Letter from Prof. Ataov to US Senator about Armenian-Turkish issue

[may]

Re: Letter from Prof. Ataov to US Senator about Armenian-Turkish issue

I think may said she was a girl some time ago.

I'd love to read that post.

Me too!

Actually, I check the subjects time to time but I am practically away because I am overwhelmed with my work.

Regarding my sex: I do not remember who, but a while ago, somebody said s/he assumed I am a woman, with the same claim that I said so before Then I clarified that I am not a "she". Doing it again: I am a "he" (sound funny when written this way). Please make this post sticky, I do not want more debates about my sex anymore

Regarding Mukuch's comments: Just like anybody else, I have been in this "self explanation" cycle several times and do not want to revolve around this circle once again. And more importantly I do not have neither the time nor the will to respond someone indirectly telling me "mentally disabled" without even reading my previous posts, or waiting for my answer. I do not feel my answer will mean anything. I am not even mentioning the Mukuch's tone in the following posts. Nothing personal, Mukuch, believe me, nothing personal. This is just the way how this forum is working.

[hipeter924]

Re: Letter from Prof. Ataov to US Senator about Armenian-Turkish issue

In response to the beginning post:

What about the Kurds...you imprison and wipe them out...what about the countless fellow Turk's you put behind bars for showing human decency and compassion towards them, Armenians and other minorities? I guess you forgot. Your out of luck this time. You can't genocide the Kurds or anyone else and they are turning on you, as people being cruelly oppressed would. You might have won this time...but you can't keep the lies forever....every lie and every fiction crumbles...even Henry Tudor couldn't rewrite history...and you will fail just the same.

Don't have time to debunk this at the moment...but will debunk it a bit later on when I have time.

[bell-the-cat]

Re: Letter from Prof. Ataov to US Senator about Armenian-Turkish issue

Me too!

Actually, I check the subjects time to time but I am practically away because I am overwhelmed with my work.

Regarding my sex: I do not remember who, but a while ago, somebody said s/he assumed I am a woman, with the same claim that I said so before

Like Armenian men named Karen.

[Gavur]

Re: Letter from Prof. Ataov to US Senator about Armenian-Turkish issue

Or Scot named Pat.

[hipeter924]

Re: Letter from Prof. Ataov to US Senator about Armenian-Turkish issue

Dear Türkkaya Ataöv I am a human being, you are a human being, Armenians are human beings. Ataturk your supposed god on earth that you believe should be immune to all historical, political and religious criticism as the pillar of the so called Turkish Republic did not think so.

You have written many books. So you know how to manipulate and control the masses. So I am surprised you failed to understand the fundamentals of a republic or a democracy. Turkey is neither of these, failing to both give full freedom of expression and political rights to its entire people, you have a republic that discriminates by race, religion and wealth.

You are a part of this cruel and inhumane establishment that constantly breaks international agreements such as 1) Declaration of Human Rights, 2) Rights of Minorities, 3) Rights of Women, 4) Geneva Convention, and many other agreements you should be familiar with in the UN you say you worked for. Though the most significant thing you highlight is your own personal racism and intolerance to the Armenian people through your denial of the Armenian Genocide despite the fact there is concrete and irrefutable evidence of the Armenian Genocide.

Furthermore you show your contempt of the democratic system of the United States of America, by claiming a judge and jury scenario. When in the Turkish Republic you so carefully espouse Kurds are put to death without a trial, and the minority ethnic and religious groups of your country are denied a fair trial under your undemocratic and racist and religiously intolerant laws such as ‘denying turkishness’. One word for you the so called ‘neutral’ historian and that is hypocrisy.

As for your next point, did the world take into account a Nazi view when recognizing the Nazi Holocaust? No they did not. For you we must bring back Hitler and Goebels back from the dead, bring back all the dead xxxs, political prisoners and others that had genocide committed against them so you can personally interview every one, about whether they died. This is the same logic you define as the only way to determine the Armenian Genocide happened, because to your mind there is not enough evidence to prove the Armenian Genocide. Should we now be saying that because there are a series of documents from the Nazi holocaust deniers that prove supposedly that no genocide was committed that we should override and dismiss the wealth of evidence about the Nazi Holocaust? You do not believe so.

Yet you claim this regarding the Armenian Genocide, taking only into account information from Armenians your predecessors tortured, killed, or threatened into lying about the Armenian Genocide. The purpose is to give you the so called ‘wealth of evidence’ for purposes of the Armenian Genocide denial campaign you are part of. The US congress is the best place to pass a verdict on this topic, in a nation of freedom of speech and freedom of expression, with the ability to look over all the evidence the Armenian Genocide is confirmed as fact, France is the best example.

