Muslims occupy Europe

[Army]

Re: Muslims occupy Europe

I do not see a problem here to accuse Muslims. It is not their fault if non-Muslim birthrates are low in Russia and Europe. I'm living among them as 'gegev' also knows; Turks, most of the Russian Muslims and European Muslims are not radicals with their religious beliefs.

So, as long as the Europe could provide them enough social and religious practice areas; with no supression; Muslim populations would not be a problem for many European states. Cause; Muslim population in Europe does not seek for 'independence' or 'union with Muslim world'. Their problems are mostly social and practical ones, which could be easily solved by law.

But as for Russia; since many of Muslims have their federative states; Muslim majority could be seen as a threat... but Putin's Russia is not USSR; Moscow already has close relationships with Islamic Conference; and some years ago, Muslims started to have positions as 'ministers'.

And I agree with KanadaHye, Capitalism is not a suitable system for Islam; that religion is more socialistic. So, rise of the Muslim population -if they would stay as 'real' Muslims, not the ones like Kuwaitians- could (see the defitinition: could) bring some more social balance too. However, they should be integrated first. But since most of them have been living in European states for generations; that could not be as hard as it was in 1950s.

And as for my opinion; I prefer Muslims to Chineses. No racism, just an opinion.

[gegev]

Re: Muslims occupy Europe

And now let's put away our fears and hate and look at it logical. Russia exists for I don't know a 1000 years(counting from Kiev) and there have been always living a large portion of Muslim in any different states. And till now they still haven't taken over Russia and why this would happen in the next 50 years?
And where did you get those numbers from from 19 till 50 in 40 years that's not going to happen.
And even if it happens(still not going to happen)look at Iran an Islamic country and close friend of Armenia. Look at Syria, Kazakhstan, ... Our enemies are not the Muslim people but the Turks.

Did I blame here any Islamic country or people for being Islamic? No! All the sources I referred to are expressing Europeans opinion.
Do the EU Christians have the right expressing their opinion by rejecting to become an Islamic country or they shouldn’t do anything because others can qualify it as religious hatred or racism?
Ridiculous.

Note please that in past regardless of the ethnographic proportion the Russian empire was ruled by the kings of Russian nationality. Now, you know, the “kings” are being elected, therefore the majority is able and, sure enough, will elect kings of his own religion. We have been oriented to Russia for centuries, because Russians are Christians and Islamic countries attacked Caucasus non-muslim countries to convert them into Islam and/or occupying their lands. Do you hate them for that? I don’t; earth is a competition stage where people/nations struggle to promote the ideas/concepts they believe.

The following is quoted from the: Source: http://www.asiantribune.com/index.php?q=node/211

Russia becoming a Muslim state!

Imagine Russia in 2050! According to Paul Goble, a specialist on ethnic minorities in the Russian Federation has predicted that within the next several decades, Russia will become a Muslim majority state. There is another bad news with fast decline in country population. This has already become a headache for Russian politicians and policy makers. President Vladimir Putin has called already for Russian women to have more children, because demographers predict that Russian population will fall from 143 million to 100 million by 2050. This situation has alarmed Russians as well Western leaders, more so because analysts estimate that Muslims will comprise the majority group in Russians population in few decades.

I do not see a problem here to accuse Muslims. ----- I'm living among them as 'gegev' also knows; Turks, most of the Russian Muslims and European Muslims are not radicals with their religious beliefs.
So, as long as the Europe could provide them enough social and religious practice areas; with no supression; Muslim populations would not be a problem for many European states. ----------- And as for my opinion; I prefer Muslims to Chineses. No racism, just an opinion.

I love my own religion – Christianity and being democrat doesn’t mean that one should love/accept all religions. I don’t want Islam or any other religion, except Christianity to become Armenian religion. I don’t like the Islam religion, as they don’t like other religions, and often in past declared Jihad “sacred war against non-believers (who are proponents of other religions)”, when they felt that their religious values are violated, because of religious differences among countries. There are values, you know, that oppose each other in Islamic and Christian and other religions. European Christians don’t like the Islamic religion expansion in Europe and current Christian European leaders hate it either and this is the main reason that France, Germany etc. are rejecting the idea of accepting Turkey in EU. Do you reject the Christian EU member country governments right to oppose the Islam-asation?

Does France violate Islamic values by prohibiting to use veil in schools and universities? According to Koran – yes! But according to French Christian values – No! Which rights should prevail in France now; when Christians are majority?
Who is the hunter and who is the prey?
Do you know?

[Haykakan]

Re: Muslims occupy Europe

There is no need to look at things in a either or (hunter vs prey) way. I personaly hate all the major religions but i live and deal with people of all faiths where i live. It is hard at times to accept each others presence but the reality is that we are all the same human beings and we pretty much want the same things in life. I remember when in Yerevan so many people made a huge deal about opening the masque for the Iranian community there while "Islamic Iran" has had and still has many churches for its chritian minorites including Armenians. People no matter their religion are still people and want basicly the same things in life. Islam is more of a socialist religion and judaism is more of a narcistic religion while christianity is somewhere in between but the people who belong to all these and other religions want the same things, to improve their lives and to give their childeren a better future. I like seeing blacks, muslims and other people in Armenia because diversity is a strength which Armenia very much lacks today. The fact that these people of diverse backgrounds come to Armenis is a sure sign that the country is developing and attracting immegrents, and i hope to be one of them when the time is right for my family..

