Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

[Artsakh]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

I am surprised that this time there was no diversion operation on the part of Azerbaijan on the frontline. Usually right before or during talks, they launch a small skirmish where a few people die.

they've learned their lesson the hard way, suffering many more casualties in response to their aggression each and every time.

[Mos]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Aliyev is frustrated. Besides the billions of dollars he steals for his own joy, the huge sums of money spent on supplying their military with modern weapons, doesn't have it's effect because Russia simply supplies Armenia with weapons for free. The peak oil has been reached, and from this year on, the revenues will be less and less, and in 2020 will be close to nothing. What then? I think deep inside he knows that the Aliyev regime will not lost long. He wants all or nothing, thus a war in the future is highly likely and that's the only thing we have to prepare for now.

If Aliyev runs out of petrol dollars, he will attack, because than he will have nothing to lose. Of course, NKR Army is well prepared, and NKR's defences are very strong. Military experts continue to say Armenia has having the best fighting force in S. Caucasus. We have the upper hand - even if Azerbaijan is good at PR and exaggeration.

[Tigranakert]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

If Aliyev runs out of petrol dollars, he will attack, because than he will have nothing to lose. Of course, NKR Army is well prepared, and NKR's defences are very strong. Military experts continue to say Armenia has having the best fighting force in S. Caucasus. We have the upper hand - even if Azerbaijan is good at PR and exaggeration.

That's why the only thing we need to focus on, is to make the defense lines extremely, extremely strong. If the world isn't in chaos just like it was when the first war broke out, it will be a far shorter war as other countries will interfere. And when they do, we'll need to make sure it is us who have gained lands. As far as Russia concerned, they don't want a defeated, smaller and weaker Armenia. It will be interesting what their position will be during a possible war... the West will be neutral or anti-Armenian. Russia will be neutral or pro-Armenian.

[HermanGerman]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Never before did I hear from a Western news agency state that it was Stalin who gave Karabakh to Azerbaijan, especially not from euronews.

I wonder why now...

Dont trust them, they are hypocrites. I will give you an actual example.
Look this video is a fresh one about the karabach issue: the english verison is objective

BUT now the same video in german- full of turkish lies. the lady says, quote:
" Since the beginning of the 19th century Karabach is largely populated by Armenians. After 1813 Persia had ceded this territory to Russia, Armenians emigrated from Persia. This christian population adhered to the Russians as a christian's protector[...] Muslim tribes has settle in Azerbaijan since the 8.th century." ....According to this "Lady" Armenians are invaders of former muslim land...what the f...

[ninetoyadome]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Azerbaijani Armed Forces continue to incur losses
In an automobile accident on the island died Pirallakhi designed Neftchala district officer of the armed forces of Azerbaijan Famil Mammadov Garden oglu. According to Voskanapat.info with reference to Azerbaijani media, Mammadov, born in 1986, died after an accident during transport to hospital.

Voskanapat.info recalls that Mammadov was the loss of 69 Azerbaijani Armed Forces in the current year.

Previous, 68th, the loss in the armed forces of Azerbaijan occurred on June 18, when soldiers Fikret Humbatov committed suicide.

Voskanapat.info

--------------------------------------
Azerbaijani officer was killed on the island in the Caspian Sea
Azerbaijani army officer was killed on the night of 24 to 25 June on the island Pirallahi, which is located 50 kilometers from Baku. As the Azerbaijani news agency "Trend", a soldier of the Azerbaijani army Famil Mammadov, born in 1986, received serious injuries in traffic accidents. He died on the way to the hospital № 3 Sabunchu district of Baku.

As the news, Mamedov was drafted into the army of Azerbaijan Neftchala region of the country. The report states that Mammadov was an officer, but his rank is not specified.

Recall that in the current year, the Azerbaijani Defense Ministry confirms death of 46 of its soldiers already. At least 15 of them were killed by their fellow soldiers, 8 killed in an accident, 7 committed suicide, six died due to illness, two were poisoned by carbon monoxide, two were killed in an avalanche, etc. At the same time, experts say, the actual loss of the Azerbaijani army is much higher losses are recognized by the Ministry of Defense of Azerbaijan.

