Georgian-South Ossetian conflict

[crusader1492]

Re: Georgian-South Ossetian conflict

Declaring Javakhk independent, through force, without at least the reluctant go ahead from Tibilisi, would cause the ROA to be blockaded on a third front.
Armenia simply cannot afford this.

[Federate]

Re: Georgian-South Ossetian conflict

TEXT - Medvedev's statement on S.Ossetia, Abkhazia
Russian President Dmitry Medvedev on Tuesday signed decrees recognising the independence of Georgia's breakaway regions of South Ossetia and Abkhazia.

Following is the Reuters translation of his statement, which was posted on the Kremlin web site at: http://www.kremlin.ru/appears/2008/0...4_205744.shtml


"Respected Russian citizens!

You without doubt know about the tragedy in South Ossetia. The night-time artillery attack of Tskhinvali by Georgian troops led to the deaths of hundreds of our peaceful citizens. Russian peacekeepers, who carried out their duty to defend women, children and elderly people to the end, died.

The Georgian leadership violated the U.N. Charter, their obligations under international treaties, ignored common sense, and launched a military conflict in which civilians became the victims. A similar fate awaited Abkhazia. Apparently, Tbilisi counted on a blitzkrieg, which would hand the world a fait accompli: the most inhumane means to achieve their goal of taking over South Ossetia at the price of exterminating a whole people.

This was not the first attempt. In 1991, Georgian President Gamsakhurdia gave the order to storm Sukhumi and Tskhinvali under the motto "Georgia for Georgians". Just think about these words. It was Russia which then stopped the extermination of the Abkhaz and Ossetian people. Our country has become a mediator and peacekeeper which was looking for a political settlement. But we always proceeded from a recognition of Georgia's territorial integrity.

The Georgian leadership has chosen a different path. Undermining talks, ignoring signed agreements, political and military provocations, attacks on peacekeepers - all this flagrantly violated the regime in the conflict zones established with the support of the United Nations and OSCE.

Russia has shown restraint and patience. We have more than once called for a return to the negotiating table and did not depart from our position even after the unilateral declaration of Kosovo's independence. But our insistent calls to the Georgian side to sign agreements on the non-use of force with Abkhazia against South Ossetia remained unanswered. Unfortunately, they were ignored by NATO and even by the United Nations.

It is clear now: a peaceful solution of the conflict was not part of Tbilisi's plans. The Georgian leadership has been methodically preparing for war, while political and material help from outside mentors only strengthened its feeling of impunity.

On the night of Aug. 8, 2008, Tbilisi made its choice. Saakashvili chose genocide to solve his political tasks. Thus he killed with his own hands all hopes for the peaceful coexistence of Ossetians, Abkhazians and Georgians in one state.

The peoples of South Ossetia and Abkhazia have more than once spoken out in referendums in support of the independence of their republics. We understand that after what had happened in Tskhinvali and what was planned in Abkhazia, they have the right to decide their fate themselves.

The presidents of South Ossetia and Abkhazia, basing (their arguments) on referendums and decisions by regional parliaments, have appealed to Russia asking it to recognise the state sovereignty of South Ossetia and Abkhazia. The Federation Council and the State Duma have voted in support of these appeals.

In the current situation it is necessary to make a decision. Taking into account the free will of the Ossetian and Abkhazian people, proceeding from provisions of the U.N Charter, the 1970 declaration on principles of international law referring to friendly relations between the states, the 1975 Helsinki Final Act of the conference on security and cooperation in Europe and other basic international documents, I have signed decrees on the recognition by the Russian Federation of the independence of South Ossetia and the independence of Abkhazia.

Russia calls on other states to follow its example. This is a difficult choice, but this is the only chance to save peoples' lives.

Turkish source http://www.hurriyet.com.tr/english/h...d=244&sz=50363

[North Pole]

Re: Georgian-South Ossetian conflict

Russia Threatens Retaliation Against Israel

Russia's President Dmitry Medvedev (C) and Prime Minister Vladimir Putin (4th L) sit at the State Security Council session at the presidential residence at the Black Sea resort of Sochi August 26, 2008. Russian President Dmitry Medvedev, defying U.S. pressure, said on Tuesday he had signed a decree recognising two rebel regions of Georgia as independent states.




