Erdogan Finally Admits Turkey Practiced Ethnic Cleansing

[Anoush]

Re: Erdogan Finally Admits Turkey Practiced Ethnic Cleansing

Eddo jan,

Myself and others too in here are simply stating the facts. As you yourself stated some facts too; but we would have wished that the facts were not so and we hope and wish that things start changing in turkey for the sake of the people, for their belief system and their mental health too.

Of course it would be very good to have neighbours that we can trust and have them more like allies rather than number one enemies; but quite unfortunately we don't think it is bound to happen in the foreseeable future. It may take a century or two and numerous generations for things to really get better.

[Eddo211]

Re: Erdogan Finally Admits Turkey Practiced Ethnic Cleansing

Wow, this thread really picked up since I have been gone (I gotta do some catching up). Way the go Anoush jan……….you tell’m girl.


Hey firat………….what is your parent’s first language?

Anyway, I wished there were more Turks like you in Turkey but the reality of the situation is much different. Here is a perspective I got from another Turk a while back (can’t remember if it was here or somewhere else). He said Turks are unaware of the phrase "Do onto others as you would wish them do onto you". They have no sense of empathy. They always claim possession over everything and always consider themselves absolute right. What they have is a national arrogance and they can not think properly and lose their sense of Truth. So losing the sense of Truth causes a national madness and hysteria.

In my opinion the Turkish nation is suffering a mental sickness right now and it is called national paranoia and alienation. They feel so alone in the world and think that everybody in the world is the enemy of Turks. Everybody is a traitor in the world and only they are very right. There is a saying in Turkish as you know: "There are no friends of Turks except for Turks". This is a very crippled way of thinking.
You must think about this; The Greeks hate Turks, The Armenians hate Turks, The Bulgarians hate Turks, the Romanians hate Turks, the Kurds hate Turks, the Serbians hate Turks, the Iranians hate Turks, the Arabians hate Turks. A proper person must be able to ask himself; "Is there something wrong with me?" Maybe I am wrong? But Turks never ask these kinds of questions. They don’t settle accounts with themselves. They don’t confront with their mistakes. In their minds they are always right. Actually it must be very unpleasant to live in a sick minded community like this as this community is losing touch with the world community and humanity day by day. Also there is no freedom of speech in Turkey because if you express your opinions about the Turkish community they make you pay for this for the reason of "insulting the Turkishness".

So in my opinion the country MUST question itself from the beginning to the end. There must be a cultural revolution. They must question how the Kurds were persecuted since 1923………………how many thousands of people killed by the Republic in 1921-1925-1928-1937 Kurdish rebellions. What happened in Diyarbakır prisons? They couldn’t even question the junta leader Kenan Evren.
Remember democracy does not mean to do and believe everything your government tells you. As a citizen of a democratic nation it is your highest duty to question and hold your officials responsible to do the best they can for the benefit of its people.

With that said……………there can never be democracy in Turkey because democracy is a way of thinking, a way of life; it is respect for freedom of thinking, freedom of speech. Turkish people have never adopted this way of thinking because they are familiar with dictating one's ideas by force, oppressing people with intolerance. This is the way you do it in Turkey.

[Joseph]

Re: Erdogan Finally Admits Turkey Practiced Ethnic Cleansing

Everyone:

Can we please try to remain civil and cease from insults and name-calling?

[Anoush]

Re: Erdogan Finally Admits Turkey Practiced Ethnic Cleansing

I meant those Armenians living in the territories occupied by Russians. Not the ones sent to Der El Zor.

Listen... My own grandfather was a colonel in the turkish army and he fought against the Russians and some of his own compatriots. The same with many other Armenians who fought against the Russian army. Now the same applied to the Armenians living in Russia. They fought on the side of Russia because they were living in there, right? And who did they fought against? Some of them were Armenian soldiers who fought on the side of turkey.

When you live in any given country, you are supposed to fight for that country regardless what anscestral or ethnicity you belong to.