/ Panorama.am /

[Vrej1915]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

And do not forget to thank Sultan Aliev for the favour.

Also the failure was during the negotiations for the “Status of Karabagh”, not liberated territories.
Logic would say you wouldn’t negotiate (fight) for status of Karabagh if the liberated territories were not in the bag (for the Azeri).

Yes I do agree.
Of course he is the best option we may dream of for the enemy.
And those inhabitants of Sumgait and Baku do deserve such a bright dynasty.
After all, it may not be a hasard, since his father was a kurd from Armenia, so in a way, he serves his ethnic keens, and country of origin

But anyway, this can't be any consolation for our shortcomings.
After all, one of these days, he may decide to abandon his post, and have some well earned retirement in his palace of London....

[Vrej1915]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

I Put this with shortenings, to avoid posting too much nonesense.
For the original version:

http://groong.usc.edu/news/msg379690.html

-----------------------


Trend News Agency, Baku, Azerbaijan
Distributed by McClatchy-Tribune Business News
June 23, 2011 Thursday


Assistant to Azerbaijani President: Economic potential, military power
and high morale-combat spirit of armed forces is guarantee of our
victories!

by P.Kesamanski, Trend News Agency, Baku, Azerbaijan

June 23--JUNE 23 / , Azerbaijan , Baku -- Trend interviewed Defense
Issues Assistant to Azerbaijani President, Lieutenant-General Vahid
Aliyev on the Day of the Armed Forces of Azerbaijan Republic-June 26

Trend: Mr. Aliyev, a year has passed since our last meeting and our
interview s prior to the Day of Azerbaijani Armed Forces have become a
tradition. I would like to congratulate you on the Day of the Armed
Forces of the Azerbaijan Republic and wish you all the best .

Aliyev: I would like to congratulate all veterans of the Armed Forces,
militaries, civil servants and all of those who have contributed and
still contribute to the building and development of the Azerbaijani
Armed Forces led by the Supreme Commander.

Q.: What changes have occurred in the Armed Forces over the past year?

A.: The Azerbaijani Armed Forces, which was restored in 1991 and began
to develop since 1993 thanks to the courage, authority and indomitable
will of National Leader Heydar Aliyev, is now developing under the
Supreme Commander's leadership in line with modern requirements and
recently adopted Military Doctrine. This also applies to armory and
combat training, army's provision and its moral component. This is
demonstrated in practice in joint exercises that you could observe,
and you will clearly witness of this in this year's parade. Over the
years, we have established the Armed Forces, within which every
soldier knows clearly what to do at the right time. We have much to be
proud of, I mean our Armed Forces. We are completely prepared to
liberate our occupied lands, and we improve our equipment and training
each day with a view to minimize our casualties during the
hostilities. All components of our Armed Forces -- Land Forces, Air
and Navy Forces, as well as other military units, such as Border
Guards, Interior Ministry's Interior Troops and Emergency Situations
Ministry's Civil Defense Troops, reached a qualitatively new and
higher level that is incomparable at least in our region.

Q.: What challenges do you see occurring in the development of the armed forces?

A.: There are no problems at the state level in building the armed
forces. We are able to meet the growing needs of the army. Some
problems occur in places by force of objective and subjective factors,
and this is also under the daily supervision of the Supreme Commander.
An operational response is given to what that requires a quick
respond, and certain issues take time . During the Novruz holiday, I
have traveled to the entire frontline zone, have been at the forefront
and, of course, along with other problems also inquired about the
militaries' problems upon the president's task. A program has been
developedbased on the package of reports, including mine, reports of
the defense ministry, field reports and others upon the Supreme
Leader's task with a view to address these problems.

