Dashnaktsutyun - Armenian Revolutionary Federation

[Haykakan]

Re: Dashnaktsutyun - Armenian Revolutionary Federation

Lack of moral and spiritual fortitude, prevalent especially in the regime which is to certain extent also reflection of societal degradation.

That truely is a degenerat conclusion. I supose the strict enforcement of chrystianity is your solution to Armenias problems?

[Catharsis]

Re: Dashnaktsutyun - Armenian Revolutionary Federation

That truely is a degenerat conclusion.

It is a a conclusion that more Armenians find true, since out-migration beats the repatriation.

I supose the strict enforcement of chrystianity is your solution to Armenias problems?

I find it strange that you restrict morality to Christianity or even religion for that matter. Morality is a Human virtue. It is also a traditional (folkish) Armenian virtue, something we desperately need more of in today's "changing" world.

[Haykakan]

Re: Dashnaktsutyun - Armenian Revolutionary Federation

I strongly agree that morality is not restricted to religion and to be honest with you i am glad that you agree becaus many here do not. The problem with your argument is that you imply that morality or the lack of it is why people are leaving armenia and not moving into it. I would strongly argue that it has nothing to do with morality and much more to do with economics.

[Catharsis]

Re: Dashnaktsutyun - Armenian Revolutionary Federation

I strongly agree that morality is not restricted to religion and to be honest with you i am glad that you agree becaus many here do not. The problem with your argument is that you imply that morality or the lack of it is why people are leaving armenia and not moving into it. I would strongly argue that it has nothing to do with morality and much more to do with economics.

Economics are also tied in to morality, since they stem from the symbiotic socio-economic sphere. We do not have a market economy in Armenia, we have an oligarchy that through its various monopolies does not permit normal competition which is vital if you want your economy to grow and prosper.

The judicial branch is also utterly corrupt as the average Armenian in Armenia feels that he is not protected by the law. All of this is a mark of moral degradation as I stated above and is the leading cause for out migration and very little repatriation.

[Haykakan]

Re: Dashnaktsutyun - Armenian Revolutionary Federation

Economics are also tied in to morality, since they stem from the symbiotic socio-economic sphere. We do not have a market economy in Armenia, we have an oligarchy that through its various monopolies does not permit normal competition which is vital if you want your economy to grow and prosper.

The judicial branch is also utterly corrupt as the average Armenian in Armenia feels that he is not protected by the law. All of this is a mark of moral degradation as I stated above and is the leading cause for out migration and very little repatriation.

The condition you describe is present everywhere there is a capitolist market including the usa. Corruption is not limited to Armenia but you dont see people fleeing the usa because of the corruption which exists on all important levels. Morality is no cureall and claiming that it will fix everything is just crazy i dont care how many of your friends/relatives tell you otherwise.

[bell-the-cat]

Re: Dashnaktsutyun - Armenian Revolutionary Federation

The condition you describe is present everywhere there is a capitolist market including the usa. Corruption is not limited to Armenia but you dont see people fleeing the usa because of the corruption which exists on all important levels. Morality is no cureall and claiming that it will fix everything is just crazy i dont care how many of your friends/relatives tell you otherwise.

The extremes of corruption seen in America, via nepotism and peddling of political interests, does not yet exist in Britain. In America, a perversion of democracy is used to sustain an unbelievable amount of nepotism. Vast numbers of people are "elected" to positions of public authority under the guise of being democratic. To get elected (to get the required financing and organisational network) they have to support one political grouping or another, or one block of vested interest groups or another. And there is a good chance they would loose those positions if another political party got elected, so they will always support those that helped them get elected. The idea that minor public employees (such as the heads of police departments) have to be elected is laughable - it invites corruption, and corruption is what you often get.

[Catharsis]

Re: Dashnaktsutyun - Armenian Revolutionary Federation

The condition you describe is present everywhere there is a capitolist market including the usa. Corruption is not limited to Armenia but you dont see people fleeing the usa because of the corruption which exists on all important levels.

The corruption in USA is much less in terms of the rule of law. Also, USA is a different ball game, since there is still much "fish to be fried" while in relative small Armenia, it has immediate ripple effects.

Morality is no cureall and claiming that it will fix everything is just crazy i dont care how many of your friends/relatives tell you otherwise.

I am bringing you the statistics and the overall sentiment that exists in Armenia. The fact remains that we have more of an outmigration than repatriation. The current rift between the government of Armenia and diaspora will also not help to bridge this gap. Again, if you really look into it you will see that the crisis is more of a moral issue which is only reflected in things like the economy.

[Davo88]

Re: Dashnaktsutyun - Armenian Revolutionary Federation

What about national pride, how does that fare in Armenia?

[Haykakan]

Re: Dashnaktsutyun - Armenian Revolutionary Federation

The extremes of corruption seen in America, via nepotism and peddling of political interests, does not yet exist in Britain. In America, a perversion of democracy is used to sustain an unbelievable amount of nepotism. Vast numbers of people are "elected" to positions of public authority under the guise of being democratic. To get elected (to get the required financing and organisational network) they have to support one political grouping or another, or one block of vested interest groups or another. And there is a good chance they would loose those positions if another political party got elected, so they will always support those that helped them get elected. The idea that minor public employees (such as the heads of police departments) have to be elected is laughable - it invites corruption, and corruption is what you often get.

Unfortunately Armenias "democracy" tries to emulate the USA one plus the europeans have also been shifting twords such a model gradualy.

[Haykakan]

Re: Dashnaktsutyun - Armenian Revolutionary Federation

The corruption in USA is much less in terms of the rule of law. Also, USA is a different ball game, since there is still much "fish to be fried" while in relative small Armenia, it has immediate ripple effects.

The curremt financial situation which has lasted well over a year now here in the USA seems to indicate otherwise.


I am bringing you the statistics and the overall sentiment that exists in Armenia. The fact remains that we have more of an outmigration than repatriation. The current rift between the government of Armenia and diaspora will also not help to bridge this gap. Again, if you really look into it you will see that the crisis is more of a moral issue which is only reflected in things like the economy.

I have really looked into it and morality or the lack there of is not why people leave Hayastan nor why people do not repatriate. It has everything to do with making a living-economics. Capitolist systems are inherantly immoral because they place value on money and capitol instead of people. A good way to debunk the argument that morality has something to do with the emmigration would be the scenerio where lets say that by some means the government of Armenia became very moral and decided not to sign the protocals because they are "immoral" thus keeping Armenia in a permanent state of isolation and poor economic shape, will this help the emmigration/immigration problem? Of course not. Lets say the "immoral" signing of the protocals produces open borders which will unquestionably help the economy, now will this help the emmigration/immigration issue? Of course it will. Morality and economics often run counter to each other thus claiming morality will reverse the emmigration trends which are based on economics is innacurate to put it mildly. One could actually make the argument that morality and economics are inversly related and that would actually be a stronger argument then the one you are presenting.