if this forum is for searching truths, i want to contribute

[bell-the-cat]

NB:

Also note the words where he meets with an "Armenian of note (a deputy or senator of the Empire, if my memory is correct)" in Mush.

Nogales wrote his book while hiding out in South America because he was wanted in America for crimes committed against American citizens (because of his involvement in the siege of Van). For that reason he is rather circumspect when writing about cartain things. He also wrote two other books when he was no longer at risk of prosecution. In one of them he mentions that the Armenian senator was driven away to be murdered the day after he had spoken to him.

[TurQ]

What does this exactly point?
In Van and Bitlis, no Fedayins or Russians existed? No Turk or Kurd have been killed by Fedayins in april 1915?

NB:

Also note the words where he meets with an "Armenian of note (a deputy or senator of the Empire, if my memory is correct)" in Mush.

Nogales wrote his book while hiding out in South America because he was wanted in America for crimes committed against American citizens (because of his involvement in the siege of Van). For that reason he is rather circumspect when writing about cartain things. He also wrote two other books when he was no longer at risk of prosecution. In one of them he mentions that the Armenian senator was driven away to be murdered the day after he had spoken to him.

[bell-the-cat]

What does this exactly point?
In Van and Bitlis, no Fedayins or Russians existed? No Turk or Kurd have been killed by Fedayins in april 1915?

Proves that a genocide of the Ottoman Empire's Armenian citizens was being planned in Constantinople, and those plans were being communicated to the furthers corners of the empire, with the killing starting from the top down. (Starting first with Armenian political, religious, and social leaders; then males of enlistable age; then all males whether old men or children; then women and girls (if they could not be assimilated or enslaved). It also proves how complicit the Kurds were in the killings.

[Hovik]

What does this exactly point?
In Van and Bitlis, no Fedayins or Russians existed? No Turk or Kurd have been killed by Fedayins in april 1915?

Sure they existed, after so many massacres, there was nothing left but for Armenians to defend themselves with the help of Russians. And certainly Turks and Kurds were killed - soldiers and cheiftains with their bandits respectively... who do you think is being dug up there now and sold to the Turkish public as civilians? If so many Turkish / Kurdish civilians were killed by Armenians how come none of the foriegn eyewitnesses happened to see it? How come it was only modern day Turks who think that's what happened?

[1.5 million]

What does this exactly point?
In Van and Bitlis, no Fedayins or Russians existed? No Turk or Kurd have been killed by Fedayins in april 1915?

Unfortunatly for you - your beleifs in Turkish fairy storys are soon to come to an end...not just because of Nogalas - but because of the incredible amount of eyewitness reports - even from Turkish allies and even from Turks themselves - which clearly prove that it was a Turkish genocide of Armenians and NOT the other way around. There were tens of thousands of Armenains - 50,000 sounds familiar though I don't recall the exact number at the moment - who were slaughtered by these very same Turkish forces prior to and during the seige of VAn....and you have the gaul to be accusing Armenians - you piece of xxxx!

[TurQ]

The sufferings of Friends' families are no fairy tails.

You again distort what I say and shape it the way you desire. What I am saying is clear, the Turks and Kurds ahve been massacred in late 1914 in Kars/Ardahan by Armenian groups and in April 1915 the same happened in the Area between Van and Bitlis.

If you say that these did not happen you are clearly white washing Andranik and other barbarians.

If you say Armenian revolution in april 1915 is a "Fairy tale" then I would give you the evidence you like from your own sources ok? (May be later not now, I dont have much time to spent on this), And first things first you can start explaining us why Van "was liberated" and called as the "eternal capital of Armenia" right after the Gallipoli compaign of Allied forces started. If this is not a revolution of any kind then what is ?
Also let us know about the Muslim quarter of Van their fate during Russian/Armenian occupation of Van, also what had happened to people in the rural areas.

Do you think the Fedayins were part of the "Peace now" movement and flower generation of those times??