As for Mrs. Giftgy’s reply of “We must remember and recognize this tragedy to ensure it never happens again” this is perfectly reasonable as who wants for such a genocide visited upon the Armenians to be committed again, yet you change the meaning, claiming it supports hating Turks and the Turkish nation. I would recommend you retake English.

It is interesting you refer to the First World War because many Armenians lived in Russian territory which was right across the border from Turkey, it would be unrealistic to say that some Armenians in Turkey wouldn’t sympathise to ones in Russia as they are the same ethnic group. So yes some Armenians sided with Russia.

The problem is that your Young Turks took this as an excuse to wipe out the entire Armenian people for the actions of a few. Furthermore the Armenians in the Ottoman Empire were by in large good contributor to the Ottoman Empire despite the numerous persecutions that existed at the time, they paid their taxes, worked, and most Armenians fought on the Turkish side during the First World War. During the Armenian Genocide your Young Turk government told the Turkish people including the Kurds to kill the Armenian people, rape their women and children, and wipe them off the face of the earth as much as they could. Some Armenian soldiers fought back against the Ottoman Empire to save their people from total annihilation, the result of which allowed many Armenian families (one of which my mother is descended from) who would have been wiped out by the Young Turks to survive.

As for your list of Armenians you claim to support your genocide denial, you can twist and turn anyone to believe what you want. I suggest you and Nostradamus have a lot in common. Though admittedly your list can be totally dismissed as being fraudulent and misinformed because Canadian historian Viken L. Attarian says otherwise about Hovhannes Katchaznouni, the first Prime Minister of the first Armenian Republic, as the first prime Minister of Armenian was a devout patriot of Armenia and never went out like you do to deny the Armenian Genocide. Fact-finding in history demands that all relevant parts of the truth are taken into consideration.

I must disagree with your generalisation, Genocide is not always the result of racism, and it can be the result of religious views, political views and not just racism as you inaccurately claim as the direct product of genocide. In Cambodia, the genocide there that murdered 2 million people was not a result of racism but due to a political view that being the perverted communist view of Pol Pot and his Khmer Rouge followers.

Also you claim genocide is simply a 20th century invention, this claim I find disturbing as it ignores all the events before then that could be claimed as acts of genocide. One such case is the end of the Roman Empire, as the barbarian hordes razed entire cities, raped women, and purposely went out to annihilate the roman people. Genocide is not new; it has existed from our early history and come through into the 20th century and now into the 21st with the genocide now being perpetrated in Darfur.

I have to underline that denial of the Armenian Genocide, is a product of racism, religious intolerance, as well as politics and the lacking capacity of the Turkish government to provide its people with a system that allows freedom of speech and freedom of expression, of which was born in the western world. It is an offshoot of a particular level in the development of the capitalist society; it is the result of an advanced stage of a certain mode of production of ideas. It is like a hand and a glove with the process of colonial and imperialist exploitation, and democracy.

You claim there is no racism in the Turkish psyche or that no racism in Turkey as ever existed. I am rather amused by the immaturity and naivety of your claim. To claim that any race of people have not committed racism is to argue something that can only be relegated to one of distinct insanity. Should I go in and try to point out whom the racism committed by Turks was towards? Let’s see. The Kurds, the Armenians, the Assyrians, the Greeks have all had racist acts committed against them, but not just racist acts but acts motivated by religious belief.

Also you claim that the Ottoman Turks can find racial superiority over Europeans because according to your opinion Turks never persecuted its minorities, that’s just rubbish and to make such a claim you are discussing racism while at the same time putting up the notion of your racial superiority. Ever considered going behind the soft white walls, I hope so. As you sir are a hateful racist, or at a minimum you have a spiteful of westerners and western civilization and its belief systems.

Next you claim that because the Ottoman Empire of 1461 tolerated the Armenian’s, Greeks beliefs that ideas of this point in time must therefore apply to the whole history of the Ottoman Empire and its Turkish people are quite simply bizarre, as throughout that Empire people were actually encouraged to disown their faith for Islam or join the military with the threat of retribution if they did not in many periods of the Ottoman Empire.

Again back to your claims of Aryan, oops my error Turkish racial superiority. So an Armenian was allowed to be foreign minister, in my own country of New Zealand a Maori was allowed to be the native minister during the early 20thth century, but he was part of the establishment, the same would have been so for that Armenian Foreign Minister you speak of, and neither establishment or minister was necessarily sympathetic to the opinion of the groups these ministers represented.

Also you speak of xxxs never being appointed into government in western societies, but that has occurred from time to time, and many xxxs were welcomed warmly into financial institutions so your notions that anti-Semitism blocked xxxs from making their way in society was false, until the rise of Nazi Germany which was later defeated and led to the rapid decline of anti-Semitism in many places throughout Europe.

