Parallel Roads

[chinchilla]

Bell for moderator!

I had previously also requested a subforum, for off-topic posts. I think we would need to contact either Hovik or Tongue.

Another good subforum would be for Armenian churches and structures. When I post news about Armenian architecture, I usually post it in the General Discussions forum, which makes it difficult to locate later on.

And another subforum is needed for general Armenian history. Armenian history didn't begin in 1915, like some Armenians believe, or when they came under Ottoman rule, like some Turks believe. This subforum can be used to discuss events like the Adana and Hamidian massacres, Armenian life in the Ottoman, Persian, and Russian empires, and ancient Armenian history.

[Steph]

He doesn't want Turks to do anything. He doesn't want to engage positively with Turkey at all. He is happy with things the way they are. Whatever Turkey does, he will be dissatisfied. Even if he were to set down his demands and you were to accomodate 99% them, he will still hate you (individually and collectively) with a depth you cannot imagine.

Bell, perhaps you can use my forum identity and save all of us much time, or
I think you should desist from answering for others until you have sorted out the demons in your own head.

[Steph]

I do not disagree with your message above but I also think that you often add fuel to the fire and you even admit that I think. You have valuable insights to share but lack patience and often choose to alienate people; you are not the only one.


Nevertheless, the amount of fighting, name calling, insults, etc on this site is staggering.

There are so many things we can all discuss, learn, share if we are willing to give thoughtful pause before we post or respond.

Well, Joseph.
I'm bitterly disappointed that you agree with Bell's analysis that I have no wish to engage with turks, have no wish to see recognition move forward in turkey and have a hatred of immeasureable depth towards turkey and turks. Perhaps you're not reading all posts on this forum. Bell has his/her own agenda which has no aim, as far as I can see, other than to snipe at all and sundry, mainly on the Armenian side of the fence.

[Steph]

There are so many things we can all discuss, learn, share if we are willing to give thoughtful pause before we post or respond.

Perhaps if a question is directed at one particular member, it would be polite & prudent to allow that member to respond before others drop in with their two-pennyworth.
We might then possibly see a reduction in arguments which revolve around points which are forgotten although the arguing continues.

[Gavur]

why do you say this to me. because ı reject ,totally destruction of turkey in turn of accepting the genocide?

Your a fear monger, (which makes you a agent provocatour) your fears are inbedded in an invalid and stubborn criminal state who btw is not your god.

[Gavur]

He doesn't want Turks to do anything. He doesn't want to engage positively with Turkey at all. He is happy with things the way they are. Whatever Turkey does, he will be dissatisfied. Even if he were to set down his demands and you were to accomodate 99% them, he will still hate you (individually and collectively) with a depth you cannot imagine.

I said a while ago that, looking at it overall, I believe this forum doesn't perform a useful function. I now think it is worse than that - it does damage by alienating people. Do you think Lal has a better or a worse opinion about Armenians in general on visiting this forum? Worse, a lot worse, I bet. That doesn't seem to have changed her opinions on the AG, but for others Turks it would have. (And if signing that petition had resulted in some harm coming to her, I'm sure she would have been thinking why did I bother for these spiteful dogs.)

Maybe the whole concept of this forum needs to change? Maybe every post should be in the form of either a question or an answer? If the Armenian Genocide and the numerous issues relating to it really are important, then posts on this forum need to be written with greater care and consideration. Those that can't display the appropriate level of care and consideration for the subject should not be allowed to post here. It shouldn't just be a place where some know-nothing but think they know-it-all persons come to slag off Turkey in general, and anyone who disagrees with them on often the smallest of points.


A thought....
How about making a new subsection to the forum titled "Requests and Contributions". In it, for example, people could post questions, or answers to the questions of others, or post material (text, photos, etc) which relates to the Armenian Genocide and which is unavailable elsewhere, or original news reports or experiences (not stuff copypasted from other websites), or maybe even member-translated documents (from, or into, Turkish, for example). Basically, it would be full of original source material that would not exist if this forum did not exist (making my "this forum doesn't perform a useful function" comment invalid).

Where I come from we chase annoying cats with hotwater, but here we just piss on them.

[bell-the-cat]

Re: Parallel Roads

I said a while ago that, looking at it overall, I believe this forum doesn't perform a useful function. I now think it is worse than that - it does damage by alienating people. Do you think Lal has a better or a worse opinion about Armenians in general on visiting this forum? Worse, a lot worse, I bet. That doesn't seem to have changed her opinions on the AG, but for others Turks it would have. (And if signing that petition had resulted in some harm coming to her, I'm sure she would have been thinking why did I bother for these spiteful dogs.)

