Liberation of Western Armenia

[Siamanto]

Re: Liberation of Western Armenia

When I first posted this thread I knew for sure that it would draw out the "lets all hug each other and live in peace" freaks.

The type represented by this Ari as well as Sip, tunot, winoman and the occasional non-Armenian like Catman who wants to tell us what to do, have always been the ones who have held us back in the past. And this type in question will be a serious obstacle for us in the future. None of them understand what we are discussing anyway, they just have this warped dream that if we simply roll over and play dead the world will be a much better place to live in.

In the up-coming war to liberate western Armenia these people will only be useful for mine clearing operations



I vividly remeber the years 1989-1991 when Ramkavars, Polsahais, Amerikahais, etc, were attacking Dashnaktsakans for sending money, volunteers and suppies to our azatamardiks in Artsakh. I recall a filthy Polsahai from New York once telling me - "you people (The ARF) casued the Armenian Genocide in 1915 now you are trying to cause another one."

I was like

And a well educated 20 something Amerikahai was once yelling at me with tears in his eyes that enough Armenians had died throughout history and that we don't need another war. I told him - DUDE, we did not start the war, they are depopulating Armenian villages, they are killing Armenian civilians, we have to fight back!

He said something to the effect of - "killing begets killing."

I was like

I have now come to the wise conclusion that there is no point in discussing anything with these types. We Armenians simply need to learn how to ignore these low-lives in our communities and continue doing what is best for the future of our nation.

When I come across these types of so-called Armenians now -

I'm like

I understand your criticism of some members of this forum and how detrimental can be - and has been - their "agenda" to the interests of Armenians; however, I would distinguish their continuous and consistent struggle - during the last 8+ years on several Armenian and *urkish forums - to intentionally obstruct and weaken the legitimate fight for our ancestral rights,
from the often genuinely sincere concerns or fears expressed by politically unaware and "simplistic" members of the Armenian Community.

Also, I'm not affiliated to any political organization, but I would like to remind - for the record - that the ARF does not have the monopoly of Hay Tad - and I'm aware that you did not say it. Furthermore, I regret to say that during many decades the ARF overtly opposed - and threatened in some cases - Armenian individuals, organizations and activities - political or militaristic such as the ASALA - that aimed at reviving the Hay Tad. Personally, I believe that those individuals, organizations and activities had a catalytic role and gave a new life to the Hay Tad. It's only just and fair to recognize it.



Note: I have chosen to auto censor the words "*urk," "*urkish" or *urkic" because it is commonly perceived as unpleasant and offending, evokes unpleasant emotions and imagery and is pregnant with immoral and evil connotations!

[Կարմիր Բ]

Re: Liberation of Western Armenia

First we will kick the cancerous mafia, and not only, that is destroying our country like leaches, those who are responsible for the fact that Armenians are leaving our country en mass and those who are turning our women into prostitutes. Once we teach an unforgettable lesson to the internal enemies, we will do the rest.

[Artsakh]

Re: Liberation of Western Armenia

Friday 4, August 2006

Another Azeri Soldier Killed Near Karabakh

AFP

An Azerbaijani soldier has been killed by fire from ethnic Armenian forces near the disputed Nagorno-Karabakh region, the defense ministry in Baku said Friday.

The 20-year-old, Babek Mirzaliyev, died Thursday on the Azerbaijani side of a ceasefire line that has been in place since a temporary accord was reached between Baku and Yerevan over the disputed region in 1994.

Armenia and Azerbaijan fought a six-year war over the Armenian-majority enclave of Nagorno-Karabakh, which seceded from Soviet Azerbaijan in the late 1980s. The conflict claimed 25,000 lives and displaced hundreds of thousands of people, ending in the 1994 ceasefire.

Tensions have remained high and incidents occur regularly, with the Armenian controlled region's status still unresolved.

[Artsakh]

Re: Liberation of Western Armenia

Winning the war or not, this highlights how devastating air power is.
I never want to see Armenia suffer like Lebanon currently is and that is my whole basis for arguing what I am arguing.

Ah, but to the contrary. It is whenever armenians have bowed their heads in obedience that we haced suffered FAR WORSE THAN "lebanon currently is".

History has shown that whenever we have stood up for ourselves, we have always won. Wheneven we have bowed our heads in allegiance, we have been raped, slaughtered, maimed, burnt, and nearly annihilated.

Need i remind you, it is turkey that is currently waging an act of war against armenia with its blockade. The turk will never change their ways, and you are naieve to think so otherwise.