MOSCOW — Russian security officials threatened retaliation against Israel for its weapons exports to Georgia including eight different aerial drones. Russian Deputy Chief of Staff Col. Gen. Anatoly Nogovitsyn said Israel supplied at least eight different models of unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) to Georgia. Nogovitsyn said Israel has also sold a range of weapons and sought to export main battle tanks to Georgia.
Russian diplomatic sources said the government of Prime Minister Vladimir Putin was furious over Israel's refusal to impose a military embargo on Georgia. The sources said Putin's aides had urged Israel several times to halt weapons exports.
"We asked Israel not to sell offensive weapons to a hostile neighboring state, but they said they're a sovereign state," a diplomatic source said.
"Well, Israel shouldn't be surprised if we sell offensive weapons to Israel's neighbors."
Already, Russia, in wake of its military victory over Georgia, has scheduled a summit with Syria to discuss offensive weapons sales, the sources said. Syrian President Bashar Assad was scheduled to meet Putin in Moscow on Aug. 20.

Tbilisi has asserted that Israel continued to ship weapons and platforms to Georgia throughout the Russian war. But Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili reported delays in the supply of Israeli unmanned aerial vehicles to his country.
"The Israeli weapons have proved very effective," Saakashvili told a news conference on Aug. 13.

So far, the diplomatic sources said, Putin has been careful to limit Russian military sales to Iran and Syria to defensive systems. In 2007, they said, Putin, who remains in charge of defense export policy, vetoed efforts by the Defense Ministry and the state-owned arms agency Rosoboronexport to sell the Iskander-E long-range rocket to Syria.
"Putin will now offer Iskander to Syria," another Russian source said. "Whether this will be a serious offer or something just to scare the Israelis we'll know in another few months."

In December 2007, Israel agreed not to sign new contracts for offensive weapons to Georgia. But the Israeli Defense Ministry, supported by the United States, maintained it would honor existing arms deals with Tbilisi.

"We told the Israelis that this was a very unwise move and that Russians were being killed because of Georgia's policy," the Russian source said. "They didn't take us seriously, probably because they were encouraged by the United States."

"In 2007, Israeli experts trained Georgian commandos in Georgia, and there were plans to supply heavy weaponry, electronic weapons, tanks and other arms at a later date," Nogovitsyn told a news conference on Aug. 19. "But the deal didn't work out."
Officials said Moscow's assertion was based on a review of weapons and military installations captured in Russia's invasion of Georgia. They said Israel also trained Georgia's military, particularly its special forces.
At the news conference, Nogovitsyn did not identify the Israeli UAVs. Israel has acknowledged the sale of UAVs to Tbilisi.
The Russian deputy chief said Israel also exported bombs, mines and mine-clearing systems to Georgia. He said the systems were comprised of munitions that could explode landmines.

In late 2007, Israel agreed to end the sale of offensive military systems to Georgia. The decision by the Israeli Defense Ministry did not affect weapons already ordered by Tbilisi.
On Aug. 20, Russia and Syria were scheduled to begin a two-day summit meant to focus on defense and military cooperation. Syrian President Bashar Assad was scheduled to meet Russian President Dmitri Medvedev and Prime Minister Vladimir Putin in what officials said could result in arms sales to Damascus.
"The significant military aid provided by Israel to Georgia in its war against Russia will affect in the future — probably in the near future — relations between Russia and Israel, as well as Russia's attitude toward Arab states," an unidentified Russian analyst said in an interview to Syrian state television on the eve of Assad's visit. "Russia will reassess its relations with Israel, and it is likely that Moscow will decide to increase its military aid to Arab countries in conflict with Israel, including Syria."

http://www.worldtribune.com/worldtribune/WTARC/2008/eu_russia0447_08_20.asp

Thanks to Israeli training, we're fending off Russia - xxxish Georgian Minister Temur Yakobshvili

Source - http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1010187.html

Temur Yakobshvili

It doesn't look good for you this time, Israel...

[North Pole]

Re: Georgian-South Ossetian conflict

TEXT - Medvedev's statement on S.Ossetia, Abkhazia
Russian President Dmitry Medvedev on Tuesday signed decrees recognising the independence of Georgia's breakaway regions of South Ossetia and Abkhazia.

Following is the Reuters translation of his statement, which was posted on the Kremlin web site at: http://www.kremlin.ru/appears/2008/0...4_205744.shtml


"Respected Russian citizens!

You without doubt know about the tragedy in South Ossetia. The night-time artillery attack of Tskhinvali by Georgian troops led to the deaths of hundreds of our peaceful citizens. Russian peacekeepers, who carried out their duty to defend women, children and elderly people to the end, died.

The Georgian leadership violated the U.N. Charter, their obligations under international treaties, ignored common sense, and launched a military conflict in which civilians became the victims. A similar fate awaited Abkhazia. Apparently, Tbilisi counted on a blitzkrieg, which would hand the world a fait accompli: the most inhumane means to achieve their goal of taking over South Ossetia at the price of exterminating a whole people.