Our goal is to minimize the problems at most and we are able to
accomplish this in practice. The deaths of soldiers are, of course,
the most painful subject and we aim to nullify the loss of personnel.
But overall, the general conclusion that I made on my trip to the
frontline zone is that your tranquility and your confidence in the
victories are in safe hands of our soldiers , sergeants, and officers.
I would like to once again assure the President and our citizens in
this.

I would like to touch on the media and coverage of events in the army.
One must understand that our army is an army of each citizen and the
army is over-political structure , and more responsible attitude
should be shown while covering the army events.

Q.: Mr. Aliyev , we are still receiving disturbing news from the front ...

A.: Unfortunately, yes we do ... [ ] and it is a direct consequence of
the fact that the aggressor is not punished. The aggressor is not
punished for the set of causes and it unties its hands, allows
continue provocations on the frontline of the parties ...

Q.: Issue of the withdrawal of snipers from the front caused a big stir...

A.: There was much ado about nothing. Actually, I should note that
they lack sophistication. The matter is not only proposal to remove
the snipers, but also other moments , which I would like to speak
about.

As for the withdrawal of snipers, I, with all due respect to those who
supported this visually

"beautiful" , but in fact opportunistic offer of Armenia , would tell
them the following: Armenia proposes to remove the snipers, and we
propose to remove troops . Which is better? Which one is peace-loving
? Which one is correct? Why gentlemen do not even put an equal sign
between the two proposals, but frankly support this -- I won't have
the heart to call it incomplete -- offer , forgetting about ours... ?

How is it -- let's remove the snipers ? It is completely unverifiable
, ridiculous offer. It seems that those, who offer it, do not care
what will kill people. If you get a bullet from the body , how to
determine whether it is a short of sniper or marksman? Or is it a
stray bullet ? Why not to remove the grenade launcher men ,
machinegunner or just shooters ?

All this ballyhoo over this "proposal " was calculated on that the
heads of international organizations that are responsible to support
any peace proposals will once again say in unison -- "Peace to the
world " . Yes, of course , "Peace to the world ", who would resist ...
But we must remember that , first, voicing of the "Peace to the world
" by an aggressor is no less sacrilegious than a serial rapist such as
Chikotillo would say "I love women" .

Secondly , the Armenian side with this "proposal" actually meant to
say less original -- let's remove the modern small arms from the
Azerbaijani side. But since to voice this is equal to make a spectacle
of itself, so they came up with a more " original" idea -- let's
remove the snipers.

We say concretely 'no' to Armenia's proposal to remove the modern
weapons from the frontline. Because they do not stop the aggression ,
they continue provocation due to impunity and they will further get
such answers that they have never dreamed of. Our President has very
accurately pointed out that Armenia will live in fear until the
Karabakh problem resolved. It's true. If you have noticed, one of
their first reactions about our victory at the "Eurovision", after ,
of course, all choler that they could not keep , was gladness that no
war will be at least a year... As they say -- no comment .

Summing up the issue of the withdrawal of snipers, I will remind old
oriental wisdom: No matter how many times to repeat "Halva, Halva,"
the mouth will not become sweeter. So, the withdrawal of snipers is to
say " halva", but our proposal -- to remove the troops of the
aggressor -- occupier -- means to eat halva finally.

........

They went to war and came to power in the wake of the war. So,
in fact, this power is the power of war. First, they killed
Azerbaijanis, and then could not resist the execution of their
citizens.

One should understand that the fact that our talks with those whose
hands are stained with the blood of our citizens, including children,
women and elderly -- is a huge compromise on our part.

Q.: Then, why we talk to them?

A.: I see mainly two reasons. First, our president deeply worries over
and feels a loss of each soldier keenly. Of everyone. It is clear that
more people will suffer with the beginning of open hostilities.
Negotiations, in any case, are better than the death of our young
guys. However, it is clear that this will not last forever. All the
more, the time goes the population shifts to more militant mood.
People are tired of waiting, hoping for a peaceful resolution to this
conflict. However, the war is the last option, and it is always
possible to resort to it, and Eurovision has nothing to do with it.
Especially, as I said we are constantly building up our armed forces
in accordance with modern requirements. The more we are preparing for
war, the stronger we are becoming.

