Discussion Thread

[lal]

I agree and disagree to some extent. The Armenians were/are fighting for survival in Artsakh; the Azeris for pride. It doesn't really have much to do with bravery although there were/are many brave Armenians. The Armenians will ultimately win if the conflict begins again because the choice is to win or die. They will win becuase the Azeris will be the ones on the attack from inferior positions and even if they are initially successful in breaching the first line of defense, the counter-attack will be devastating. All the Armenians have to do is essentially play defense and counterattack.

The Armenian diaspora did not really volunteer the first time except for a handfull- but those that did were certainly effective. I also think the Karabakhtis are not beholden to trust outsiders.

The reasons the Armenian forces did not continue to move east are the following:

1. The Russians categorically told them to stop or else.
2. They would have found themselves at a strategic disadvantage if they contiuned into the lowland plains far from their well-known territory, defensive positions and supply lines. In spite of any success in a renewed conflict, Armenia will not be moving toward Baku. Yevlakh is another story though.

is there a possible way ,other than giving back karabağ lands to azerbeycan, to reach peace. ı mean is there anything,any advantage any bargains armenia can give to azerbeycan so that they can accept peace. or is this issue totally finished and there is nothing to talk left?

[Alexandros]

Anyone who messes with Armenia would have to talk with Russia first.Anyone who remember when Turkey threatened to invade Armenia back in 1993?Turkey were pretty xxxxy until Russia warned Turkey that Russia would defend Armenia so Turkey backed off and shut up.There`s also a Russian military base in Armenia.Armenia may be a small country but they have a very powerful ally behind them.

[VaheTheGreat(e)]

is there a possible way ,other than giving back karabağ lands to azerbeycan, to reach peace. ı mean is there anything,any advantage any bargains armenia can give to azerbeycan so that they can accept peace. or is this issue totally finished and there is nothing to talk left?

lal, why we should give some thing to Azeries do we owe them or what?

[Joseph]

is there a possible way ,other than giving back karabağ lands to azerbeycan, to reach peace. ı mean is there anything,any advantage any bargains armenia can give to azerbeycan so that they can accept peace. or is this issue totally finished and there is nothing to talk left?

It has become known that Armenia offered Azerbaijan the occupied regions outside of Artsakh: Aghdam, Fizuli, Zangelan, Gubatli, parts of Kelbajar- back in return Artsakh would get their independence but the Azeris refused. They have taken the maximalist position.

[lal]

Furthermore, the life for Turkish liberals and scholars who work for justice are facing an ever increasingly difficult time related to the Armenian Genocide issue.

This is the impasse.



Genocide deserves recognition and justice. The truth needs to be told and in order to do so, the aggrieved party must be vocal about it otherwise the party that committed the crime, or in this case continues the cover-up would rather have the crime dissappear.

I see no easy answer and I do feel that both sides have unreasonable claims.

Armenians will not get land, money, etc. but Turks will eventually have to come to grips with this crime and stop the cover up which only further antagonizes Armenians and makes them look like criminals.

ı totally agree with you. but ı also want a solution to this. obviously this crime happened. it was going to be forgotten. but armenians didnt let this happen. and now is the correct time .because if turkey can accept this, turkey will also have to accept many many other things relating todays people and become a different country. this is very difficult but not impossible.

armenians must change the tactic and start visiting turkey by masses, they must come and find their old villages. for example.

[VaheTheGreat(e)]

It has become known that Armenia offered Azerbaijan the occupied regions outside of Artsakh: Aghdam, Fizuli, Zangelan, Gubatli, parts of Kelbajar- back in return Artsakh would get their independence but the Azeris refused. They have taken the maximalist position.

Of course they would: if you offer them finger they will bite the hand…. NO lands to turks!!!!

[VaheTheGreat(e)]

ı totally agree with you. but ı also want a solution to this. obviously this crime happened. it was going to be forgotten. but armenians didnt let this happen. and now is the correct time .because if turkey can accept this, turkey will also have to accept many many other things relating todays people and become a different country. this is very difficult but not impossible.

armenians must change the tactic and start visiting turkey by masses, they must come and find their old villages. for example.

Oh yah I did that one...guess what I have found?

[Edoman]

I agree and disagree to some extent. The Armenians were/are fighting for survival in Artsakh; the Azeris for pride. It doesn't really have much to do with bravery although there were/are many brave Armenians. The Armenians will ultimately win if the conflict begins again because the choice is to win or die. They will win becuase the Azeris will be the ones on the attack from inferior positions and even if they are initially successful in breaching the first line of defense, the counter-attack will be devastating. All the Armenians have to do is essentially play defense and counterattack.

The Armenian diaspora did not really volunteer the first time except for a handfull- but those that did were certainly effective. I also think the Karabakhtis are not beholden to trust outsiders.

The reasons the Armenian forces did not continue to move east are the following:

1. The Russians categorically told them to stop or else.
2. They would have found themselves at a strategic disadvantage if they contiuned into the lowland plains far from their well-known territory, defensive positions and supply lines. In spite of any success in a renewed conflict, Armenia will not be moving toward Baku. Yevlakh is another story though.

Joseph, tseret chesava (hope your hands don’t hurt). I have been waiting for you to say something because I have a feeling that you are the most informed here. What you say about the conflict makes sense to me now. Please feel free to correct and educate us when possible. This is one of the reasons I am here.
Thanks

[lal]

It has become known that Armenia offered Azerbaijan the occupied regions outside of Artsakh: Aghdam, Fizuli, Zangelan, Gubatli, parts of Kelbajar- back in return Artsakh would get their independence but the Azeris refused. They have taken the maximalist position.

yeah something like that. or maybe if gaz-energy pipe lines pass thru armenia ,they give something else. there must be a way.

turks and azeris speak same language, we both consider ourselves turks also turkey is very much energy dependent to azerbeycan, a lots of turk work in azerbeycan. turkey cant dismiss them.

this has no relationship about the genocide, but it has a relationship about the closed borders and stopped economic trades.

[lal]

Oh yah I did that one...guess what I have found?

what?