Origins of the Armenian peoples

[Nimrod]

That was what had occurred. I am simply taking your little incomplete pieces of information and elaborating from there so we have a CLEAR idea (if Aramai was the first language according to records) as to WHOM or WHAT that language was or is to call it "influential" or not. Notice how I am taking FACTS nothing of this is my opinion. Meanwhile the rest of your borrow corrupt opinions. Anyway please proceed. Feel free to click on the sources to re-check if you are somewhat saying or doubting my prose.

During Roman rule, the Phoenician language died out and was replaced by Aramai.Aramai

http://csrd.lau.edu.lb/Publications/StudentReports/History%20of%20Lebanon.htm

[Nimrod]

Armenia=Sumeria

Put two and two together if you mistrust my information. Full proof that Armenians had tribes who were ethnically still ARMENIAN however each leader/ruler wanted their own prestige. Read for yourselves please.


One of the greatest legacies in the proud history of the Armenia nation is the Sumerian legacy. Sumerians were among the earliest Armenian settlers of subsequently Northern and later on Southern Mesopotamia. The Armen-Sumerian migration took place between the VI th and IV th millenniums B.C. The Armenians of Sumer established the first civilization in great cities such as Ar (Ur) and Uruk. The Armeno-Sumerian contribution to the world civilization is utmost important. The Sumerians among many other things invented world's first alphabet, which quickly spread to other lands and peoples. The Sumerians were also the ones who created the wheel and the chariot (the worlds oldest carts or pulling wagons were unearthed in the town of Lchashen in the Sevan basin of Armenia - the carts have remarkably been relatively well preserved and date back to 1800 B.C! making them the oldest in its kind ever discovered. which took the mobility and speedy transport to previously unequaled level. The Sumerians had a complex and advanced socio-economic culture that was not matched for centuries and even millenniums to come. The "Armenoid" Sumerians built monumental and colossal temples or ziggurats which symbolized the power and the glory of the Sumerian culture. The Sumerians in their quest for the best architectural types invented the arch, which became the focal point of traditional Armenian architecture for millenniums to come.

http://www.armenianhighland.com/architecture/chronicle411.html

[Nimrod]

What you need to know

What crucial evidence I have to prove Anonymouse wrong. Simply skim the websites if it is FACTS you wish to seek and you will see that my legitamate information clearly states the dates accurately identifying in correspondence with with events Anonymouse listed. All of his data is mismatched. Keep in mind this is all B.C.

THE EARLY HISTORY OF URARTU. The Urartians were related to the Hurrians( that is Armenians which I will prove later) and moved into the region sometime in the second millennium. In the time of Shalmeneser I (1275–1246), the region was divided into a number of small kingdoms and subsequently became tributary to the Assyrians. The Aramean invasions of the 11th century drove the Assyrians back to their homeland (See 1078–977), and at some point afterward the kingdom of Urartu was established around Lake Van, with its capital at Tushpa.
THE KINGDOM OF URARTU (VAN). Shalmeneser III defeated the first known king of Urartu, Aramu in 856. Sarduri I (c. 834) and Ishpuini (c. 822) also fought the Assyrians. Menua (c. 800) increased Urartian power, occupying the entire Armenian highland area, and built the walls and aqueduct of Tushpa. Argishti I (786–764) built the city of Erebuni as a royal capital. Sarduri II (764–735) reorganized the army along Assyrian lines and extended Urartian power as far as northern Syria. In 743, however, Tiglath-Pileser III defeated the Urartians and reestablished Assyrian control over north Syria. The Assyrians attacked Urartu itself in 735, annexed Urmia, and besieged Tushpa (unsuccessfully). In 714 Sargon II launched a carefully planned attack against Rusa I (735–714) and defeated the Urartian army. Although defeated by marauding Cimmerians in 707, Argishti II (714–685) kept the Assyrians at bay and built a number of new fortresses and irrigation works. Such projects were continued by his son Rusa II (685–645), who completed a new capital Rusahinili (Toprakkale). After the death of Rusa II, the Urartian kingdom declined. Sometime after 584, the Medes defeated King Rusa IV and destroyed Rusahinili.

[Nimrod]

I will now state specifically what our Armenian "ethnicity s tribes" are comprised of as far as these titles are concerned as well as the names of them. Keep in mind as to HOW they are transformed and WHY.

2000-1800 BC Sumerian clay tablets note migrating peoples from the West who lived with the tribes on the Armenian Plateau. These peoples would have been the migrating Indo-Europeans (including the war-like Hittites), for tablets record such expressions as "we came, we conquered and we captured" as their calling cards.


The second wave of Indo-European migration had begun, this time coming full circle back to the Armenian plateau. Thousands of years of development created distinct dialects and physical attributes, which further influenced the "mother tribes" in Armenia


(As one can see these tribes are all US as in ARMENIANS, glad we established that let's move on.)

