Why couldn't Armenians....

[Palavra]

Re: Why couldn't Armenians....

But before we go on, realize that Turks only managed to create their empire due to the political weaknesses of Byzantine, Armenian, Persian and Middle Eastern powers... Turkish power rose during a time when the natives of Asia Minor, Mesopotamia and the Caucasus were exhausted from constant warfare that had lasted centuries, most of which was occurring within the Armenian Highlands... The natives of the region had more-or-less fought themselves to the point of utter exhaustion. Moreover, the relentless stream of barbarian Huns, Tatars, Seljuks, Turkmens, Mongols, Ottomans, etc., was simply too much for the region's highly cultured and civilized nations to check effectively.

It is not only armenians or greeks fought with each other. Infact Turks fought with each other too. And we constantly fought against a lot nations, persians, greeks chines and mongolians.

Specially at ottomans time, It is totally absurd to claim , Turks are powerful because They did not fight against others or They are united. All of anatolia was in war.. There were a lot turkish city states and they fought with each others.(Also lets does not forget, Turks fough against crusaders and mongols too.)

It is a cheap excuse..

It's no secret that barbarians fight better than highly cultured peoples. This has been one of the fundamental ailments of world history.

Nope. All big empires are built by nonbarbarians.. Roman empire, byzantium, egypty or persian empire. Which one was barbarian built? Show me some empires built by barbarians and survived 600 year..

To their credit, Turkic peoples, being uncivilized and uncultured at the time, were united enough, barbaric enough and hungry enough to persevere against their vastly more civilized but hopelessly disunited enemies. So, history has given you Turks the credit for being united and relentless - yet uncultured and barbaric...

haha you have realy no idea about Turkic people history do you? If we were united as you say, History would be totally different(Even biggest lost of Ottoman happened because of a turkic traitor.) Infact, Turks fight with each other at last 1000 year. Most probably much more than armenians..

You Turks will eventually loose some of your eastern provinces to the majority Kurds there. Wouldn't you rather just give the territory in question to us Armenians instead? When a Kurdish nation rises wouldn't you Turks want a powerful Armenia as a counterbalance in the region? What kind of neighbors would you like to have to your east, Kurds or Armenians?

Kurds(Like our ancestors decision. They helped kurds against armenians). They may fight against us but They will not show hate as much as you. Also, If you ask me both nations(armenians or kurds)are not realy a big danger for Turkey.


And I am not sure, Kurds will built their state.(Not because, They have not number or power but I think They prefer to stay with Turkey.)

Even kurds at north iraq seek for Turkey alliance and protection and without sea coast, They never will become a powerful state. In reality, They would need turkish support against iran or arabs..

[yerazhishda]

Re: Why couldn't Armenians....

Have you been to Europe recently?

Forget about Western Europe, it's a cesspool. Have you been to Eastern Europe lately?

[Sip]

Re: Why couldn't Armenians....

Your "line-based division"s will be around as long as humanity will be around.

Have you been to Europe recently?

[crusader1492]

Re: Why couldn't Armenians....

Ummmm note to Soy el Turco...... Armenians built pretty much everything Ottomans have to be proud of.....You can look up the Balyan family, Hamparsum Limonciyan, even your beloved Sinan was of christian origin which makes him either Greek or Armenian.

Turks don't build, they Infect..... Similiar to Bacteria really..... How much do Kurds contribute to Turkish society or history? Compare them with us?!? ARMENIANS ARE TURKEY.

Islam togethor? hahaha Sunnia vs. Shia?, Iranians would LOVE to see us whipe out Turks and Azeris.
Whos going to help Turkey? NATO? As in Greece ? HAHAHA

If turkey made one single f'ing step towards Armenia, Russia or Iran... You will get as$rammed by Kurds so hard, not to mention countered by any of the above three..... Leave Azeris to us, We'll leave you to the Kurds. Iran and Russia will just wait their opportunity to own you. Russians will cut your gas supplies so fast your xxxx will fall off before you even knew what happened, just like Iran did to you once in the middle of Winter! Even central Asian Turks are with Armenia! Oh and if Israel even attempted to aid Turkey, Arabs would seize that opportunity like a fat kid in a candy store.

Its a lonely world for a Turk isn't it?



Welcome to Anatolia Mother F*cker!

I'm starting to like you again. Stop playing with my emotions!

[truAnatolian]

Re: Why couldn't Armenians....

Ummmm note to Soy el Turco...... Armenians built pretty much everything Ottomans have to be proud of.....You can look up the Balyan family, Hamparsum Limonciyan, even your beloved Sinan was of christian origin which makes him either Greek or Armenian.

Turks don't build, they Infect..... Similiar to Bacteria really..... How much do Kurds contribute to Turkish society or history? Compare them with us?!? ARMENIANS ARE TURKEY.

Islam togethor? hahaha Sunnia vs. Shia?, Iranians would LOVE to see us whipe out Turks and Azeris.
Whos going to help Turkey? NATO? As in Greece ? HAHAHA

If turkey made one single f'ing step towards Armenia, Russia or Iran... You will get as$rammed by Kurds so hard, not to mention countered by any of the above three..... Leave Azeris to us, We'll leave you to the Kurds. Iran and Russia will just wait their opportunity to own you. Russians will cut your gas supplies so fast your xxxx will fall off before you even knew what happened, just like Iran did to you once in the middle of Winter! Even central Asian Turks are with Armenia! Oh and if Israel even attempted to aid Turkey, Arabs would seize that opportunity like a fat kid in a candy store.