This was not the first attempt. In 1991, Georgian President Gamsakhurdia gave the order to storm Sukhumi and Tskhinvali under the motto "Georgia for Georgians". Just think about these words. It was Russia which then stopped the extermination of the Abkhaz and Ossetian people. Our country has become a mediator and peacekeeper which was looking for a political settlement. But we always proceeded from a recognition of Georgia's territorial integrity.

The Georgian leadership has chosen a different path. Undermining talks, ignoring signed agreements, political and military provocations, attacks on peacekeepers - all this flagrantly violated the regime in the conflict zones established with the support of the United Nations and OSCE.

Russia has shown restraint and patience. We have more than once called for a return to the negotiating table and did not depart from our position even after the unilateral declaration of Kosovo's independence. But our insistent calls to the Georgian side to sign agreements on the non-use of force with Abkhazia against South Ossetia remained unanswered. Unfortunately, they were ignored by NATO and even by the United Nations.

It is clear now: a peaceful solution of the conflict was not part of Tbilisi's plans. The Georgian leadership has been methodically preparing for war, while political and material help from outside mentors only strengthened its feeling of impunity.

On the night of Aug. 8, 2008, Tbilisi made its choice. Saakashvili chose genocide to solve his political tasks. Thus he killed with his own hands all hopes for the peaceful coexistence of Ossetians, Abkhazians and Georgians in one state.

The peoples of South Ossetia and Abkhazia have more than once spoken out in referendums in support of the independence of their republics. We understand that after what had happened in Tskhinvali and what was planned in Abkhazia, they have the right to decide their fate themselves.

The presidents of South Ossetia and Abkhazia, basing (their arguments) on referendums and decisions by regional parliaments, have appealed to Russia asking it to recognise the state sovereignty of South Ossetia and Abkhazia. The Federation Council and the State Duma have voted in support of these appeals.

In the current situation it is necessary to make a decision. Taking into account the free will of the Ossetian and Abkhazian people, proceeding from provisions of the U.N Charter, the 1970 declaration on principles of international law referring to friendly relations between the states, the 1975 Helsinki Final Act of the conference on security and cooperation in Europe and other basic international documents, I have signed decrees on the recognition by the Russian Federation of the independence of South Ossetia and the independence of Abkhazia.

Russia calls on other states to follow its example. This is a difficult choice, but this is the only chance to save peoples' lives.

Turkish source http://www.hurriyet.com.tr/english/h...d=244&sz=50363

South Ossetia and Abkhazia Celebrate

http://www.spiegel.de/fotostrecke/fotostrecke-34620.html

[RSNATION]

Re: Georgian-South Ossetian conflict

August 26, 2008
*Calamity in the Name of Hegemony*
Is War With Russia on the Agenda?



