Reperation? Ok but How much?

[Varouj]

Varouj
Nobody gonna boycott Turkey just because you sy so.
I know lots of Armenian busineeses that sell Turkish goods. First go to those Armenian stores and try to *convice* them first, if you can ever.

Oh, believe me, they will be convinced, especially when they see nobody buys that shiat.

[TurQ]

Phantom

this is not a legal argument. This is no more than a slogan, you are not gonna convice a jury, this is international polics.

And I am asking one more time, why dont Armenian groups go to Hague and sue Turkey for those crimes.

They spent lots of time for insurance claims, spent lots of times for lobbying to various parliments in the world, but somehow they skipped sueing Turkey?


Just think about this

I think the more logical analysis, albeit simplified here, goes like this: there was a Genocide carried out by the Ottoman govt.; neither the Ottoman govt. nor its successor ever paid for this crime; the successor has spent the last 90 years benefiting from the crime, lying about it and trying to cover it up; the successor is responsible for righting this wrong and paying for the crime from which it has been a direct beneficiary.

[TurQ]

All right go ahead.

Those Armenians dont buy Turkish products just because they dont have other choice, or the high quality of those products(I mean the stores in US), it is because Armenians find lots of things common with Turks so they buy those goods.

Oh, believe me, they will be convinced, especially when they see nobody buys that shiat.

[Varouj]

Ok then think twice the time you have thought until now.
You are detached from reality

They are playing you by using land claims. Just be sensible, in this world Turkey and Armenia are the only 2 countries. There are lots of things going on in the world, and believe me my friend if you(or as nation Armenians) make you obsessed about the land claims believe me you'll be one way or another destroy yourself.

If you lock yourself for land claims, believe it'll be the Armenians to lose.
My friend land issue is fueled by those leaders of yours in order not to solve the problem, believe me. they know very well how TUrkey is sesitive on territorial issues, they push this so that Armenia and Turkey could never come close each other, and they can play their leadership games.

Leaders schmeaders...they have NOTHING to do with land claims especially from the diaspora. In fact, they are the ones that know they had better tow the line and not sell out the rights of Armenians to reclaim their land because the consequences of doing so are something that will not be pretty.

Forget about convincing us otherwise..........

[Gavur]

The pressure we put on Turkey will continue until....
But that pressure is not to Make it do anyting other then reanalyze its past and present simultaniously this is not possible instantly but the process has started and will continue.
We have to understand no state can make another do what it wants unless its through war even then issue is not solved like Az-batlij-jani case.
Turkey must come to this point by itselves by the encouragement of the world.And I believe they will,of course they'll do this by taking a step forward and sometimes backward.Two ways they can get out this mess
1)Accept the past and take resposibility what ever that may entail
or
2)Become more of a blind extreme nationalist then they are and destroy themselves and sink in to the quicksand that they created even faster.

[Varouj]

All right go ahead.

Those Armenians dont buy Turkish products just because they dont have other choice, or the high quality of those products(I mean the stores in US), it is because Armenians find lots of things common with Turks so they buy those goods.

The ONLY thing Armenians and turks have "in common" is that turks have something that rightfully belongs to Armenians.

[Heat]

Can someone tell me how is Turkey gonna pay this,

I'm afraid that going to be your problem. How did Germany pay the jews? If you don't know, then it's up to you to go and ask them, because sooner or later you will be in the same shoes they were in.

on what basis, on what logic

On the basis of logical laws of the civilized world on the crime and punishment of crimes against humanity, but I wouldn't expect you to understand any of that stuff.

Why should TUrkey pay what's done by Ittihadists, where Turkish republic itself punished those Ittihadists.

Why are you insisting on keeping the proceeds from the crimes commited by the Ittihadists? You are in posetion of proprty stolen through the commision of a crime and insist on keeping what you know is not yours. Germany punished the Nazis, but they still had to pay for the crimes commited by the Nazis and turkey will also have to pay.

You can keep on killing baby stuff which sounds too logical too your ears for raparations, but has nothing to do with the realities.

You keep repeating about logic and realities, but it's obvious that it's you who has no clue as to what logic or reality is. You're living in a dream world but one day you're going to be in for a rude awakening, because the US will not need you forever and even israel will be faced with having to make a hard choice, but will ultimately drop turkey like a hot potato when they realize they were betting on the wrong horse and the futility of helping turkey deny the "reality" (your favorite word) of the Armenian Genocide.