Secondly, these are presidents "elected" by the Armenian people.
Legally or illegally it is their problem, but they are presidents, and
so we have to talk to them.

Q.: The Armenian side is not sitting on its hands ...a new airport has
been built.

A.: ( Laughs) All this fuss over the so- called "new" airport is just
a PR campaign .

Well, for a start, only a very unhealthy brain can call the old
Khojaly airport as a "new" after a renovation, a little retouch runway
and at the same time without making it better, safer , more powerful.
I would not like to delve deeply into this question about the
characteristics of the Khojaly airport, although I have something to
say ... [ ] Just take my word for it. This will not give them any
practicality or even steeper -- 'strategy' . This is likely an unsafe
airport. They even contrive to lump the blame of crashes , which they
would not avoid there , onto us.

Furthermore, even if the airport would give them some practicality in
terms of transfer of forces and means, then believe, that to put the
airport out of action is a matter of minutes with our equipment.

Finally on this topic. Everything that has been built there up to
date, even if it is unsafe airport, tomorrow -- is saving our money
that we will invest in the development of the Nagorno-Karabakh region
in any way.

So, we should rejoice at all that is being built at the expense of
other countries or through the annual "requisitions " of their
so-called "leaders" in Europe, the United States. It is a holy horror
... different kinds of beggars has been observed, but at this level --
it is extremely humiliating. They themselves sunk to this state and
also want to pull Karabakh into the abyss, but not so long ago it was
a booming, paradise land, where life was in full swing ... . Now even
none of their former "leaders" live there... I wonder whether this is
also our blame. So, they will not hand out back what was built by
those who "divorced" on their deceptions and donated something. All
that will remain to us and save our money .

Here is another deception, with which they want to " dilute" the whole
world, another sophistication -- the question of so-called "Armenian
genocide" . The same situation : Turkey says let's open the archives
and discuss, and they say no ... Why ? Because, they are wrong, and
they will be kept mentioning about it. If one is right, he/she does
not afraid of any debate , but they are afraid , and at all levels --
from the Armenian leadership to all sectors of the diaspora. It seems
as having lost that argument , they will lose sufficiency. Rather, it
is so , because they annually organize a show called "Armenian
genocide" in the calculation to earn dividends both materially, and
politically . It is im proper to watch how some foreign political
forces, sometimes forget about justice, morality and interests of
their countries and bow to the wishes of these pseudo- ideologues for
some interests .

They do not see the obvious fact that it was wartime, the Armenian
regular units, which were created by Tsarist Russia and Europeanallies
even had certain success at the front, but nobody would think of
calling it genocide of the Turks in the twilight of the Ottoman
Empire. No one thinks that those numbers of victims, which their
ideologists voice, just monstrous in its falsification, monstrous in
its purpose -- because they do PR on the human tragedy. It is
monstrous, simply because so many Armenians could not physically
reside there.

It touches, when they say their strong diaspora is the result of
"genocide" that forced them to disperse throughout the world ... [ ]
It touches when you begin to imagine that what events should have been
occurred that people crossed the oceans, continents and traveled from
Turkey to Argentina, Australia, USA, Canada, France ... Why is not
heard about the Armenians, who "survived" in Somalia and Nigeria ...
The desire to live well is a normal desire and no one blames for this,
but it is not normal to cover this with tragic events that occurred in
the history of Turkish and Armenian people during WWII.

There is an only worldwide recognized genocide -- the genocide against
the xxxs by the Nazi regime. Its superiority over other nations and
destruction of the xxxs was the policy of then government. But, there
is another genocide recognized by few -- the genocide committed by
Armenians against Turks. The same symptoms -- the superiority of its
nation over others and the destruction of the Turks. This is an
indisputable fact: the Armenian state implemented it in practice, not
only in relation to the Turks ... [ ] the events in the Ottoman Empire
during the WWI, tragic events of 1918 in Baku, Shamakhi, Guba,
Nakhchivan, Zangezur and up to the last an act of genocide in Khojaly
-- all these are flashy facts.