By PAUL CRAIG ROBERTS


> Thinking about the massive failure of the US media to report truthfully is
> sobering. The United States, bristling with nuclear weapons and pursuing a
> policy of world hegemony, has a population that is kept in the dark--indeed
> brainwashed--about the most important and most dangerous events of our time.
>
> The power of the Israel Lobby is an important component of keeping Americans
> in the dark. Recently I watched a documentary that demonstrates the control
> that the Israel Lobby exercises over Americans' view of the
> Israeli-Palestinian conflict. The documentary is available
> here<http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article14055.htm>.
>
>
> As a result of the US media's one-sided coverage, few Americans are aware
> that for decades Israel has been ethnically cleansing Palestinians from
> their homes and lands under protection of America's veto in the United
> Nations. Instead, the dispossessed Palestinians are portrayed as mindless
> terrorists who attack innocent Israel.
>
> If one reads Israeli newspapers, such as Haaretz, or publications from
> Israeli organizations, such as the Israeli Committee Against House
> Demolitions, one gets a radically different view of the situation than the
> propagandistic version delivered by US media and evangelical pulpits.
>
> Most Americans know of the 2000 attack by Muslim terrorists on the USS Cole
> in Aden harbor that resulted in 17 dead and 39 wounded American sailors. But
> few have heard of Israel's 1967 attack on the USS Liberty that left 34
> American sailors dead and 174
> wounded<http://counterpunch.org/stclair06082007.html>.
> Pressured by the Israel Lobby, President Johnson ordered Admiral McCain,
> father of the Republican presidential nominee, to cover up the attack. To
> this day there never has been a congressional investigation.
>
> The failure of the American media is again evident in the coverage of the
> Georgian-Russian conflict. The US media presented the conflict as a Russian
> invasion of Georgia, whereas in actual fact the American and Israeli trained
> and equipped Georgian military launched a sneak attack to kill and to drive
> the Russian population out of South Ossetia, a separatist province.
>
> Russian peacekeepers, together with Georgian ones, had been stationed in
> South Ossetia since the early 1990s. On orders from Mikheil Saakashvili, the
> American puppet "president" of Georgia, the Georgian peacekeepers turned
> their weapons on the unsuspecting Russian peacekeepers and murdered them.
>
> This action by Saakashvili, elected with money from the neoconservative
> National Endowment for Democracy, an election-rigging tool of US hegemony,
> was a war crime. In truth, the Russians should have hung Saakashvili, as he
> is far more guilty than was Saddam Hussein. But it is Russia, not
> Saakashvili, that the US media has demonized.
>
> Americans have become perfect subjects for George Orwell's Big Brother. They
> sit stupidly in front of the TV news or the New York Times or Washington
> Post and absorb the lies fed to them. What is wrong with Americans? Why do
> they put up with it? Are Americans the nation of sheep that Judge Andrew P.
> Napolitano says they are? Americans flaunt "freedom and democracy" and live
> under a Ministry of Propaganda.
>
> Two decades ago, President Reagan reached agreement with Soviet president
> Mikhail Gorbachev to end the dangerous cold war. But every one of Reagan's
> successors has sought to pick a new fight with Russia. In violation of the
> agreement, NATO has been taken to Russia's borders, and the US is determined
> to put former constituent parts of Russia herself into NATO. In an effort to
> neutralize Russia's nuclear deterrent and compromise her independence, the
> US is putting anti-ballistic missile bases on Russia's borders.
>
> The gratuitously aggressive US military policy toward Russia will lead to
> nuclear war. I am confident that if Americans elect John McCain, or the
> Republicans steal another presidential election, there will be nuclear war
> in the second decade of the 21st century. The neocon lies, propaganda, macho
> flag-waving, and use of US foreign policy in the interests of a few
> military-security firms, oil companies, and Israel are all leading in that
> direction.
>
> The November election is perhaps the last chance to avoid nuclear war. But
> the opportunity might already have been missed. The Republicans have chosen
> as their candidate one of the most ignorant warmongers alive. The Democrats'
> choice was between one of the most divisive women in America and a man of
> mixed race with a funny name. Considering American's taste for war, the
> Democratic candidate could fail to defeat the GOP war candidate.
>
> Many Americans will vote against Obama because he is black. Why does mixed
> ancestry confer the black label? If America's population was predominantly
> black, would Obama be considered white?
>
> Race and propaganda are more likely to determine the outcome of the November
> election than any awareness or consideration of real issues by voters.
>
> The real issues are suffocated by the media. The American middle class is
> being destroyed by jobs offshoring and work visas for foreigners, while the
> incomes of the super rich are soaring. The US dollar's reserve currency
> status is eroded. The US is massively in debt at home and abroad. Health
> insurance is unaffordable for the vast majority of the population. Injured
> veterans are being nickeled and dimed, while Halliburton's profits escalate.
> Americans are losing their homes, while the US government bails out banks.
> Wars with Iran, Russia, and China are being planned in order to secure US
> hegemony.
>
> Americans no longer have a government that is for the people and by the
> people. They have a government for and by special interests and an insane
> ideology.
>
> But Americans have war, which lets them take out all their frustrations,
> resentments, and disappointments on "Muslim terrorists" and "Russian
> aggressors." Few Americans are disturbed that 1.25 million Iraqis and an
> unknown number of Afghans have died as a result of American invasions based
> on Bush regime lies and deceptions. Even Americans, like Senator Biden,
> Obama's selection for vice president, who understand that the wars are based
> on lies, still want the US to win. So, it was all a mistake and a deception,
> but let's win anyway and keep on killing.
>
> I know people who still complain that the US did not nuke North Vietnam.
> When I ask why Vietnam should have been nuked, they reply, "if we had nuked
> them we would have won."
>
> What would America have won? The answer is world loathing and the loss of
> the cold war.
>
> For many Americans, war is like a sports contest in which they take
> vicarious pleasure and cheer on their side to victory. Millions of Americans
> are still bitter that "the liberal media" and war protesters caused America
> to lose the Vietnam war, and they are determined that this won't happen
> again. These Americans have no realization that there was no more reason for
> the US to be fighting in Vietnam 40 years ago than to be fighting today in
> Iraq and Afghanistan or tomorrow in Iran.
>
> Obama, if elected, is no guarantee against nuclear war. Obama has shown that
> he is as much under the Israel Lobby's thumb as McCain. Obama's foreign
> affairs advisor, Zbigniew Brzezinski, is not a neocon, but he was born in
> Warsaw, Poland, and has the Pole's animosity toward Russia. The Bush
> administration has already changed US war doctrine to permit preemptive
> nuclear attack. With the US government determined to ring Russia with puppet
> states and military bases, war is inevitable.
>
> Presidential appointees face confirmation in the Senate. Any of Obama's
> appointees who might be out of step with plans for US and Israeli hegemony
> could expect opposition from large corporations and the Israel Lobby. There
> is no assurance that an Obama administration would not be positioned on "the
> issues" by the same special interests that have positioned the Bush
> administration.
>
> Americans are filled with hubris, not with knowledge. They have no awareness
> of the calamity that their government's pursuit of hegemony is bringing to
> themselves and to life on earth.
>
> *Paul Craig Roberts* was Assistant Secretary of the Treasury in the Reagan
> administration. He was Associate Editor of the Wall Street Journal editorial
> page and Contributing Editor of National Review. He is coauthor of The
> Tyranny of Good
> Intentions<http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0307396061/counterpunchmaga>.
> He can be reached at: [email protected]

