Armenian-Turkish Relations

[Joseph]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

Let's hope you are right and I am very very wrong, but I have this felling in my gut that nothing good will come of this.

I'm wary of this development because usually when the Turks do something seemingly decent, normal and magnanimous, there are huge strings attached. They'll use this solely as a public relations device, they are doing something that should have been normally done 18 years ago and they'll expect congratulations for it, you know, for doing something routine and normal and the US and EU will oblige them.

[Haykakan]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

I think the fact that kharabagh is not mentioned in this agreement is a huge win for the Armenian side and is being overlooked by those crying doom n gloom on our side.

[Jos]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

Needless to say this agreements going to be hard sell for both the Armenian and Turkish ruling goverments. It will be especially tough balancing all the weight of expectations from public opinion let alone all the competing interests from vested parties like Russia, Azerbaijan, US, EU, diaspora etc.

[Joseph]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

I think the fact that kharabagh is not mentioned in this agreement is a huge win for the Armenian side and is being overlooked by those crying doom n gloom on our side.

The Turkish Foreign Minister has already retreated. "Turkish Foreign Minister Ahmet Davutoglu said, however, that opening the border was out of the question for now. "A longer process is required for that," he was quoted by Turkey's NTV television station as saying Monday."

They are trying to tie the border to the an Azeri-Armenian agreement.

[Jos]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

The Turkish Foreign Minister has already retreated. "Turkish Foreign Minister Ahmet Davutoglu said, however, that opening the border was out of the question for now. "A longer process is required for that," he was quoted by Turkey's NTV television station as saying Monday."

They are trying to tie the border to the an Azeri-Armenian agreement.

That could just be a bit of political manoeuvring to buy some time to minimize the fallout with Azerbaijan I think. The agreement will definitely be a political hot potato that will require time to digest before being fully implemented. Quite astonishly however, some Armenians are already calling for the head of President Sargsyan and FM Edward Nalbandian, it will no different for their Turkish counterparts.

[Joseph]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

That could just be a bit of political manoeuvring to buy some time to minimize the fallout with Azerbaijan I think. The agreement will definitely be a political hot potato that will require time to digest before being fully implemented. Quite astonishly however, some Armenians are already calling for the head of President Sargsyan and FM Edward Nalbandian, it will no different for their Turkish counterparts.

Indeed. Everyone I know is calling for their heads. I think Sargisian and Nalbandian will go down as they probably should and it is going to happen quite soon. Armenians rightly fear that they will sell out the Armenians in Artsakh. They are have been repeatedly outmanouvered by Turkey, US and Israel. Establishing diplomatic relations is one thing, but acquiescing to the Turks in Azerbaijan is anathema. The Turkish fight is about pride while for Armenia it is survival.

[Haykakan]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

This document as is, is a win for Armenia. wether it is accepted by the turcks or not is another question, but if it is not then we are back to square one again. Both sides have to play to domestic public opinions. I am not saying this is a fair document at all but it is the best we could have realisticly hoped for i think.

[Jos]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

Indeed. Everyone I know is calling for their heads. I think Sargisian and Nalbandian will go down as they probably should and it is going to happen quite soon. Armenians rightly fear that they will sell out the Armenians in Artsakh. They are have been repeatedly outmanouvered by Turkey, US and Israel. Establishing diplomatic relations is one thing, but acquiescing to the Turks in Azerbaijan is anathema. The Turkish fight is about pride while for Armenia it is survival.

Yes Josef but are you suggesting the document will negatively impact Armenian's survival? I don't see how.

If anything, hopefully it should improve and facilitate the security, trade and transport concerns of Armenia. Nowhere can I see the demand to withdraw from Karabagh or acquiescing on genocide recogntion. Perhaps a bit optimistic but the part of implementing a dialogue on the historical dimension might even allow Turkish politicians an avenue for formal genocide recognition without committing electoral suicide.

[ninetoyadome]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

Turkey refuses to open Armenian border now: Davutoglu
10:06 / 09/01/2009


Commenting on the Aug. 31 statement on a “start of internal political consultations” made under Swiss mediation, Turkish Foreign Minister Ahmet Davutoglu said that opening of the border with Armenia is out of question for Turkey now.

“Turkey aims to keep best relations with its neighbors and establish stability and peace in the Caucasus,” Davudoglu told NTV, Monday. He also pointed out that: “A longer process is required for that.”

Turkish Foreign Minister assured that Ankara would “guard” Azerbaijan’s interests at every step of normalization of relations with Armenia.

Ankara has closed Armenian Border in 1993. Turkey is imposing a number of conditions for normalization of Armenia-Turkey relations. Among them are Armenia’s reversal of its policy on international recognition of Armenian Genocide, and unilateral concessions in Karabakh issue resolution.

As NEWS.am informed earlier, late on August 31, the Swiss Federal Department of Foreign Affairs and Foreign Ministries of Armenia and Turkey issued a press releases which says: “The Republic of Armenia and the Republic of Turkey have agreed to start their internal political consultations on two protocols – the ‘Protocol on the establishment of diplomatic relations’ and the ‘Protocol on the development of bilateral relations’ – which have been initiated in the course of their efforts under Swiss mediation.

The two Protocols provide for a framework for the normalization of their bilateral relations within a reasonable timeframe. The political consultations will be completed within six weeks, following which the two Protocols will be signed and submitted to the respective Parliaments for the ratification on each side. Both sides will make their best efforts for the timely progression of the ratification in line with their constitutional and legal procedures.

The normalization of bilateral relations will contribute to the regional peace and stability. The Republic of Armenia and the Republic of Turkey are committed are pursuing their joint efforts with the assistance of Switzerland,” the document reads.

http://news.am/en/news/3442.html

[Gavur]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

I disagree with any idea that credits Turkey outmaneuvering Armenia. Turkey is just doing what they are told ( and so is Armenia) by the unified west (including Russia).Since this (Turkish) government is a true opposition, they are entrusted with confidence by their superiors (west)