This is a legal issue, just tell us what kind of legal steps you are planning to take?, are you aware that even genocide itself can not be legaly concluded in international courts. Lets face realities here, why do Armenians go after parliment after parliment? Cause they know that they cant win a case in UN courts on this, so they lobby in countries then finally aiming UN to accept it(which is a weak possibilty). DOnt get angry at me, I am just telling the reality, and dont make it a personal thing, I am just trying to say a legal battle regarding to raparations is doomed to failure, and what I think is this is used by diasporan leaders to fuel the anger of ordinary Armenians, further antagonize them towards Turkey and Turks.

What, you're a lawyer now? Anyway, why the hell would I tell you what kind of legal steps I'm planning on taking? You will know when I want you to know when you get served with papers to appear in court. For your information, genocide has already been concluded, Mr Reality. We go after parliment after parliment and we will continue to do so until you have no one left to support your lies and then you will be all alone in the center with every finger in the world pointing at you and saying, GUILTY OF GENOCIDE. This has nothing to do with any Armenian leaders because I never liked turks anyway. I'm not angry with you or taking it personal. I just think you're not too bright and trying to play lawyer, which is really funny to watch since I know you haven't the slightest clue of what you're talking about.

And for your information and future reference, MR Reality Lawyer.

UNITED NATIONS REPORT ON THE ARMENIAN GENOCIDE: UN 38th Session, 1985. Compiled by The Armenian Genocide Resource Center, 1998. 8 ½ x 11. Spiral. 20 pages.

Held under the aegis of the United Nations Sub-Commission on Prevention of Discrimination and Protect of Minorities in Geneva, Switzerland, August 5-30, 1985, the UN Sub-Commission under Benjamin Whitaker adopted the report on genocide, which the following year was accepted by the higher body, the UN Commission on Human Rights. Paragraph 24 of the report addresses the Armenian massacres and, despite attempts by the government of Turkey to thwart efforts at recognition, often bordering on scandal in European newspapers, was passed by a majority of 15-4 affirming the massacres of Armenians in 1915 was genocide.

This compilation reprises that important decision. Also included is a summary statement by Paul Laurin of the International Federation of Human Rights, and Paragraph 24,the Sub-Commission's report on the Armenian genocide,. Included are other UN documents: Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide; and the Convention on the Non-Applicability of Statutory Limitations to War Crimes and Crimes Against Humanity.

If you want more information, do your own research.

I can understand the individials who have become rich thru getting Armenians' wealth, I can understand tracing those individuals and get those money back and give it to Armenian foundations. But how can you justify TUrkey to pay fines, that a country itself suffered from a merciless offensives by the so call great powers, a country that survived a total annihilation, cost of millions of death and millions of immigrants poured in?.

Too bad tough luck. No one twisted turkey's arm to join Germany in the war. Germany had to pay fines even though they suffered all kinds themselves, so turkey can do the same instead of xxxxx and moan about it expecting us to feel sorry for you. Those individuals will be traced back when possible, but no turk will be allowed to keep any valuables that were stolen from Armenians. Oh and guess what! I traced down something of value that was stolen from the Armenians. It happens to be a big fkn chunk of land with this bad ass big mountain on it and some piece of filth by the name of turkey has it in it's posetion and we aim to get it back, sooner or later, one way or the other.

Heat your poor logic is "Turks killed Armenians so Turks in 21st century pay for it", but the reality is CUP policies costed those lives and Turks and Turkey had nothing todo with it.

No, my logic is, "Nazi Germany killed jews, Poles, Gypsies whatever, so Germans payed for it and what the CUP did, turks will pay for it." Nazi policies cost many German lives too, but that didn't get Germany off the hook. turkey today is the exact same as turkey was back then, you freaks even use the same flag, whereas at least Germany changed theirs.

This primitive approach "An ethnic group should be paying to antoher ethnic group" smells nothing but revenge, it is not justice or something. It is revenge and pure revenge.

Who is the primitive one? It's you turks who think you're still living in 1915 like your azerbaboon cousins though when they went on amurderous rampage in 1988. That's right and in 1915 plus a number of other times before that, a certain "ethnic group" went on a rampage killing large numbers of members of another "ethnic group", so yes you will pay for it cause you're not getting no free genocide ride. Cal it whatever you want, revenge, pure revenge, unpure revenge or even monkey poo, I don't really care.

