Cultural disappearance.

[Anonymouse]

There are 3 possible ways in which a people possessing culture can vanish.

First is through outright war and destruction of the population ( Genocide ) in which the people possessing that culture are destroyed.

Second is through massive immigration of different cultural groups or assimilation in which that group bearing that culture eventually is absorbed and depleted and thus giving birth to a new, different culture.

Third is through low birth rate eventually exhausting itself and causing the people who possess that culture to disappear through lack of numbers.

Which is currently plaguing Armenians?

I say this because in studying history of Europe from Late Antiquity to the Middle Ages, as well as Near Eastern History right now, such patterns are so evident during the Indo-European migrations and cultures that came and went. But then again this model is applicable to all cultural groups from the whole world.

[sSsflamesSs]

At first glance, I would have to say that the 2nd one is the primary cause for our dying culture. However, upon deeper thought, it is apparent that the cause is the combination of the 3, rather a chain reaction.

I'd elaborate more on it, but time is not my friend. I'm positive that someone else will come along to give an explanation.

[TJ]

3

[sSsflamesSs]

Originally posted by sSsflamesSs At first glance, I would have to say that the 2nd one is the primary cause for our dying culture. However, upon deeper thought, it is apparent that the cause is the combination of the 3, rather a chain reaction.

I'd elaborate more on it, but time is not my friend. I'm positive that someone else will come along to give an explanation.

Maybe I misinterpreted the meaning of the 2nd one, but I interpreted it as emigration (that should be obvious).

[ckBejug]

Ok, so we know that the first option is true in the most part because Armenians diminished in size as a result of the genocide. So we were left with a smaller population of peoples to carry on the race/culture...

The second one, sadly enough, is evident more and more every day as more and more Armenians out there neglect to learn the language, which is a major part of keeping the heritage/culture, etc. Also, more and more Armenians marry odars and thusmake a situation in which unless they instill the Armenianness in their children, their children are going to be less likely to keep the Armenian thing going...

The third one, I'm not so sure about. Armenians I have been around/ or known usually when they have children they have 2 or more, so there seems to be no immediate non-childbearing problem.

So I say #2, which we might argue was an indirect result of Armenians spreading to the diaspora in large large #'s as a result of the Genocide. (right??)

I say as people living outside of Armenia we have a fghting chance as long as we keep the language alive and learn it and make sure our descendants learn it. I think the quickest way to lose your culture starts with losss of the language....

[Lagonid]

I say every single armenian in this world should visit their country at least once in their lifetime...learn about the place and the everyday life....then think about moving there. Look at the jews, how come they became so powerful? The dream of a jew is to one day return to their country, how come we can't do it? I was there last summer...and let me tell you, it's not what i expected at all, the city (Yerevan) is beautiful, and one day or another, i am moving there, before turning 30.

[xBaron Dants]

I believe that the complacency of the Armenian Diaspora is the reason that puts Armenia "at risk" of disappearing. Many still live in the illusion that the armenian identity can be kept in melting pots such as the States. Even if they don't believe it, they use it as an excuse because, frankly, they don't really care about anything else other than the multiple "opportunities" that is offered to them in the States or whever they may live.

Had we been determined in our cause, we could've changed Armenia's fortune in a year, and all would be well. But we choose not to, and then complain about it.

My alltime favourite line is "We'll wait until things get better in Armenia before thinking about moving there". As if we had nothing to do in all of this.

I'll repeat it once more, repatriation is the only solution.

Of course, your point about the birthrate is also very true, as the birthrate is very low in Armenia. But that would also be fixed by repatriation, as more jobs would be created, and families would be able to have at least 2 children. We must remember that most armenians live in urban areas, and they therefore do not have any advantages of having more children, as people living in a rural environment would.

[patlajan]

Originally posted by Baron Dants I believe that the complacency of the Armenian Diaspora is the reason that puts Armenia "at risk" of disappearing. Many still live in the illusion that the armenian identity can be kept in melting pots such as the States. Even if they don't believe it, they use it as an excuse because, frankly, they don't really care about anything else other than the multiple "opportunities" that is offered to them in the States or whever they may live.