Maybe the whole concept of this forum needs to change? Maybe every post should be in the form of either a question or an answer? If the Armenian Genocide and the numerous issues relating to it really are important, then posts on this forum need to be written with greater care and consideration. Those that can't display the appropriate level of care and consideration for the subject should not be allowed to post here. It shouldn't just be a place where some know-nothing but think they know-it-all persons come to slag off Turkey in general, and anyone who disagrees with them on often the smallest of points.


A thought....
How about making a new subsection to the forum titled "Requests and Contributions". In it, for example, people could post questions, or answers to the questions of others, or post material (text, photos, etc) which relates to the Armenian Genocide and which is unavailable elsewhere, or original news reports or experiences (not stuff copypasted from other websites), or maybe even member-translated documents (from, or into, Turkish, for example). Basically, it would be full of original source material that would not exist if this forum did not exist (making my "this forum doesn't perform a useful function" comment invalid).

So, that's that then.

What happened? Couldn't find the $150 or so yearly running costs? Is that the value put on the whole Armenian Genocide issue, or just the value put on the forum and its contributors? At the moment the Armeniangenocide.org forum was starting to be useful, the plug is pulled. Maybe that's why it was pulled.

Does anyone really think that absorbing the subject into a general forum, a forum full of the trivialites and the idiots that all such forums attract, is the way to go? Is that going to lead to a serious subject being treated in a serious way?

[Anonymouse]

Re: Parallel Roads

So, that's that then.

What happened? Couldn't find the $150 or so yearly running costs? Is that the value put on the whole Armenian Genocide issue, or just the value put on the forum and its contributors? At the moment the Armeniangenocide.org forum was starting to be useful, the plug is pulled. Maybe that's why it was pulled.

Does anyone really think that absorbing the subject into a general forum, a forum full of the trivialites and the idiots that all such forums attract, is the way to go? Is that going to lead to a serious subject being treated in a serious way?

First of all, I object to your description of the rest of the forum as somehow filled with idiots and trivialities. That you personally do not find anything useful is your problem. Perhaps Turkish forums are better? I don't know, I haven't visited.

Second, this is not an academic circle, this is a public forum on the internet. It is open to all who wish to post. By default, this will include a large pool of posters some with asinine opinions and others with useful ones.

Third, I agree with you about the militant approach many Armenians take on these forums regarding these issues. However, I disagree that somehow the forums are not serving their function (whatever that may be). The forums have many functions and it is neither my place nor yours to say what those are as they are different things for different people.

Fourth, merging the two forums is an administrative decision based on the webmaster's own reasons, costs and benefits, etc.

[bell-the-cat]

Re: Parallel Roads

First of all, I object to your description of the rest of the forum as somehow filled with idiots and trivialities. That you personally do not find anything useful is your problem. Perhaps Turkish forums are better? I don't know, I haven't visited.

Second, this is not an academic circle, this is a public forum on the internet. It is open to all who wish to post. By default, this will include a large pool of posters some with asinine opinions and others with useful ones.

Third, I agree with you about the militant approach many Armenians take on these forums regarding these issues. However, I disagree that somehow the forums are not serving their function (whatever that may be). The forums have many functions and it is neither my place nor yours to say what those are as they are different things for different people.

Fourth, merging the two forums is an administrative decision based on the webmaster's own reasons, costs and benefits, etc.

You seem to have limited expectations about the potentual value of forums, and a casual disregard about their potentual harm. I'm not going to apologise for still having high expectations. There are no "Turkish forums" or academic circles for ordinary Turks to go to and engage with non-Turks about Armenian Genocide issues, so they came here (here being armeniangenocide.com). They were mostly far more serious about the issue than most Armenians seem to be, and they expected a proper, serious forum to express their opinions. AG forum at its best only barely served that function, hyeclub doesn't come even close to serving it.

[Joseph]

Re: Parallel Roads

You seem to have limited expectations about the potentual value of forums, and a casual disregard about their potentual harm. I'm not going to apologise for still having high expectations. There are no "Turkish forums" or academic circles for ordinary Turks to go to and engage with non-Turks about Armenian Genocide issues, so they came here (here being armeniangenocide.com). They were mostly far more serious about the issue than most Armenians seem to be, and they expected a proper, serious forum to express their opinions. AG forum at its best only barely served that function, hyeclub doesn't come even close to serving it.

Bell and I have had our dissagreements but I agree with much of what he wrote above. Although I have a higher opinion of AG forum than bell, we were just starting to achieve something and it is gone; we were never even warned.