Evolution and Religion

[Anonymouse]

"Chlorophyll in plants and human hemoglobin differ in chemical makeup by one molecule. The difference being one magnesium molecule exchanged for one iron molecule."

Again, these are your exact words. Go back and see for yourself. You did not take this statement from the article. I have no idea where you took it from, but it is incorrect. All you have to do is admit that you were incorrect. Why is this so hard for you?

First loser started with 5 claims of what he says are my lies, now he is all but down to one, which he believes is his surest bet, after having to sadly abandon the other ones. You do realize that those are two totally different things I am referring to right? I still don't see why you are so desperate with trying to drag this non-issue. You not only misunderstood what I said in my sentence, you obviously yourself have no knowledge or idea of what you're talking about.

http://www.wheatgrass.com/book/chapter3.html

Obviously, the two structures are very similar. The most apparent difference between them is that the porphyrin ring of hemoglobin is built around iron (Fe), while the porphyrin ring of chlorophyll is built around magnesium (Mg).

[loseyourname]

See man, this is my problem with you. You say the only difference between the molecules is the placement of a magnesium atom in one, and the placement of an iron atom in the other. That isn't the only difference, although it is the most significant difference in the section you posted here. But you only posted a tiny portion of each molecule. You post things that are badly misleading and you never tell the whole story. The rest of the chlorophyll molecule is composed almost entirely of hydrogen and carbon, with a couple of oxygen atoms thrown in. It is composed mostly of methyl groups, whereas the hemoglobin molecule is composed of amino acids, which have primarily carboxylic acid and amine groups. Chlorophyll has no nitrogen whatsoever outside of that very small portion of the porphyrin ring, and it certainly has no acidic portions.

What you said, and you can see what you said, is that the molecule, the entire molecules, differed only in the placement of one atom. Clearly, that isn't the case. Even in the small portions of the molecules that you posted now, you can see that isn't the only difference. You made a mistake. It isn't a huge mistake, but it is a mistake. Even now when you have confirmed your own mistake, you still won't own up to it. Why Mousy? I don't understand why it is so difficult for you.

[loseyourname]

Here's a rough picture of the entire hemoglobin molecule.



This is most of the chlorophyll molecule. It has a couple more tails, but you get the idea. It's almost shaped like a sperm, nothing like hemoglobin.

This is from a health website:

Chlorophyll is NOT the same as Hemoglobin


Eating green vegetables is a very important part of staying healthy. Chlorophyll is the pigment in vegetables that makes them green and it is involved in transforming the sun's energy to energy that we can use for food.

We would be in sad shape if chlorophyll did not exist.

Hemoglobin is the molecule in our red blood cells that is responsible for binding oxygen and transferring it to our tissues.

Without hemoglobin we would be in equally sad shape, we are fortunate that both molecules exist.

In an effort to emphasize the importance of eating green foods, I frequently hear lecturers claim that the only difference between chlorophyll and hemoglobin is that chlorophyll has magnesium and hemoglobin has iron.

That makes a great story but it is simply not true. While both molecules share a porphyrin ring (see below), that is where the similarities end.

So, if you hear someone make this claim, realize that they have not done their homework and looked more carefully at the chemical structures of the two molecules.

This doesn't make eating green vegetables any less important, but it does call into question the accuracy of lecturers making such claims.

As you can see, he is saying the same thing as me. The porphyrin rings are similar, and that is it. The rest of the molecules, that is, most of the molecules, are nothing like each other.

[Anonymouse]

See man, this is my problem with you. You say the only difference between the molecules is the placement of a magnesium atom in one, and the placement of an iron atom in the other. That isn't the only difference, although it is the most significant difference in the section you posted here. But you only posted a tiny portion of each molecule. You post things that are badly misleading and you never tell the whole story. The rest of the chlorophyll molecule is composed almost entirely of hydrogen and carbon, with a couple of oxygen atoms thrown in. It is composed mostly of methyl groups, whereas the hemoglobin molecule is composed of amino acids, which have primarily carboxylic acid and amine groups. Chlorophyll has no nitrogen whatsoever outside of that very small portion of the porphyrin ring, and it certainly has no acidic portions.