Had we been determined in our cause, we could've changed Armenia's fortune in a year, and all would be well. But we choose not to, and then complain about it.

My alltime favourite line is "We'll wait until things get better in Armenia before thinking about moving there". As if we had nothing to do in all of this.

I'll repeat it once more, repatriation is the only solution.

Of course, your point about the birthrate is also very true, as the birthrate is very low in Armenia. But that would also be fixed by repatriation, as more jobs would be created, and families would be able to have at least 2 children. We must remember that most armenians live in urban areas, and they therefore do not have any advantages of having more children, as people living in a rural environment would.

What about armos like me that weren't born in hayastan. I imagine I would have a very difficult time fitting in. Every aspect of my life from the way I talk to the way I relate to people and expectations at my job would have to start from scratch. I would stick out like a sore thumb. My gut tells me that the stanci wouldn't be so tolerent of my kind as the "melting pot" people. And don't put "opportunities" in quotation marks like it is a bad thing, you're the benefactor of such "opportunities".

[xBaron Dants]

Originally posted by patlajan What about armos like me that weren't born in hayastan. I imagine I would have a very difficult time fitting in. Every aspect of my life from the way I talk to the way I relate to people and expectations at my job would have to start from scratch. I would stick out like a sore thumb. My gut tells me that the stanci wouldn't be so tolerent of my kind as the "melting pot" people. And don't put "opportunities" in quotation marks like it is a bad thing, you're the benefactor of such "opportunities".

I'm also not born in Armenia. My parents aren't born in Armenia either. I fit right in. I met french-armenians who couldn't speak any armenian (although I hate that), and many of them also fit right in. I think Hayastantsis truly like diasporan armenians who come to Armenia, and even try to impress them at first, before realizing that they do not need to do so. So I would say that you would have no difficulty fitting in. Armenia is not much of a dramatic change. It's not like you'd have to change your way of clothing or whatever. You'd just have to speak more armenian, and that's not really something bad, is it?
About your job, this is how I think of it: Let's say you're an employee in a computer software company, and have saved up some money. In Armenia, you'd have the chance to start your own small business, and would be able to employ from 2 to 2000 people. Of course, production cost wouldn't be as big as they are here, so you'd save quite some money. Also, there are many industries that have not been quite developped, and that would be a gold mine for whoever acts first. This would give you a chance to prosper, and would provide jobs in Armenia, making our country that much richer, and that much stronger.

[xBaron Dants]

Originally posted by patlajan That's a resonable answer. I will digest this and get back to you. But off the top of my head instability (political, criminal, currpution and so on) is very bad for business. Altough the low production cost and labor argument did sway me. Which makes me think that apart from individuals, big business from abroad might be the first step, altough they prefer south america and asia and stay away from eastern europe or armenia for example because of the socialistic approach to things there.

Anyhow, corruption and and overall stability are the big hurdles.

PS- Are you sure you're 17, you're like a vunderkin or something. I didn't know didly squat when I was your age.

Well, I don't know what a vunderkin is...Fair enough?

Corruption is a good point, but massive repatriation will solve that as the few pricks we have on top do not have the guts to bother the diasporans who come to Armenia to invest, as in the end, it makes them look better. I am telling you, repatriating diasporans could become a force in Armenia, and could eventually clear out the corruption.

Big business would make sense, but not companies like Nike or whatever. I cringe at the thought of these people coming to Armenia. However, automobile companies, and other companies of the like have great advantages of coming to Armenia as production costs would be lower, there would be no way that a corrupt minister would mess with a company that big, and finally, armenians are educated and skilled people. As sad as it is, the janitor you see in a hotel probably has a masters degree in electric engineering.

But intil GM or Volkswagen notices this, 3000 small steps by "normal diasporans" (meaning the not overly rich ones, who could only afford to employ 5-10 people) could be just as big, if they are united. By united, I mean that there should be an association of all those small business owners that will defend each member from any corruption that might occur. Come on now, does this sound too far-fetched? I think it can be done, and it should be.