Turkey considering withdraw from the F-35 program

[lipton]

Re: Turkey considering withdraw from the F-35 program

Well being part of joint strike program was not AKP's idea and was not agreed by the current gov't. Now, let's do not deny the reality. I totally accept that Turkish military used to be the little puppy with a belt held by that particular J-power and the states, yes. You all should accept the reality that the defense industry of Turkey is continuously improving and more national defense systems are being built such as national artillery armored vehicles, armored personnel carriers, national tank, drones with surveillance and remotely controlled air to ground offensive systems, heat sensored and remote controlled all terrain compatible -minigun(or gattling cannon) and/or an infantryman riffle attached- robotic like palette powered so called robotics etc etc... What else could I say?
Not to be mean but we are comparing 50's soviet technology and a new born defense industry (finally breaking the chains). Iran is still technologically poor as Armenia. Making of couple of shahab rockets and a video showing "wow we have awesome rockets to hit Israel" isn't enough. Iran cannot be even a role model for Armenia.

You can't do that with the F-35, this why your leaders got their panties all bunched up.

Yes. Well partially right. But if they stop killing our engineers (and make it look like a suicide) that work on national source codes, it's possible.

Lets keep this thread clean and avoid giving us visuals.

Sorry for being kinky

I really hate to compare these two countries because it's impossible to compare them considering the economical-industrial power and military strength even though both countries are puppets of a big brother (or used to be).

[Eddo211]

Re: Turkey considering withdraw from the F-35 program

Naahh. Don't worry about the source codes. Turkey has a brand new road map for its defense industry.

it sure takes you guys a long time to learn something.I guess your generals are getting a hints from Iran's example. With the resources you have Armenia would have had a top reliant Defence Industry long time ago.....too bad your defense industry is being built like an assembly line with illusions of grandure with no critical "know how" other than what has been transfered by US and Israel defense companies so far.

Option 1 give me all the source codes. Option 2 I write my own source codes as I did with f16's.

You can't do that with the F-35, this why your leaders got their panties all bunched up.

Option 3 Screw ya'll westerners.

Such ingratitude to your masters...

I'll make love with Russia....Russia has one condition though: "I wan't you to flirt only with me".

Deal.

Lets keep this thread clean and avoid giving us visuals.

[lipton]

Re: Turkey considering withdraw from the F-35 program

Naahh. Don't worry about the source codes. Turkey has a brand new road map for its defense industry. Option 1 give me all the source codes. Option 2 I write my own source codes as I did with f16's. Option 3 Screw ya'll westerners. I'll make love with Russia. Guess what. Russia has been flirting ever since the AKP got the majority in the parliament and cease that particular "J" lobby in the military, media and the police. Russia has one condition though: "I wan't you to flirt only with me".
Deal.

[Eddo211]

Re: Turkey considering withdraw from the F-35 program

^^^No Migs for turkey.....you get F-35s with no source code no matter how much you cry about it. Also your top Turkish pilots will need to actually start relying on themselves insead of being babysitted every step of the way when in training with this jet.

[lipton]

Re: Turkey considering withdraw from the F-35 program

Sorry. Turkey is going for new generation MIGS and for the purchases they ask Russians to remove recognition of armenian genocide before 2020 from their constitution.

Another rumor says in return of building the nuclear plants Turkey is asking Russians to establish a harder visa policy on Armenia.

[Eddo211]

Source: Turkey fined US company over chopper delay

Turkey has demanded an extra Sikorsky S-70B from the American company Sikorsky Aircraft for not delivering previously ordered choppers on time.

The Undersecretariat for the Defense Industry (SSM) had previously ordered 24 Sikorsky S-70B Seahawk medium transport/utility helicopters from the US-based aircraft manufacturer Sikorsky Aircraft in 2005. Sikorsky had delivered seven of the ordered helicopters but was not able deliver the remaining 17 choppers on time despite the fact that they had already been paid for by Turkey.

For the first time in history, Turkey has demanded one more Sikorsky S-70B helicopter from the company as a fine for not delivering the helicopters on time, a Ministry of Defense official told Today’s Zaman, speaking on the condition of anonymity. In this way, Turkey will receive 25 helicopters for the price of 24. Experts from the Ministry of Defense underlined this is the first time that Turkey has fined a US company. “Turkey’s position gets stronger over time,” the same source said.

The SSM had ordered the helicopters for the Turkish Naval Forces. Seven of the preordered choppers have been delivered so far, but the remaining 17 were supposed to be delivered to Turkey at the beginning of 2010. Sikorsky announced that there would be a three-month delay in the deliveries but still they were not able to deliver the choppers.

http://www.todayszaman.com/news-232914-source-turkey-fined-us-company-over-chopper-delay.html

Apparently after much tears Sikorsky has agreed to Turkish terms according to their website and will be giving an extra chopper for free.