There is a clay tablet written by the Hittites about 2000 BC (discovered in an excavation of the Hittite capital Hatusas--or Boghazkeui-- in N. Central Turkey), which first mentions a tribe of people called Haius, and said they were from the country of Haiassa-Aza. This was a predominant tribe in the region, vassals of the Hittite kingdom, and said to be a distinct Indo-European tribe that introduced its language and customs to neighboring tribes. The Haius were often in rebellion with the Hittites, and they were influential in spreading their culture eastwards, to the peoples on the Armenian plateau. In addition, the architectural and cultural influences of the Hittites were filtered into the region through Haiassa-Aza.

(now keep in mind this was alllllll wayyyyyyy before Assyrian power or Persian power et all Islamic reign.)

The combination of migrating with native Indo-Europeans was bound to create more than a little cross-fertilization of people, language and ideas, and within the next 1000 years several regional kingdoms using an Indo-European language emerged.

Tribes (or kingdoms, as they were called in historical accounts) in the area included the Mitanni (Southwest of Lake Van and by Lake Sevan), the Hurrian (Sevan), the Manah (around Lake Urmia) and the Diaukhi (around present day Erzurum).

Mitanni and Hurrian tribes were dominant on the Armenian Plateau until the mid 2nd millennium BC. Kurgans (burial mounds) from the 17th-16th centuries BC have been excavated near Vanadzor uncovering chased gold and silver cups and bronze weapons. Those from the following period (15th-14th cc. BC) at L'chashen and in a cemetery at Artik held Mitannian cylinder seals dating from the final phase of the Mitannian kingdom. After the destruction of Mitanni by the Hittites at the turn of the 15th-14th cc. BC, the tribes on the Armenian plateau were nominally under the control of the Hittites, which had begun to expand into Northern Syria. By the time the Hittite kingdom fell around 1200 BC, the ancestral Armenian tribes had forged powerful alliances and were considered a challenge to the northward expansion of the Assyrians, who became the primary power after the fall of Mitanni.

Another migration of Indo-Europeans began in the 12th c BC, at the time of the Trojan War. It concerns the eviction of Thraco-Phrygian tribes (called "foreign settlers") from their native lands by "the People of the Sea" (i.e. early Greeks, Minoans or Mycanaeans). The Thraco-Phrygian moved through the Euphrates into the Armenian Plateau. First inhabiting the land immediately East of the Trojan kingdom in Asia Minor, the Thraco-Phrygians settled on the Western edges of the Armenian plateau and intermingled with the Haiassa-Aza, further developing Indo-European language, culture and physical features.

One of these people's were the forebears of the Urartians, who spoke a distinct language, perhaps borrowed from Assyria and Babylon, but more likely from the Hittites or later Thraco-Phrygian tribes escaping the war at Troy.

Kept up with all this? If you have, then you begin to understand why it has been so hard to trace Armenia’s lineage in the region, and how--with all these tribes inhabiting the same land, more than a little cross-pollination occurred, creating a race of tribes which were all culturally related, sharing language and ethnic roots among them.

And frankly, even the Egyptians and Assyrians were pollinating like bees, being made up of several ethnic groups themselves. Cousins, the tribes in Armenia were still rivals for land and mineral resources, and a few rose to prominence. One of these tribes succeeded in uniting or conquering surrounding city-states into a single empire, which rivaled even the Assyrians and Hittites for power. They were called the Nairi and Urartians by the Assyrians. Let’s put this into perspective and mark ancestral Armenians continuously inhabiting the Armenian Plateau before and throughout the rise and fall of the Old and Middle Kingdoms in Egypt, the entire history of Minoan and Mycanaean cultures (ca 2200-1400 BC), the Indus civilization in present day Pakistan (ca. 2500-1500 BC), the first semi-mythical Hsia (ca 2000-1523 BC) and most of the Shang (1766-1027 BC) Dynasties in China. Greece and Rome are by now a gleam in historians' eyes

(there you have it folks all in a nutshell from the beginning to the end for you so start analyzing now.)

http://www.calstatela.edu/orgs/asa/main/ArmoHeritage/EarlyAges/earlyKingdoms.html

[Anonymouse]

You know I fail to see what youre rambling here is about, but to try to assert that "Armenians" have always had a fixed identity can claim descent upon on common ancestry, holds no bearing, since the people and definition of "Armenian" has changed over time.

I am tired of people trying to create history to conform to the present, where there wasn't any. As far as we know, the first "Armenian" dynasty we can claim as "Armenian" are the Orontids. Beyond that all things are just a guess so stop trying to appeal to imaginations and what ifs.

Now you can copy and paste websites all you want, but linguists will tell you that Urartians spoke a Caucasian language, and it differed from Armenian. Armenians borrowed many words from Urartians, and it is evident today, such as Aram, Ararat, Erebuni. In fact the names of the many Nakharar houses with the "uni" sounding can be traced back to Urartu.

