The Future of Armenia and Armenians

[Darorinag]

The reason why we are doomed is because our priorities are screwed up, if not non-existant. The "elite" of our community find it their number one priority to open a new arachnortaran, as the other one is related to the "other" Armenians. Our school principals and "hokapartsoo"s seem to be more pre-occupied with whatever stupid prestige they have, instead of the future generation of Armenians, and our goosagtsagan leaders also seem more pre-occupied with their endless atorakriv, and the amounts of money they can accumulate, and how many politicians' hands they can shake.

Exactly.

and this is not a result, as Dan said, of a lack of sources. I don't buy that argument. I can name you at least 10 armenian news sites off the top of my head right now.

Hey Baron, I was just making a comparison. fact is, the ratio of Armenian news sources compared to world politics sources is 1:1000 if not more. But of course, anyone who is interested in the situation would find a news source, that is not a valid excuse, you're right. but it is a fact that it's easier to look at world politics than Armenian politics. again, that is not an excuse, because we as Armenians should be more concerned with Armenian politics than world politics. But heck, i've tried to look at some Armenian news websites before, and some of them are slowwwwww, the ones based in Armenia anyway. yes yes, I am guilty of being more into the holocaust discussions, etc., but I am trying to build on that and learn more about the Armenian genocide. My main interests do not lie in politics, although I do want to know what's going on in Armenia.

Dan, what can I say? Armenians in Armenia are in no situation to offer us any assistance, and we don't really need any assistance. But trust me, they DO care. Many told me that they were afraid that all those Armenians in LA and Canada, yevayln, risk losing their identity, and they should all move back as we are all brothers and sisters, yevayln.

No, Baron, I'm not talking about any form of material/physical assistance.. but maybe moral/emotional assistance is beyond their ability too. I don't know. My apologies for making that assumption then.

But I must add - aren't those in Armenia contributing to the disappearance of Armenians (in the diaspora)? I'm referring to the hundreds (if not thousands) of Armenians who immigrate to L.A. every year... From what I was told, is it safe to assume that it is not the arevmedahyes that are predominantly destroying our culture in the diaspora, but the immigrant arevelahyes? Just take a look at Lebanon. Armenians have kept their culture, language, everything in Lebanon, despite Arab influence and despite Muslim pressures. Ditto more or less for Toronto Armenians (although not comparable to Lebanese Armenians). The reason I'm saying this is because the majority of Toronto Armenians are arevmedahyes. A lot of the L.A. Armenians are arevelahyes, and I think the main problem in the diaspora is in L.A. Correct?

I must say that I blame the diasporans as much as I blame the newcomers from Armenia who add to the diaspora in numbers and who work against it eventually.

[Anonymouse]

Baron you hit the nail on the head, however, this thread and the example of Tigran whining shouldn't be somehow broadened to include the whole Armenian status just because two argue. Everyone argues in every people. This is silly. If only Tigran would be a little less emotional, a little more cordial, and himself a little more educated while demanding others of the same thing. That is all. As far as you deleting them, I leave that up to your discretion.

[xBaron Dants]

Baron you hit the nail on the head, however, this thread and the example of Tigran whining shouldn't be somehow broadened to include the whole Armenian status just because two argue. Everyone argues in every people. This is silly. If only Tigran would be a little less emotional, a little more cordial, and himself a little more educated while demanding others of the same thing. That is all. As far as you deleting them, I leave that up to your discretion.

Of course everyone argues in every people. I just found it ironic that silly arguments are largely responsible for the danger our diaspora is in today, and even the conversation about the danger our diaspora is in today resulted into silly arguments.

As for Tigran, his initial post did not contain any insults. He raised a point (which I found to be very valid), and it escalated from there. If emotions are high today, it is very understandable. I'm having a hard time keeping myself from going crazy over what happened last night in Yerevan.

[dstyle]

I can see why Tigran is frustrated, but I think the average poster on the site cares more than the average Armenian youth living in the diaspora today. It is sad that every Armenian (not only youth) does not care about there people or there nation, but it should be our job as "concerned" youth to have them care. I hope that made sense because I didn't get any sleep last night, and I think I'm starting to get dillusional.