As I said I can understand tracing those people who get rich from Armenians, but there is no logic and can there be no international law that would justify such raparations. In case Turkey accepts in fact the 1915 events was a genocide, again this kind of raparations can not be done by the state which has nothing to do with those events.

You don't understand anything so don't even bother pretending. Had nothing to do with it? You'll have to explain to the judge why you're in posetion of the goods and property that belonged to the victims and not only deny there was a crime commited, but refuse to return the stolen property to the righful owners. I hope you represent your country when we're in court.

BTW, did you watch that panel discussion on PBS? Did that turk denier look like a total ass on national television or what!

But if you are talking about getting land for compensation, thats whole another issue and there is no point talking on nonsense.

Oh but I'm not talking about getting land for compensation. When I talk about getting land back, I'm talking about getting "our land" BACK and I don't consider that as compensation since it belongs to us in the first place. If we were like the jews who came there from somewhere else and became the victims of a genocide and turkey decided to give us a piece of land (provided it's actually their), then that would be compensation. I'm sorry to say, but you are so unbelievably dumb and I'm not just saying that to insult you as you're doing a fine job of it all by yourself. If I stole your car, got caught and had to return it to you, would you consider that as compensation? No, you're just getting your freakin car back which belonged to you in the first place and the land thing is no different.

Well then if there's no point, go away and play turkish lawyer somewhere else.

[Heat]

Ok then think twice the time you have thought until now.
You are detached from reality

They are playing you by using land claims.

Here he goes with his turkeyvision reality BS again. You still don't get it. No one is playing me anything. Everything I have been writing are my own thoughts and opinions on these issues, but don't worry, I don't expect you to understand what that's like.

Just be sensible, in this world Turkey and Armenia are the only 2 countries. There are lots of things going on in the world, and believe me my friend if you(or as nation Armenians) make you obsessed about the land claims believe me you'll be one way or another destroy yourself.

As a matter of fact, I don't believe you and I think I should be more concerned about the turks trying to destroy us, because we all know they would like nothing better than having another go at it.

If you lock yourself for land claims, believe it'll be the Armenians to lose.

Au contraire, it's turkey that has something to lose and although they try to pretend otherwise, they are xxxxting their pants knowing that's inevidable and you are showing the exact same symptoms. Anyway, you let us worry about that and afterwards you can say, "I told you so." and call yourself Nostradanus.

My friend land issue is fueled by those leaders of yours in order not to solve the problem, believe me.

I'm not your freind, I don't believe you and I don't need to be fueled by any leaders.

they know very well how TUrkey is sesitive on territorial issues,

Awwwww poor little turkey, so touchy touchy when it comes to terretorial issues. Well for your information, I'm just as touchy about it and probably more touchy since it's my land that was stolen from me and turks have no right to get touchy over land that doesn't belong to them.

they push this so that Armenia and Turkey could never come close each other, and they can play their leadership games.

I don't give a crap about either their games or yours, but I don't want Armenia and turkey close either. As a matter of fact, I want you turks as faaaaaaaaaaaaaar away from us as possible and God willing, that will happen one day when you find your way back to mongolia and retrace your roots there inshallah.

[Heat]

Phantom

this is not a legal argument. This is no more than a slogan, you are not gonna convice a jury, this is international polics.

And I am asking one more time, why dont Armenian groups go to Hague and sue Turkey for those crimes.

They spent lots of time for insurance claims, spent lots of times for lobbying to various parliments in the world, but somehow they skipped sueing Turkey?


Just think about this

He wasn't giving you a legal argument, he was just trying make it clear for you to understand. What would you know about legal arguments anyway as it doesn't look like you could even argue your way out of a paper bag let alone stop the noose from tightening around your neck.

The simple answer to your question as to why is. First things first. First we get our xxxx together as in proof, evidence, witnesses, documentation and all that sort of stuff. Then we go around and talk to people and countries that had been supporting you for whatever reason and convince them what they had been doing was wrong and immoral, and we have had a tremendous amount of success I might add, even though turkey has done its darnedest to see that it doesn't happen by using threats of all sorts without much success. Then once all that is covered and turkey has no one left, to back up their lies, that's when we take you down!

[Gavur]

Thats when The house of cards will fall by themselves
Good replys heat (your on fire lol)