Again dont try to corrupt and distort what I say, I am basicalytalking about april 1915 and talking about the 5,000 armed Armenians and their revolt, I am not talking about ordinary people, I am not talking CUP's actions towards civilians are OK.

Unfortunatly for you - your beleifs in Turkish fairy storys are soon to come to an end...not just because of Nogalas - but because of the incredible amount of eyewitness reports - even from Turkish allies and even from Turks themselves - which clearly prove that it was a Turkish genocide of Armenians and NOT the other way around. There were tens of thousands of Armenains - 50,000 sounds familiar though I don't recall the exact number at the moment - who were slaughtered by these very same Turkish forces prior to and during the seige of VAn....and you have the gaul to be accusing Armenians - you piece of xxxx!

[TurQ]

Hovik I am talking about the civilians, the soldiers are of different issue. The civilians who lived in muslim quarters of Van and Turkish/Kurdish villages between In Van and Bitlis.

Sure they existed, after so many massacres, there was nothing left but for Armenians to defend themselves with the help of Russians. And certainly Turks and Kurds were killed - soldiers and cheiftains with their bandits respectively... who do you think is being dug up there now and sold to the Turkish public as civilians? If so many Turkish / Kurdish civilians were killed by Armenians how come none of the foriegn eyewitnesses happened to see it? How come it was only modern day Turks who think that's what happened?

[Bulgarian]

TurQ dont you get it yet. The Turks didnt suffer all your friends (who more than likely deny the Armenian genocide) are doing is putting this idea into your head that Armenians were massacring Turks. Are there any non Turkish sources to suggest this even happened?

The story goes the Turkish army went in to massacre the Armenians of Van but the Turkish civilians were brave people and true heroes, they tried to protect the Armenians against the Turkish army but the Turkish army went in and massacred the heroic Turks along with the Armenians they were trying to save.

The stories your friends speak of are most likely lies (that blame the victim) to support the Turkish theory that the Armenian genocide was actually an intercommunal struggle. Turkeys denial of the Armenian genocide results in research into everything being incomplete. How can people accept this notion of Turkish civilians being massacred if Turkey denies 1.5 million people being massacred (actually within a 25 year period about 2 million Armenians were killed)?

How do you know that your friends werent told lies by their great grandparents or their grand parents to cover up Turkish crimes in their region? What if your friends were told stories to give them an entire hostility against the Armenians?

[TurQ]

Could you pls, just .... up

TurQ dont you get it yet. The Turks didnt suffer all your friends (who more than likely deny the Armenian genocide) are doing is putting this idea into your head that Armenians were massacring Turks. Are there any non Turkish sources to suggest this even happened?

The story goes the Turkish army went in to massacre the Armenians of Van but the Turkish civilians were brave people and true heroes, they tried to protect the Armenians against the Turkish army but the Turkish army went in and massacred the heroic Turks along with the Armenians they were trying to save.

The stories your friends speak of are most likely lies (that blame the victim) to support the Turkish theory that the Armenian genocide was actually an intercommunal struggle. Turkeys denial of the Armenian genocide results in research into everything being incomplete. How can people accept this notion of Turkish civilians being massacred if Turkey denies 1.5 million people being massacred (actually within a 25 year period about 2 million Armenians were killed)?

How do you know that your friends werent told lies by their great grandparents or their grand parents to cover up Turkish crimes in their region? What if your friends were told stories to give them an entire hostility against the Armenians?

[Bulgarian]

Could you pls, just .... up

I see what this is.

I know exactly what happened in the Armenian genocide. I know what that olsonor person is up to. What can I say? I know alot!

TurQ you are an apologist for the view of denying (or minimizing the extent) of the Armenian genocide.

If not please show me sources (unbiased) about Armenians murdering Turkish civilians. I think you cant. Your holding on false hope of some day the Armenians will accept that they also did alot of bad to the Turks. But guess what? This is not going to happen.