........

....

Q.: I do not want to end on a sour note ...

A.: Do not have to nowise. We do not live in current Armenia to be
pessimistic. Only short-sighted politicians may consider temporary
military success as a reason for optimism, but beg in the streets.
Their future ruins. Once they are cut off from all regional and
international communications, who will need this island on the land?
As for that they have taken for while, we will return in any case.
Definitely! Our army gives us every reason for optimism, we
confidently look at the future. Our country is fully developed
economically and politically, and socially. We know the tastes of
different kinds of victories, and I want to assure everyone that the
issue of a military victory over the aggressor, over those who is not
satisfied with the Western Azerbaijan, our Irevan, Uchmedzin, Zangezur
Zangebasar, Dereleyez, Goycha, Vedi, Gyumri and other lands, who now
raise hand on Karabakh is a matter of time. They follow the path that
leaves us no choice, but military operations. We are more than ready
to this, and the economic potential of Azerbaijan, its military power
and the high morale of the Azerbaijani Armed Forces' personnel is
guarantee of our victories.

[Mos]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

That's why the only thing we need to focus on, is to make the defense lines extremely, extremely strong. If the world isn't in chaos just like it was when the first war broke out, it will be a far shorter war as other countries will interfere. And when they do, we'll need to make sure it is us who have gained lands. As far as Russia concerned, they don't want a defeated, smaller and weaker Armenia. It will be interesting what their position will be during a possible war... the West will be neutral or anti-Armenian. Russia will be neutral or pro-Armenian.

There will be a lot of pressure on Azerbaijan by Russia, and especially the CSTO who is standing by our side militarily.

[Vrej1915]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

- We can never trust Russia, I do not remind history, just remember 2 chapters of last Artsakh war. We faced Russian soldiers twice, in Spring 1991 (Galtso/Ring) and in June 1992 (loss of Northern Artsakh). Russia armed first the azeris, then only gave us the balance, but in the middle, thousands had to sacrifice their lives or villages...
- It is Mr Medvedev that is pushing us in a mess, and he is a Gaz-boy, close to energy circles.
- It is Russia who sells the S-300, the Mi 28/35, the Nona howitzers, etc... even the Smerches, the Mig 29, etc... since at the end of the day, without russian spare parts, they are built on, ..... and even, neither Ukraine or Belarus can sell that easily Russian arms, of that quality, without Russian blessing.
- It is Russia who is trying a 'honey moon' with Turkey....
- Russia's actual policy is all but trustworthy.
- Russia proved so often anti Russian by its behaviour, let alone its allies.... when it came to our region, that we must NEVER trust Russia.

I do not say that the west is necessarily better, but let's never forget, RUSSIA is behaving right now, as a formidable jiiiiiirk.

[Mos]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

- We can never trust Russia, I do not remind history, just remember 2 chapters of last Artsakh war. We faced Russian soldiers twice, in Spring 1991 (Galtso/Ring) and in June 1992 (loss of Northern Artsakh). Russia armed first the azeris, then only gave us the balance, but in the middle, thousands had to sacrifice their lives or villages...
- It is Mr Medvedev that is pushing us in a mess, and he is a Gaz-boy, close to energy circles.
- It is Russia who sells the S-300, the Mi 28/35, the Nona howitzers, etc... even the Smerches, the Mig 29, etc... since at the end of the day, without russian spare parts, they are built on, ..... and even, neither Ukraine or Belarus can sell that easily Russian arms, of that quality, without Russian blessing.
- It is Russia who is trying a 'honey moon' with Turkey....
- Russia's actual policy is all but trustworthy.
- Russia proved so often anti Russian by its behaviour, let alone its allies.... when it came to our region, that we must NEVER trust Russia.

I do not say that the west is necessarily better, but let's never forget, RUSSIA is behaving right now, as a formidable jiiiiiirk.

So you suggest we just be all alone?? Russia is the best friend we got given the options, nothing is perfect.