So you claim that the fear of the Azeris were unnecessary. Nothing would have happened to them if they had stayed. And they are always welcome to come back to their homes. Do I understand you right Anush?

I didn't say that the fear of the azeris was or was not justified; however they mostly chose to get away and leave their homes with the azeri army who were retreating from the Armenian army.

Now if you are asking me if nothing would happen to them or not, it was up to them.... they could have stayed and fight like brave men, but they didn't and they retreated. Therefore it was the azeri civilians who abandoned their homes.

Whether they are welcomed to come back to their homes or not; I believe you should ask that question to the Nagorno Karapakh Arsakh's government who are in charge. Write them a letter and ask them yourself as they are in authority not I.

What is "turkish Attaturks"?? What has Meds Yeghern to do with Ataturk?

What the Ittihadist government didn't finish annihilating the complete Armenian race/nationality, Attaturk finished it off. Read the book on the Burning Smyrna. From 1922-23 massacres of the Armenians and the Greeks. About 130,000 Armenians were annihilated and then the Greek civilians were annihilated.

Oh so now you learned from Obama about using the Armenian word "Meds Yeghern". NO NO NO it was a Genocide. A Genocide of the Armenian race/nation of 2,100,000 Million innocent civilians, hard working and the bread and butter of turkey.

As a friendly advice, do not turn into hostile that easily Anush Jan. I'm not blind or deaf.

Lets face it you are not giving me a friendly advice or a note. You are in denial of our Armenian race's Genocide and that is nothing but friendly Seruven.

Btw; I didn't say deaf, you said it yourself. And I said are you blind as an analagy; because you read the above posts and you are still not seeing the words and the sentences that are in front of you and you are trying to find and search for loopholes to blame us for your nationality's Genocidal acts of barbarities and inhumanities.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Erdogan Finally Admits Turkey Practiced Ethnic Cleansing

What has Meds Yeghern to do with Ataturk?
As a friendly advice, do not turn into hostile that easily Anush Jan. I'm not blind or deaf.

Ok, there is no need for insult to injury by using jackass Obama's clever way around not using the word Genocide. His speech might have been useful in Armenia when addressing Armenian people but when addressing the english speaking world, it was an outright slap in the face. The least he could have done is admit he stole a reference from John Paul II.

[Sako]

Re: Erdogan Finally Admits Turkey Practiced Ethnic Cleansing

I asked my Azeri roommate about what you said. He doesn't know much about Azeris living in Armenia. But he told that still there are Armenians living in Azerbaijan.
(As a note, he said that his aunt has Armenian friends and they do not have any problems. It's relieving to hear such stories.)

I agree.

So I'm mistaken, thanks for correction Saco. Yet, I believe that these populations are much small, compared to pre-war numbers. Any idea, Saco? I'll be glad to be mistaken again.

Bro, there are many Azeris here. Only recently, one young Azeri soldier crossed the border and doesn't want to go back. His officers were mercilessly beating him up and abusing him. He talked over the news (Shant TV), hoping to let his family know that he's ok. There are handfuls of refugees both here and in Azerbaijan. No doubts there. But naturally, there aren't big populations or anything. Hope I could help kardesh.

[seruven]

Re: Erdogan Finally Admits Turkey Practiced Ethnic Cleansing

There are Azeris here in Armenia and there are Armenians in Azerbaijan. Do a little more research kardesh.

I asked my Azeri roommate about what you said. He doesn't know much about Azeris living in Armenia. But he told that still there are Armenians living in Azerbaijan.
(As a note, he said that his aunt has Armenian friends and they do not have any problems. It's relieving to hear such stories.)
So I'm mistaken, thanks for correction Saco. Yet, I believe that these populations are much small, compared to pre-war numbers. Any idea, Saco? I'll be glad to be mistaken again.

[seruven]

Re: Erdogan Finally Admits Turkey Practiced Ethnic Cleansing

The very few Armenians who luckily survived and went back with the Russian Army were in the Van region only.