[North Pole]

Re: Georgian-South Ossetian conflict

Why was Cheney aide in Georgia before the conflict?

Quote:

The LA Times reports that Joseph R. Wood, Vice President Cheney’s deputy assistant for national security affairs, “was in Georgia shortly before the war began.” James Gerstenzang wonders what Wood was doing there. Sergei Markov — a senior political scientist who is close to Vladimir Putin — claimed recently that the war was “part of a plot by Cheney” to help John McCain.

But media reports indicate that a “parade” of U.S. officials, including Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice, had warned Georgia President Mikheil Saakashvili not to instigate the conflict with Russia.

Source: http://thinkprogress.org/2008/08/26/...e-the-conflict


There is only one word to describe today's America, that word is FILTH.

[Anoush]

Re: Georgian-South Ossetian conflict

It's a sheer shame that all around they play a game of hard core dirty politics. Not taking into any account the lives of innocent people.

I think if women were in control, countries would have less provocation and or wars.

I think Armenia should be first to recognize Abxazia and S. Osetia. Btw; I think first Armenia then I hope Russia would recognize our Artsakh. Although Russia doesn't have the interest she has towards our Artsakh as opposed to Abxazia and S.Osetia; as they believe that those two states will eventually be under the Russian Federation.

[D3ADSY]

Re: Georgian-South Ossetian conflict

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgSvYtjzZt8

I haven't finished watching it completely but it's an interesting video.
Amazing how Anatoly Barankevich personally took out a Georgian tank.

Also an article from Military Photos forum:

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?t=140546

Armenian, do you post there?

[RSNATION]

Re: Georgian-South Ossetian conflict

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgSvYtjzZt8

I haven't finished watching it completely but it's an interesting video.
Amazing how Anatoly Barankevich personally took out a Georgian tank.

Also an article from Military Photos forum:

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?t=140546

Armenian, do you post there?

Excellent article. Good find D3ADSY

[Federate]

Re: Georgian-South Ossetian conflict

Expert of Mitk analytical center: "Armenia should recognize all the unrecognized states, including Kosovo and Northern Cyprus"

Armenia should recognize independence of the unrecognized states, considering the principle of non-application of double standards in the issue of the people's right for self determination", said expert of Mitk analytical center Edward Abramyan.

"Armenia has already witnessed recognition of independence of two self-declared states, which have much in common with Nagorno Karabakh. Taking into account the fact that 15 year consultations between Azerbaijan and Armenia have led to nothing, official Yerevan should start process of recognition of the self-declared "Nagorno Karabakh Republic" within its current borders.

After recognition of "Nagorno Karabakh Republic", official Yerevan should start an active process for gaining recognition of the self-declared "Nagorno Karabakh Republic" by different countries of the world", noted Abramyan stressing confidence that the large Armenian diaspora abroad will assist Armenia in this issue.

He also noted that considering the Caucasus solidarity, traditional ally relations with Russia and principle of non-application of double standards in the issue of the nations' right for self-determination, Armenia should recognize Abkhazia and South Ossetia, which will probably recognize the so-called "Nagorno Karabakh Republic", being already the recognized states.

He said in order to soften West's rage following Armenia's recognition of Abkhazia and South Ossetia, official Yerevan may also recognize independence of Kosovo.

"Moreover, in order not to worsen the tense external political situation between Armenia and Turkey, Yerevan can also recognize independence of Northern Cyprus, which may become a serious factor for Ankara's neutralization in the conflict with Azerbaijan", said Abramyan.

/Regnum/

Baboon source http://www.today.az/news/politics/47243.html