What you said, and you can see what you said, is that the molecule, the entire molecules, differed only in the placement of one atom. Clearly, that isn't the case. Even in the small portions of the molecules that you posted now, you can see that isn't the only difference. You made a mistake. It isn't a huge mistake, but it is a mistake. Even now when you have confirmed your own mistake, you still won't own up to it. Why Mousy? I don't understand why it is so difficult for you.

Loser, what in the hell are you saying or attempting to say? I clarified my point, yet you are still on something which I have the faintest clue, nor care about. So now that I clarifed myself I am "only posting those things that are badly misleading and never tell the whole story." You have warped this discussion far from its intended purpose into something that even you don't know what it is, but yet just slap a bunch of information to make it look as if you're really onto something. It's not as complicated as you believe or act like. It's quite simple really, but the past 2 pages on this thread you have made me laff like none other.

[dusken]

Loser, what in the hell are you saying or attempting to say? I clarified my point, yet you are still on something which I have the faintest clue, nor care about. So now that I clarifed myself I am "only posting those things that are badly misleading and never tell the whole story." You have warped this discussion far from its intended purpose into something that even you don't know what it is, but yet just slap a bunch of information to make it look as if you're really onto something. It's not as complicated as you believe or act like. It's quite simple really, but the past 2 pages on this thread you have made me laff like none other.

That was a ridiculous post. If you think this conversation is unimportant you should have said long ago "forget the chlorophyll/hemoglobin thing." You went along with it as much as he did. And in this post you did not address the differences he pointed out. You clarified your mistake. That is all.

[sSsflamesSs]

This is from a health website:

Chlorophyll is NOT the same as Hemoglobin


Eating green vegetables is a very important part of staying healthy. Chlorophyll is the pigment in vegetables that makes them green and it is involved in transforming the sun's energy to energy that we can use for food.

We would be in sad shape if chlorophyll did not exist.

Hemoglobin is the molecule in our red blood cells that is responsible for binding oxygen and transferring it to our tissues.

Without hemoglobin we would be in equally sad shape, we are fortunate that both molecules exist.

In an effort to emphasize the importance of eating green foods, I frequently hear lecturers claim that the only difference between chlorophyll and hemoglobin is that chlorophyll has magnesium and hemoglobin has iron.

That makes a great story but it is simply not true. While both molecules share a porphyrin ring (see below), that is where the similarities end.

So, if you hear someone make this claim, realize that they have not done their homework and looked more carefully at the chemical structures of the two molecules.

This doesn't make eating green vegetables any less important, but it does call into question the accuracy of lecturers making such claims.

As you can see, he is saying the same thing as me. The porphyrin rings are similar, and that is it. The rest of the molecules, that is, most of the molecules, are nothing like each other.

Loser, please be kind enough to provide the URL address of this health website. You should be aware of proper citing techniques by now.

[sSsflamesSs]

I find this entire ordeal between you two quite humorous. Yes, I haven't been following up on the pages of arguments, but what is the relevance of the difference between chlorophyll and hemoglobin to the evolution discussion?

[dusken]

Anonymouse was trying to show that we are not descended from trees. It was truly brilliant.

[loseyourname]

Mousy, I'm glad that you clarified what you meant. It would just be nice if you would admit that you posted the wrong thing initially. Heck, you probably do that a lot. Maybe what you mean to say is actually correct, but you just state it wrong. The same with the way you initially tried to say that speciation had never been observed. It's hard to argue with you when every time you are shown to be wrong, you turn around and say that you really meant something else. I would appreciate it if you would do a better job of proofreading your posts in order to make sure that you are saying what you mean to say the first time, so that we needn't go through this drawn-out clarification process.

[Anonymouse]

I find this entire ordeal between you two quite humorous. Yes, I haven't been following up on the pages of arguments, but what is the relevance of the difference between chlorophyll and hemoglobin to the evolution discussion?

Since loser is threatened by me, he feels the only way he can somehow look over me, is by attempting to dub me a liar in a non-issue, which he apparently has made the focus of the thread.