Its a lonely world for a Turk isn't it?



Welcome to Anatolia Mother F*cker!

[Armenian]

Re: Why couldn't Armenians....

Territorial expansion and forming geographically confined empires is sooooo last millenia. The US is solid proof that this "geo-ethnic" fronting is as outdated as thinking God has anything to do with anything

Where do you get your deep wisdom from, Sip? Was it genetic or was it acquired? But seriously, what exactly are you basing your groundless/shallow theories on? The US is/was an "geo-ethnic" empire where WASPs ruled at the highest levels, and to some degree still do today. Some would argue, however, that WASP rule was relinquished to Jews during the 20th Century. Nevertheless, like all previous empires (Roman, Egyptian, Byzantine, Ottoman, Britain, Russian, etc) that were all initially based on a "geo-ethnic" realities, the US was forced into pluralism to grow. And like all previous empires that had to adopt pluralism to grow the US, as we know it, will eventually fall apart as well.

In the end, the Turks, Armenians, and Kurds are going to figure out how they fit in a 21st century model as opposed to trying to exercise the old line-based division that somehow everything on this side of the line is mine and everything on the other side is yours.

Your "line-based division"s will be around as long as humanity will be around.

[yerazhishda]

Re: Why couldn't Armenians....

Territorial expansion and forming geographically confined empires is sooooo last millenia. The US is solid proof that this "geo-ethnic" fronting is as outdated as thinking God has anything to do with anything

I think this is a very naive view of the geo-political landscape of the area and is obviously a very 'Western' viewpoint. Armenians, Kurds, Turks, Georgians plus the hundreds of different ethnic goups of the North Caucasus are divided along very strict ethnic lines. These distinctions have existed for hundreds, even thousands, of years and do not appear to be going away any time soon.

God forbid Armenia starts thinking like the US in terms of its' identity. We all see how that has worked out so far.

Ethnic unity is the only Armenians will be able to protect themselves from extinction in an area of oil-hungry, money-grubbing barbarians that would cut our throats if given the chance.

In the end, the Turks, Armenians, and Kurds are going to figure out how they fit in a 21st century model as opposed to trying to exercise the old line-based division that somehow everything on this side of the line is mine and everything on the other side is yours.

This is ignorant at best and anti-Armenian at worst. Are you suggesting that we give up our claims and God-given rights to Artsakh, Javakh, occupied Nakhchivan, and Western Armenia?

[jgk3]

Re: Why couldn't Armenians....

Might be a good point, in an era of chip technology and other forms of such vast perversion by digital technology into our lives, how human are we really? How far are we from becoming cyborgs?

If you want to hold onto the last millennial human state so that fighting for territory actually means anything anymore, you'd better start fighting the war that's been waged on you and your mind that alienates your consciousness from land itself.

[Sip]

Re: Why couldn't Armenians....

Territorial expansion and forming geographically confined empires is sooooo last millenia. The US is solid proof that this "geo-ethnic" fronting is as outdated as thinking God has anything to do with anything

In the end, the Turks, Armenians, and Kurds are going to figure out how they fit in a 21st century model as opposed to trying to exercise the old line-based division that somehow everything on this side of the line is mine and everything on the other side is yours.

[Anonymouse]

Re: Why couldn't Armenians....

Wow, you have a big mouth. perhaps more impressive than your tongue is your ability to believe your rhetoric.

So are you saying the sophistication of the Armenians was responsible for their inefficiency?

and they were "fiercely independent - yet fiercely disunited" does that mean they were too selfish, miserly and narrow to share their sophisticated talents and intelligence?

You seem to be proud of these characteristics and at the same time you attribute the cause of your defeat, setback and failure as a nation to these characterisitcs. If you're so proud of these characteristics and that they were clearly responsible for your failure and demise, then why are you crying about things like genocide, land and reparations?

Shouldn't you accept these grievances and inequities done against you as proof of your highly civilized talents, intelligence, skills, freedoms and culture?

So why are you crying?

You're right about one thing, namely, that I am a slave. And I am proud of being one.
By being slaves, we accomplished the Blue Mosque, the Fatih Mosque, the Süleymaniye Mosque, and converted many Orthodox churches, including the Hagia Sofia and many in Eastern Anatolia, into mosques. In fact, we were an Empire of Slaves. Our system of Devşirme was a slave system. We enslaved the non-muslim children and let them eventually succeed to high offices and put all our trust into them, that they ran The Empire - we let slaves from christian families run our empire.

We are slaves. We are slaves to God, the Almighty. Therefore we serve one another. I am not ashamed of being a slave.

P.S. To answer your question, as long as the lands are in the hands of Muslims, I am fine with a Kurdish state instead of an Armenian state. Though as Muslims, we are ordered by God to be together.

Ermeni, dine gelsene - kardeş olalim.

Although Armenian's post was a bit hurtful to you, he was making valid points without insulting you. So you have to watch your tone in your response and don't post in Turkish. Have you even read the rules?