Hemshin peoples

[Hye_Psycho]

Re: Hemshin peoples

the mere fact these people go by the name of "hamshen" and not "hye" makes the premise of this thread redundant

[jgk3]

Re: Hemshin peoples

Guys, They are our people now. Most of Hemsins fleed russia because of their religion. I am sure you will not love them with their religion.

Armanen You should increase, Motivation of your women for resettling. It would be realy difficult to find that 2 million people.

Do the muslim Hemshin consider themselves to be Turks?

[Palavra]

Re: Hemshin peoples

Yep. there is a very very small minority, Who dont. But They generally call themself as Turk.

[TomServo]

Re: Hemshin peoples

Yep. there is a very very small minority, Who dont.

But They generally call themself as Turk.

The Hemshin will continue to call themselves Hemshinli/Hemshin, just like the Cherkez will continue to call themselves Cherkez, no matter how much you wish they wouldn't. You don't have to bring up those Hemshin/Cherkez/Laz/Abkhaz or even Kurds who are happy to say that they are Turk. That is what occurs when your state has an assimilation policy. But where does that leave the non-assimilable?

Although of Armenian descent, the Hemshin are not hidden Armenians who are trying to embrace their "true identity," nor are they Turks. I'm not surprised at all that the majority call themselves Turks, since refusing to utter wise, old Kemalist quotes makes you an enemy of the [deep] state. Probably why the actual hidden Armenians keep a low profile and live as Muslims.

[jgk3]

Re: Hemshin peoples

In Turkey, there are such things as "nobodies". Though of Anatolian stock, they don't care to put forth some ethnic identity because it's been destroyed and forgotten by the rest of the world, and it has no status in Turkey.

One day, Turk identity might be shattered too, or lose its status. They might seek something else. All the better when it comes to the Hemshin. I hear that though they report themselves as Muslim, they aren't exactly adamant about it.

[Hye_Psycho]

Re: Hemshin peoples

The Hemshin will continue to call themselves Hemshinli/Hemshin, just like the Cherkez will continue to call themselves Cherkez, no matter how much you wish they wouldn't. You don't have to bring up those Hemshin/Cherkez/Laz/Abkhaz or even Kurds who are happy to say that they are Turk. That is what occurs when your state has an assimilation policy. But where does that leave the non-assimilable?

Although of Armenian descent, the Hemshin are not hidden Armenians who are trying to embrace their "true identity," nor are they Turks. I'm not surprised at all that the majority call themselves Turks, since refusing to utter wise, old Kemalist quotes makes you an enemy of the [deep] state. Probably why the actual hidden Armenians keep a low profile and live as Muslims.

Well said.
And that’s the beauty of the 'Turkish' identity. It is a purely cultural, almost metaphysical consciousness, which only survives through intense nationalism and aggressive fascist policy. In reality Turkey is perhaps one of the most cosmopolitan, multi-cultural states on earth, which the elite are trying to desperately stick together with chauvinist glue and a certain degree of Islamic fundamentalism. One day that glue will dry up and Turkey will be torn apart. I therefore don’t see their jingoism and nationalist policy as a sign of a formidable galvanised nation state, but rather a weak, easily exploited entity with a forced identity. .

One day, Turk identity might be shattered too, or lose its status. They might seek something else.

Right. A hundred years ago, today’s Popular nationalist phrases such as “ne mutlu turkum diyene” would essentially equate to ‘happy is the person who calls themselves a donkey/peasant/loser’

‘Turks’ didn’t want to be called Turks, only god knows what mutation they will manifest a century from now. The Hemshin will most likely be part of that framework. The Kurds will in all probability assimilate into a broader Anatolian/ “Anadolu” identify which the Turks will continue to manufacture.

[seruven]

Re: Hemshin peoples

Ok guys/gals, I guess you misunderstand this hidden Armenians thing (I'm not talking about Hemşin people). Of course, there are people in Anatolia who carry Armenian blood. But they are not Armenians in the classical sense. They are not Armenians from Armenian parents. Due to obvious reasons, they had, for example, Armenian grandmothers. Or another possibility is to have an Armenian grandfather who was survived 1915 and raised by Muslims as a Muslim. (I remember a famous nationalist journalist, Bekir Coşkun, mentioning Armenian identity of his stepgrandmother.)

Maybe I've told that before, I don't remember. I asked some of my friends if they heard anything about hidden-converted Armenians in their hometown. They told two such stories (one from Erzurum, and another from Gaziantep (Aintab). In both cases, they were more sticky to Turkish and Muslim identity than the local people.

I'm not telling this in order to provoke you, but instead let you know the real situation. Armanen shouldn't wait for 2 million hidden-Armenians living in Turkey and craving for an Armenian occupation.

Like it or not, but Turkey was rather successful in assimilating people (with the help of physical conditions). Of course, in today's information age, assimilation is not that possible.

As a note: I've never met a person from Hemşin or never met a person talking about Hemşin. Thus, I don't know their attitude towards Armenians and Turkish state.

[Palavra]

Re: Hemshin peoples

The Hemshin will continue to call themselves Hemshinli/Hemshin,

Please. You dont even know meaning of hemshinli. It means someone from hemshin. Hemshin is a town at Turkey. It is like artvinli. Someone from artvin.

Unlike, Cherkez, Hemshinli people do not see themself as another nation from turks..So comperation is bad.

By the way, They dont call themself as hemshin.

In Turkey, there are such things as "nobodies". Though of Anatolian stock, they don't care to put forth some ethnic identity because it's been destroyed and forgotten by the rest of the world, and it has no status in Turkey.

I am sure, noone in Turkey ever think their ancestors were hitits. Their identity already destroyed much more before Turkey or even ottomans..

You can say that There are people who dont care about identity but It is not true.

It was true at ottoman times. When nations are built acording to religion. Now, It is different. Turkish identity built over religion(islam.) at past but now, It is different thing than islam.

One day that glue will dry up and Turkey will be torn apart.

I want what you are drinking too. It looks like, Your drinking reason good dreams..

[Armanen]

Re: Hemshin peoples

I'd be skeptical of what the turks have to say about the hemshen. Do some of them identify as turks? absolutly, do others identify as only hemshen? yep, and do some see themselves as some kind of Armenian? that's also affirmative.

The point I was trying to make is that there are quite a number of people in occupied Western Armenia who still remember their Armenian orgins and would be easy to assimilate back into Armenianess.

[Hye_Psycho]

Re: Hemshin peoples

I want what you are drinking too. It looks like, Your drinking reason good dreams..

your the ichkichi here.. no state administration has lasted for ever. to think the flimsy Turkish state is somehow different is ludicrous. utan kopek