[KarotheGreat]

Re: Muslims occupy Europe

Did I blame here any Islamic country or people for being Islamic? No! All the sources I referred to are expressing Europeans opinion.
Do the EU Christians have the right expressing their opinion by rejecting to become an Islamic country or they shouldn’t do anything because others can qualify it as religious hatred or racism?
Ridiculous.

Note please that in past regardless of the ethnographic proportion the Russian empire was ruled by the kings of Russian nationality. Now, you know, the “kings” are being elected, therefore the majority is able and, sure enough, will elect kings of his own religion. We have been oriented to Russia for centuries, because Russians are Christians and Islamic countries attacked Caucasus non-muslim countries to convert them into Islam and/or occupying their lands. Do you hate them for that? I don’t; earth is a competition stage where people/nations struggle to promote the ideas/concepts they believe.

The following is quoted from the: Source: http://www.asiantribune.com/index.php?q=node/211

Russia becoming a Muslim state!

Imagine Russia in 2050! According to Paul Goble, a specialist on ethnic minorities in the Russian Federation has predicted that within the next several decades, Russia will become a Muslim majority state. There is another bad news with fast decline in country population. This has already become a headache for Russian politicians and policy makers. President Vladimir Putin has called already for Russian women to have more children, because demographers predict that Russian population will fall from 143 million to 100 million by 2050. This situation has alarmed Russians as well Western leaders, more so because analysts estimate that Muslims will comprise the majority group in Russians population in few decades.

First I got a couple of questions for you.
Do you live in Europe?
How do you know this is the opinion of the 'Christian' Europeans?(most Europeans don't give a damn about religion)

First Russia will never become a Islamic state, let me tell you why. Look at who's ruling Russia and where the money is. It's in the hand of the Christians and xxxs. And do you really think that there is democracy in Russia(there is as much democracy in Russia as there is in Armenia.) And how will religion matter how Russia conducts it's business, decisions aren't made based on religion but what is the best choice to do.
And how do you there will be even a Russia 50 years from now. This is just fear mongering nothing more. And you are buying it, that's the worst part of it.

And you know why we are really orientated towards Russia for all those years? Religion hasn't got anything to do with it. They were the new power in the region who were ready to protect our people and now they are the one of the only allies we got. it has got nothing to do with religion. Politics has never had anything in common with religion.

[Haykakan]

Re: Muslims occupy Europe

First I got a couple of questions for you.
Do you live in Europe?
How do you know this is the opinion of the 'Christian' Europeans?(most Europeans don't give a damn about religion)

First Russia will never become a Islamic state, let me tell you why. Look at who's ruling Russia and where the money is. It's in the hand of the Christians and xxxs. And do you really think that there is democracy in Russia(there is as much democracy in Russia as there is in Armenia.) And how will religion matter how Russia conducts it's business, decisions aren't made based on religion but what is the best choice to do.
And how do you there will be even a Russia 50 years from now. This is just fear mongering nothing more. And you are buying it, that's the worst part of it.

And you know why we are really orientated towards Russia for all those years? Religion hasn't got anything to do with it. They were the new power in the region who were ready to protect our people and now they are the one of the only allies we got. it has got nothing to do with religion. Politics has never had anything in common with religion.

Well said Karo! I have been saying the same for a long time also but it hard for people to comprehend things when they are not black and white or christian and muslim or tom and jerry...

[Federate]

Re: Muslims occupy Europe

This reminds me of this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-3X5hIFXYU

[KanadaHye]

Re: Muslims occupy Europe

I really don't know how they define people as Muslim because I don't know many devout Muslims that practice their religion. They are descendants of Muslims and some even marry non-Muslims but unless they have a religious awakening later on in life, I don't think they would be classfied as Muslim. It's like saying if you're born in the US or Canada, you're automatically considered Christian even though you don't know the first thing about Christian history. These videos are nothing more than propaganda. The only part that is true is the projection of offspring and we Armenians need to get cracking!!

[Haykakan]

Re: Muslims occupy Europe

Turcks vastly outnumbered us but we still won kharabagh, hoards of arabs couldnt stop isreal....population numbers are meaningful but they are not everything. I agree with kanadahye we armenians need to get cracking. So far i got one but still workin on it.

[Army]

Re: Muslims occupy Europe

Russia's stiuation is different from EU. Those Muslims in Russia are natives, not immigrants.

[Army]

Re: Muslims occupy Europe

This reminds me of this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-3X5hIFXYU

That statistics are manipulated.

Here are the facts:

http://tinyfrog.wordpress.com/2009/05/03/muslim-demographics/