I meant those Armenians living in the territories occupied by Russians. Not the ones sent to Der El Zor.

What excuses? Didn't you read what Josephe explained to you? The azeris pulled away much before their army retreated. The azeris left their homes from the winning Armenian army even days before. How could you say that the Armenians were responsible for that? Your responsible party was the azeri people who were frightened and left their homes. Armenians had nothing to do with it.

So you claim that the fear of the Azeris were unnecessary. Nothing would have happened to them if they had stayed. And they are always welcome to come back to their homes. Do I understand you right Anush?

Why should Armenians take the fault of the Genocidal turkish or azeris acts? The turkish Ittihadists and the turkish Attaturks en masse did a grave Genocide against all Armenians; (men, old men and old women, women, children and even pregnant women), they were 2,100,000 innocent civilian people living in turkey as citizens; and the turkish Ittihadists did such a horrendous crime that it cannot be forgotten and shall not be forgotten. Armenians were the victims. Are you blind not to see it clearly, truthfully and factually?

What is "turkish Attaturks"?? What has Meds Yeghern to do with Ataturk?
As a friendly advice, do not turn into hostile that easily Anush Jan. I'm not blind or deaf.

[Sako]

Re: Erdogan Finally Admits Turkey Practiced Ethnic Cleansing

As for the ongoing discussion.. Today, we don't have any Azeris living in Armenia or any Armenians living in Azerbaijan. It's ridiculous to make up excuses in order to explain this situation.

There are Azeris here in Armenia and there are Armenians in Azerbaijan. Do a little more research kardesh.

[Anoush]

Re: Erdogan Finally Admits Turkey Practiced Ethnic Cleansing

That retreat story is very similar to the one told about Armenians in 1915

To make such a totally biased and denialist comments you are on the side of the denialists then. You are yourself acting on the side of the genocidal turks, because the last phase of the Genocide is DENIAL.

The Armenians didn't go with the Russians or anyone else. Read the REAL history. The Armenians were walking the death marches NOT even exile. Because when they were more than half dead and only less than the third who survived after walking the death marches, they were annihilated or starved to death when they finally arrived down the Arabian deserts as they were burned in effigy in Shadaddie which was a huge and deep cave in the Syrian desert. They were mostly parished in Der el zor by being annihilated by the Ittihadist soldiers.

I tell you what, why don't you read "The Crossing Place" by Philip Marsden. And you'll know what really happened to the Armenians in 1915 when they walked the death marches.

(in that case, it was the Russian Army and the Armenian people retreating).

The very few Armenians who luckily survived and went back with the Russian Army were in the Van region only. When the Genocide heppened, they were the only ones who survived who fought against the turkish army and the Ittihadists who wanted to kill each and every one of them. They put up a good fight, thank goodness; later the Russian army came and they were not wiped out by the Ittihadist Genocidal regime.

However, whatever excuses are asserted, the outcome (the fact that many people are pulled away from their homes) does not change.

What excuses? Didn't you read what Josephe explained to you? The azeris pulled away much before their army retreated. The azeris left their homes from the winning Armenian army even days before. How could you say that the Armenians were responsible for that? Your responsible party was the azeri people who were frightened and left their homes. Armenians had nothing to do with it.

I notice a difference between Turkish and Armenian people though I've very little experience with the latter one, which is based upon my stay on this forum. The ratio of the Turks who can accept his/her nation's faults are higher than the ratio of Armenians. Anyway. Just a humble observation.

Why should Armenians take the fault of the Genocidal turkish or azeris acts? The turkish Ittihadists and the turkish Attaturks en masse did a grave Genocide against all Armenians; (men, old men and old women, women, children and even pregnant women), they were 2,100,000 innocent civilian people living in turkey as citizens; and the turkish Ittihadists did such a horrendous crime that it cannot be forgotten and shall not be forgotten. Armenians were the victims. Are you blind not to see it clearly, truthfully and factually?