[Eddo211]

Re: Turkey considering withdraw from the F-35 program

So far there is no alliance per say between Russia and Turkey and the cooperation is mainly in the economic, trade, and business sector (what is visible). Turkey’s European and Russian exports is dwarfed compared to their import of Russian natural gas. As of 2008 Russia has been the biggest trading partner and provider of energy for Turkey. It accounts for roughly two thirds of Turkey’s gas consumption, 50 percent of coal imports and 30 percent of its oil consumption.
Turkey is also seen by Russia as a possible hub for its energy exports. In August 2009, Russia and Turkey together with Italy agreed to begin preparations for the construction of the South Stream, a pipeline from Russia crossing the Black Sea to Europe. Also Russia is aware of the tensions between Turkey and USA in regards to defense spending and is ready to fill the void in the billions of dollars worth of military contracts that Turkey is waiving its cash around. Also Erdogan and Putin seem to like each other and both have bones with Georgia (Turkey has strong Abkhaz community, which has close ties with the separatist republic of Abkhazia).

Also Russia does not want to see NATO ships in the black Sea and Turkey normally takes Russian side on this. Also on Iran they both hold the same opinion that Iran is entitled to Nuclear energy but no way in hell to have Nuclear weapons. Both countries meet regularly with the Iranian President.

Now this relationship can grow in three ways as its analysed by politicans:

They could evolve into a natural gas axis with the current plans to build a Nuclear reactor in Turkey which would mean Turkey will be receiving 100 percent of their energy from Russia. However to think that Turkey would allow Russian bases would be naďve. That is one thing I can’t see Turkey doing regardless of the depth of their future alliance. Turkey wants to be independent as much as possible so it can be a major player and Russian bases in Turkey will hamper its influence in the region (which is what is all about)

The second possibility is the alliance of the butt hurts. Both countries have been treated as unequal in the West and international communities. Also Turkey has become very sensitive to Western pressure and likes to hide behind Russia’s veto power in UN Security Council. A war with Iran will certainly push Turkey and Russia in the same camp against Western policies on Iran.

The third is the alliance of the reject. This has to do with EU assertion and how Russia is telling Turks to give up on it just like they did back in 1990.


My opinion in this regard, knowing Turkish behavior, is that Turkey is using this perceived alliance with Russia as a tool to get what it wants from the west, something like a ultimatum. What Turks are saying to the West is that drop all preconditions on EU membership, follow our policies in regards to Iran and the region, and accept a more independent policy of Turkey even when it comes to bashing Israel…..or else find another way to move your troops and supplies in and out of Afghanistan and Iraq without our Airbase or flying in our airspace, and we be replacing you with the Russians so forget about bypassing Russia in your plans to bring energy to Europe.

[jameson]

Re: Turkey considering withdraw from the F-35 program

tell that to the racist, genocide denying government of turkey.

I am telling to them.. This kind of racist nonsenses cannot achieve anything..

[Mos]

Re: Turkey considering withdraw from the F-35 program

by the way your singnature is racist.. I do not know how mods allowed such signature..

tell that to the racist, genocide denying government of turkey.

[Mos]

Re: Turkey considering withdraw from the F-35 program

they will work close economically, like the US and China have been doing, but that is where it stops. In geo-political field they will still be fighting to get the Caucasus, and that is what matters. The Russian Iranian relationship is not as good as one would think, was it not last year that Russia refused selling Iran the S300?
And why should Russia betray Armenia to get better relationship with a power they can't control? Right now we are their only ally in the Caucasus, their last base in the Caucasus.
Think about this Turkey leaves NATO and tells the West to go and screw itself, and joins Russia and Iran in an alliance and Russia screws it's relationship with Armenia. Russia will lose its base in Armenia, Georgia still hates Russia. Why no invite America in Russias place? Having US Marines guarding the border now with their new enemy. What do you say about that?

Don't be so sure that relations won't intensify. All relations start economic remember that. Turkish leadership has also shown much solidarity to Iran recently with all the nuclear issues, and both government are becoming more and more close. From a Russian perspective, Turkey is 100 times more valuable than Armenia, no doubt about that. So if Turkey really does leave the West, gets ride of NATO, who knows it might host Russian military bases if the relations take that direction which they might. If US becomes enemies with Turks, I don't mind at all. The enemy of my enemy is my friend, doesn't matter who that friend is. Alliances change fast, Turkey is a growing economic power, and its positioning itself in a power dominant position in the greater middle east. Not that I like that, but evidently that's what is has been doing. Iran-Turkey relations are better than Iran-Armenia relations for that matter.