[HyeJinx1984]

I love Southern California because it's sort of considered the toliet of the Armenian Diaspora and happens to be where I was born and raised. We're just thugs and rabiz criminals out here with no love for our traditions and morals. However even out here were most Armenians see a sad state of things, I gotta say, we're more prideful and defensive about our people than those in the "high class."

[leo007]

I love Southern California because it's sort of considered the toliet of the Armenian Diaspora and happens to be where I was born and raised. We're just thugs and rabiz criminals out here with no love for our traditions and morals. However even out here were most Armenians see a sad state of things, I gotta say, we're more prideful and defensive about our people than those in the "high class."

I gotta say that I really haven't seen too much pride shown by Armenians in Southern California. There were a lot of people out on April 24th showing the cared what happened to Armenians, but for the most part a lot of Armenians couldn't care less. For example, I said to one guy that I was going to be marching in Little Armenia and he thought I was joking and wouldn't beleive me until he finally realized I wasn't joking at all. His reply was "it's just a waste of time". That's just one example, there were many, many more that didn't care at all.
Not only that, but the a good amount of Armenians here don't care about each other and just like to stereotype "other" types of Armenians.

The one thing that really pisses me off is when Armenian parents speak English with their kids. It's the most annoying thing. If the parents of these kids don't even reinforce speaking the Armenian language with their kids, then who the hell will?

[HyeJinx1984]

I knew about the march also and didn't go because it's my belief that protests are usually bullxxxx and no one pays attention. I didn't see the protest being shown on CNN or even local news that day. I'm going out there in the hot ass wheather to do what? show other Armenians that I know about the Genocide? Come on... being proud is not the same thing as demonstrating. I hate Bush and the current american administration with a passion but I've never been a rally on a set day.. instead I TALK to people EVERY day about my beliefs (granted, if it's appropriate to talk about it at that time) and the same goes for being Armenian and all that comes with it amd I've probably educated more non Armenians on the subject than any Rally will.

As for stereotyping, don't even get me started... we as a people are the most stereotyping mutha f*ckas out there, and we all know it's not just Cali Armenians playing the "Barskahav" game. Check out the joke about the pots in hell... and I hate reffering to it as a joke since it's more of a wake up call and that we should be changing and evolving as a people. Hayastansis hating baskahyes, hating bairuitsis, hating bagdadis, hating every other goddamn nationality out there. It's not a Cali thing, that's just an Armo thing.

And since we're on the topic of the stereo typing, I'm waiting for the "return to Armenia" movement so when we all get there we won't be stereotyping based on country anymore, it'll be by city... all the Glendale Armenians will be on one side of Yerevan, all the Pasadena Armenians will be on one side, all the Hollywood armos will be on another... that's gonna be funny.

[leo007]

I knew about the march also and didn't go because it's my belief that protests are usually bullxxxx and no one pays attention. I didn't see the protest being shown on CNN or even local news that day. I'm going out there in the hot ass wheather to do what? show other Armenians that I know about the Genocide? Come on... being proud is not the same thing as demonstrating. I hate Bush and the current american administration with a passion but I've never been a rally on a set day.. instead I TALK to people EVERY day about my beliefs (granted, if it's appropriate to talk about it at that time) and the same goes for being Armenian and all that comes with it amd I've probably educated more non Armenians on the subject than any Rally will.

I understand why some people would not want to go to a demonstration, but I also feel that demonstrations are important. Those who don't know about the genocide start getting curious and asking why all these people are protesting. When asked, they are told about the genocide and that educates a good amount of these non-Armenians that would not know of the genocide otherwise. At the very least it shows that Armenians haven't forgotton and are willing to go out and protest. If they didn't do anything, what would that achieve?
And the people I was talking about in the previous post didn't care about the genocide at all, that's what got me pissed. They are not the ones that would educate other people about the genocide if given a chance. Not only do they not care about the genocide, they don't care about anything else that has anything to do with Armenians, they just want to live their own lives and dont' care about culture, traditions, etc....

