely,
[signed]
John McCain
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As I see it
Its a question of supporting the lesser of two evils, in the case the lesser evil being Obama, however its interesting to see what has happened with the canididates :
The Democrats choose Obama and Clinton to garner support from African Americans and women, while the Republican's went wth and evangelist and veteran. Am I the only one noticing the way their are trying to entice voters to fall for look at who we have instead of what the parties policies are.
As to Obama, I respect his support for the recognition, but however words are only words and to my knowledge he has not done to much for Armenians, on the other hand McCain has done less (plus his music awful
, its on YouTube all the time).
Anyone know the stance on the smaller parties by chance?Comment
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