You just can't seem to stomach the fact that "Armenians" aren't this "great race" that has stayed intact for millenias and can claim common ancestry from one fixed place. Sorry to burst your bubble.

[Anonymouse]

Re: Armenia=Sumeria

Originally posted by Nimrod Put two and two together if you mistrust my information. Full proof that Armenians had tribes who were ethnically still ARMENIAN however each leader/ruler wanted their own prestige. Read for yourselves please.


One of the greatest legacies in the proud history of the Armenia nation is the Sumerian legacy. Sumerians were among the earliest Armenian settlers of subsequently Northern and later on Southern Mesopotamia. The Armen-Sumerian migration took place between the VI th and IV th millenniums B.C. The Armenians of Sumer established the first civilization in great cities such as Ar (Ur) and Uruk. The Armeno-Sumerian contribution to the world civilization is utmost important. The Sumerians among many other things invented world's first alphabet, which quickly spread to other lands and peoples. The Sumerians were also the ones who created the wheel and the chariot (the worlds oldest carts or pulling wagons were unearthed in the town of Lchashen in the Sevan basin of Armenia - the carts have remarkably been relatively well preserved and date back to 1800 B.C! making them the oldest in its kind ever discovered. which took the mobility and speedy transport to previously unequaled level. The Sumerians had a complex and advanced socio-economic culture that was not matched for centuries and even millenniums to come. The "Armenoid" Sumerians built monumental and colossal temples or ziggurats which symbolized the power and the glory of the Sumerian culture. The Sumerians in their quest for the best architectural types invented the arch, which became the focal point of traditional Armenian architecture for millenniums to come.


http://www.armenianhighland.com/arch...onicle411.html

I was simply laffing at this. As if its not enough to create history in the Caucasus, we now somehow manage to tie in Armenians to Sumerians? And what evidence is offered in the link aside from unsubstantited assertions? Nothing.

Unsubstantiated assertions are simply unsubstantiated assertions. Maybe you should be a bit more objective and scholarly before coming to a discussion about history. You clearly came with the intent to rile things up accusing everyone else of having "opinions" while you alone carried the torch of the "facts". Listen, don't be immature here, if you are going to discuss, be objective and don't have any bias towards information or people that contradict what you say or believe.

[Nimrod]

Re: Re: Armenia=Sumeria

Originally posted by Anonymouse I was simply laffing at this. As if its not enough to create history in the Caucasus, we now somehow manage to tie in Armenians to Sumerians? And what evidence is offered in the link aside from unsubstantited assertions? Nothing.

Unsubstantiated assertions are simply unsubstantiated assertions. Maybe you should be a bit more objective and scholarly before coming to a discussion about history. You clearly came with the intent to rile things up accusing everyone else of having "opinions" while you alone carried the torch of the "facts". Listen, don't be immature here, if you are going to discuss, be objective and don't have any bias towards information or people that contradict what you say or believe.

If you are "laffing" at it then I guess from your Atheistic view everything there is comedic. You need to read from a non-secular view and read carefully because there is evidence. Sumerians are just people long back way before Egypt Assyria Babylonia Persia etc. They have said that Noah's ethnicity is Sumerian.

[PASAMONSTER]

wow

what a history lesson.

[whitelotus]

Originally posted by dtox LOL, how come some people hate the Turks, and some people don't? It's kind of odd, seeing as what they did to our race.

why should we hate them ? its just like the hatred they had for us, its rather hypocritical.

by hating turks, raping there woman, we are nothing better then a turk.

i for one, do not hate all turks. Because todays generation doesnt even know about the genocide, its not in there text books, the government covers it up from its own people.

did you know that the reason why many of our ancestores survived, was because many turkish families took us in and hid us from the soldiers and government ? They gave us shelter, protection , food and water.

If you want to hate someone, hate the generation of soldiers and the government who slaughtered us, not the newer generation who isnt responsible for anything

hate the government for the millions they spend campaining against the genocide ever happening, while its economy fails and people dont have electricity.

hate the government who denys us, rather then all turks. Its rather stupid to hate a whole group of people for the actions its dumb ancestors commited.

we should be more open minded about this, rather then infest in more hatred. It takes us no where but back, we should advance in this world, rather then sitting and xxxxxing about something that happened in our past. We should rise together, and try changing some things, getting genocide bills passed, getting into politics, into the media etc

armenians are so busy hating one another, that they never get anywhere in the world. we are not united, we are seperating into groups and one day, there will be no more of us left.

[sSsflamesSs]

Originally posted by whitelotus armenians are so busy hating one another, that they never get anywhere in the world. we are not united, we are seperating into groups and one day, there will be no more of us left.

DING! DING! DING!

The sooner most of us realize this, the more of a chance we have to survive.