[HyeJinx1984]

And the people I was talking about in the previous post didn't care about the genocide at all, that's what got me pissed. They are not the ones that would educate other people about the genocide if given a chance. Not only do they not care about the genocide, they don't care about anything else that has anything to do with Armenians, they just want to live their own lives and dont' care about culture, traditions, etc....

Yea, f*ck them. Those people certainly don't represent the majority of California Armenians.

[Crimson Glow]

At the very least it shows that Armenians haven't forgotton and are willing to go out and protest. If they didn't do anything, what would that achieve?

The same thing demonstrating would achieve? Seriously, I have to agree with Hyejinx. I'm not saying don't care about it, but the only thing we're doing is demonstrating to other Armenians that we know of the genocide. That isn't exactly doing much for the cause, either. I'd much rather take Hyejinx's approach of being on the lookout for opportunities to educate people who aren't aware 365 days a year.

Where I live, NO one has heard of Armenians, and I mean NO one! You guys in South Cali wouldn't understand what it's like. I've NEVER heard another person outside my family speak Armenian, or talk about them as a people. It's amazing I know as much of the language as I do. I can't read or write it (though I still remember the alphabet, don't ask me how), and there are some words I see mentioned on the forum that I don't understand, but in general, I don't think I'd have trouble conversing with someone in Armenian. At times, I feel disappointed and sad that I don't know more, but at other times, I think about where I live, and am amazed I can speak it at all. I can probably count on one hand (thanks to my 6 fingers) the number of Armenians I've come across in this general region, and other than the family that just opened Raffi's Restaurant, NON of them could speak it.

It's sort of hard to educate people on the genocide when they haven't even heard of the victims of said genocide. Typical conversation when people learn my name:

"What nationality is that?"
"Armenian"
"Romanian??" - after a momentary pause, thinking they didn't hear you right.
"No, Armenian"
"Albanian?" - after another pause.
"NO, ARMENIAN, YOU CULTURALLY ILLITERATE xxxx!"

This is very common throughout the US. Not very many places in America have the type of Armenian community that you guys in Cali have. That being said, I've educated a LOT of people on Armenians, as well as the genocide. There isn't much I can do here on April 24th other than wear my Armenian flag pin on my "We Will Never Forgive, We Will Never Forget" t-shirt my grandma in Glendale sent me long ago. That gets quite a few people's curiosity going. My boss at the job I've been at for 8 years has learned quite a bit from me. He was shocked to learn that we were the first Christian nation (as he is extremely religious), and of what the Turks did to us. He cracks me up when he comes up to me with stories of who he used his knowledge on. Like when he got in some debate about how great Turkey is (I forget the reason why) with his father-in-law, who is a big politics buff, and my Boss drilled into him the story of what they did. "What about the fact that......" He said the dad just stammered and didn't know what to say because he wasn't aware of it. Or when, this last Christmas season, he was at church asking the Pastor something about January 6th (my memory isn't serving me well at this moment), and the Pastor wasn't sure of the answer, and started mumbling something about "the epiphany". My boss goes "Oh, is that why Armenians celebrate Christmas on that day"? (he already knew the answer, but wanted to grill the Pastor for not knowing more about the original Christian nation). The Pastor goes "uuhhh, ummm, yyeeaahh...."

And then I have had countless friends who have taken more and more interest in the culture. One buddy is always e-mailing me various Armenian related things that he finds on the net, like "Useful Armenian Swear Words". He even called this place in Chicago called Hye Bar, trying to find out if it's Armenian. Unfortunately, the word hye apparently means "head of beer" to the Irish. And he did some search from his work place for my last name, and called me later that day to say "Did you know there are only 3 families in America with your name? One in California (that would be my Grandma), one in Connecticut (have no idea who that is), and then you guys in Illinois. You better get on it if you plan on keeping the name alive, son!" Yeah, he's psycho like that.

Well, looking back on all this, I'd say I've done more by spreading the word on an everyday basis, then a protest in a region where what you're protesting about is pretty well known already.

More on this when I get back....