[Artsakh]

Re: Liberation of Western Armenia

The only Mig-29's in Armenia are at the Russian 102nd base at Gyumri, there is not a single Mig-29 with an Armenian roundel, except in some people's heads.

According to "Eksport Vooruzheniy" journal of Moscow, published in 1997, figures were shown that the Armenian armed forces had (back then) 5 Su 25's, one Mig 25, and 13 Mig 29's. THEN, it says "IN ADDITION" the 426th squadron of the Russian air force with 20 MiG 29's fighters stationed in Armenia.

There are many un-publicized figures of what armenia has and doesn't have. Armenia is bound by the CATE agreement, which places limits on the quanity of arms it posseses. But Karabakh is not bound by it. Therefore, armenia can simply transfer more and more arms into karabakh, and still not violate its quota on arms.

[Artsakh]

Re: Liberation of Western Armenia

Howitzers are field artillery. They fire up, at high angles, and deliver fire which arcs down at targets kilometres away. It is funny because someone who previously said "I think you've got much research to do before you present yourself as being some military analyst" is talking to me about howtizers shooting aircraft down.
It's downright hilarious.

DOUGNUT, i know what howtizers are and what their function is, and have observed Armenian howitzers in action, so there's no need for you to teach me.

The point I was trying to make which your small mind wasn't able to grasp was that Armenians are primarily ground and mountain fighters, damn efficient ones too, and can make due without a modern, uptodate air force consiting of American and European planes.

The purpose of simple hand guns and Kalashnikovs isn't to bring down or go against tanks either. But our brave boys with just these were able to go face to face with tanks, capture it, and use it against the enemy themselves.

As a matter of fact, there is such a tank on Display as a trophy, if you ever go there 1 day.

[D3ADSY]

Re: Liberation of Western Armenia

Otto3, I know what they are saying and I am simply saying I do not agree.

[skhara]

Re: Liberation of Western Armenia

and artsakh without air support ground forces especially mechanized units will be in trouble so you must choose between being brave and dumb

Air support is necessary in modern war in offensive operations.

[Otto3]

Re: Liberation of Western Armenia

d3adsy these guys are just saying that when a fight occurs between turkey and some other country(s) armenia must be ready for action while turkey is busy with the others... thats kinda realistic i think....

and artsakh without air support ground forces especially mechanized units will be in trouble so you must choose between being brave and dumb and being coward... and the guns that shoot down planes called flak guns or AA but AA missiles are better because others dont have much chance of shooting planes

[D3ADSY]

Re: Liberation of Western Armenia

Dogfights do not take place between helicopters and jets.

I said air war, not dogfights.

KNOWN OPERATORS:

Algeria, Al Quwwat al Jawwawiya al Jaza'eriya (Algerian Air Force)
Angola, Força Aérea Popular de Angola (Angolan People's Air Force)
Armenia (Armenian Air Force)
Belarus, Voyenno Vozdushnyye Sily (Belarus Air Force)
Bulgaria, Bulgarski Voenno Vozdushni Sili (Bulgarian Air Defense Force Military Aviation)
Croatia, Hrvatske Zracne Snage (Croatian Air Force)

http://www.aerospaceweb.org/aircraft/fighter/mig29/

The only Mig-29's in Armenia are at the Russian 102nd base at Gyumri, there is not a single Mig-29 with an Armenian roundel, except in some people's heads.

a dumb comment. Armenian howittzers have proven themselves as being effiecient instruments. What is so funny?

Howitzers are field artillery. They fire up, at high angles, and deliver fire which arcs down at targets kilometres away. It is funny because someone who previously said "I think you've got much research to do before you present yourself as being some military analyst" is talking to me about howtizers shooting aircraft down.
It's downright hilarious.

well, lets take the current conflict in lebanon into account. Obviously, the Israelis hardly were "capable of winning the war" with their air superiority. Destroying buildings, roads and bridges and killing civilians is hardly winning a war.

Winning the war or not, this highlights how devastating air power is.
I never want to see Armenia suffer like Lebanon currently is and that is my whole basis for arguing what I am arguing.

Our "border" with Turkey has always been a front. I didn't say Armenia has the resources to launch an invasion of turkey, but it in terms of defense, and not offense, Armenian forces are capable of getting the job done. Being able to defend yourself is one thing, and lauching an offense is another.

Whilst we have, historically, been great at defending what we have, I don't think anyone really believes Armenia could repel a Turkish and Azeri attack at the same time.
However, the issue here, the original point of this thread, is not about defensive but offensive actions.