As for Hitler he did learn something from the Turks in how to commit Genocide, because he obviously had some recognition of the Armenian Genocide when he said, and I know you dismiss this “Who, after all, speaks today of the annihilation of the Armenians?”. There was racism in Europe I agree but I find it rather stupid of you to claim that a hardliner pacifist like Neville Chamberlain was racist; he appeased Germany because he truly believed it was the only way to save Europe from a world war he rightfully believed would destroy whole parts of Europe, eventually he hoped Hitler would see reason and stop his destruction and hate but as we well know Hitler did not.

As for racism itself it is everywhere, every race is guilty of it…whether it be European, Asian, Middle Eastern, African or Turkish, don’t lie and say Turks never commit racism because you only make yourself look stupid and stubborn, though I am sure it these are two qualities that make your books so popular and well established.
You have found some Armenian racism towards Turk’s. Congratulations, for proving me correct that some Armenians, just like Turks, and any other race can be racist. You refer to this quote : "... the Turk is not a member of the best human race- the Indo-European, or Arian, like the Armenians. The Turk does not belong even to the next best of races, the semitic...the Turk is a wild beast to be caged. [We] beg pardon of the hounds, hyenas...and all wild beasts for using their names in simile or metaphor...".

The greatest irony of this is that this was the same view is held by some racist or religiously motivated Turks. As in the Koran (as an atheist I don’t consider it any worse or better than another religion) it is mentioned basically that Christians are nothing better than cattle because they do not believe in Allah. However the Koran also spoke of tolerating other faiths, which is why other faiths such as Christianity were tolerated in the Ottoman Empire. But the Ottoman Empire failed the teaching of the Koran and attempted to wipe out the Assyrians, Armenians and in many cases the Greeks many times, the greatest destruction being that of the Armenian and Assyrian genocides committed by Turks.

If you dislike racist publications it is amusing you deny the Ottoman Empire and Turkish Republic have racism while at the same time writing racist or religiously intolerant publications yourself, denying the Armenian genocide for political, religious and of course racial reasons. It is unfortunate that racist, religious intolerant publications have become the teachers of a number of parliamentarians and conditioned them, along with the organized and politicized propaganda of the Turkish pressure groups who are so active in Washington, D.C.

However, such an assault on the Armenians, Kurds, Greeks, Assyrians and their views represents something like a lynch mob. One should note that such an attitude may
well augur the advent of a new form of a totalitarian society.

The Freudian terms of psychology have been disproved as have the vast majority of his psychological theories; this is well established and believed throughout the psychological profession. Yet you bring up flawed and bizarre theories to prove your point, very strange, and you believe yourself such a distinguished mind.

Such a distorted version of events contradicts what actually happened in history. Throughout the late 20th century and now 21st there was a non stop news coverage in the Western Allied against the Armenians. None of the attacks, destruction, murder, massacre, theft, pillage, and rape on the Armenians were ever reported. There was even a law against such reporting, on the basis of "aiding the enemy". In the meantime, however, the Turkish Republic had joined hands with Armenia's enemies who provided Islamic and Azeri terrorists with weapons, ammunition, military training, uniforms, logistics, lines of communications, and money.

Kind leaders may try to tell others the truth of the Armenian Genocide or say that if the Turkish people are given enough time, things will be right. This will not be the case, so long as the actual breeding source of genocide, which is racism, religious intolerance and bad politics, remains as it is in Turkish society.

Best wishes,
A Debunker of racism, religious intolerance, and bad politics.

^I decided to debunk him. You may or may not agree with the way I did it. But I did my best.

[Gavur]

Re: Letter from Prof. Ataov to US Senator about Armenian-Turkish issue

wow, when did you write all this?

[hipeter924]

Re: Letter from Prof. Ataov to US Senator about Armenian-Turkish issue

wow, when did you write all this?

It took an hour and a half I think. So about that long ago.

[Mukuch]

Re: Letter from Prof. Ataov to US Senator about Armenian-Turkish issue

Regarding Mukuch's comments: Just like anybody else, I have been in this "self explanation" cycle several times and do not want to revolve around this circle once again. And more importantly I do not have neither the time nor the will to respond someone indirectly telling me "mentally disabled" without even reading my previous posts, or waiting for my answer. I do not feel my answer will mean anything. I am not even mentioning the Mukuch's tone in the following posts. Nothing personal, Mukuch, believe me, nothing personal. This is just the way how this forum is working.

I didn’t call you mentally disabled do not put words in my mouth. Unless you are really in this forum for proving that Armenian have committed a Genocide against turks. It is obvious that just mentally disabled can truly believe in such a thing.
By the way what is wrong with my ton? Dose it offend your turkish snobbism?