America's Financial Crisis

[Armenian]

Re: America's Financial Crisis

Armenian, I don't need to state the obvious. You can get your message across without resorting to insults or denigrating the poster.

Sorry Anon, I thought for a moment this was the "Ankap" thread. Nonetheless, had Muhaha been polite in attempting to engage me in a debate in several other threads I would not have been as condescending towards him/her/it.

[Muhaha]

Re: America's Financial Crisis

I wonder, would you apply this 'reasoning' to other political entities such as Soviet Union, Iran, Turkey, Russian Federation, Nazi Germany???

Yes, I apply it to everything.

for a regime that is overtly exporting "freedom", "democracy" and "human rights," the ruling elite in this nation has caused more death and destruction than Nazi Germany.

Nazi Germany inflicted more than 30+ Million deaths. You're going to have to tell me what the United States has done to top that.

For a regime that is overtly exporting a global "fight against corruption", the ruling elite in this nation is by far to most corrupt in the world.

I haven't even heard about this "Global Fight Against Corruption". If there is one, I agree it needs to be fought over here a little bit.

For a regime that is overtly exporting a "war on terrorism", the policies of Washington DC terrorizes millions globally on a daily basis.

Who,Where,How.

Let me feed you some rational, little child. First of all, we only get to hear and read a 'tiny' portion of the shit that actually goes on in this country because unlike in developing nation (like in Armenia) where the US has stationed CIA front offices to incite civil unrest by exposing "corruption" and "human rights" violations, no such organizations exits in this country.

What do you call Human Rights Watch constantly updating on GITMO. What do you call the ACLU constantly fighting against the PATRIOT ACT. Apart from these organizations, Freedom of the Press is there for a reason. Are you going to tell me Alex Jones,Michael Moore, and Keith Olbermann are somehow defending the government and not covering irregularities?

Moreover, when news such as the ones I highlighted above makes the underground media, or when large numbers of people begin talking about them, "mainstream" news media executives are sometimes forced to allow 'limited' reporting.

I agree, and most people know this which is why Cable isn't the only place people get their news. There are countless medians,countless investigators, and countless sources to get your news. That's the beauty of the First Amendment.

Nonetheless, when was the last time you saw mainstream news editorials or media executives calling for serious inquires and persistently pursuing cases in an attempt to unravel cases that involve high level government corruption or government sponsored murder in this country?

You're right about this,Keith Olbermann is the only one in that's in the mainstream I've seen come close to investigating government corruption, and that's all going to change because he makes no attempt to hide the fact he's in the tank for Obama.

But again, I'd like to say, I doubt there are a whole lot of people whose only source of information is "Mainstream News". Cable news and major publications are not the only news and is not representative of what people are aware of. If anything, Mainstream News is just the background off of which we compare and contrast other stories.

For example: Who the xxxx today is pursuing the murderers of the Beltway Madam?

If you have gathered up enough evidence and are absolutely convinced the official account is a fabrication, then please contact the proper authorities. Democracy means "Government by the people, for the people", which means the people have to do some work and correct the mistakes of the Government and authorities in charge. It seems as though you have.

Who the xxxx today is seriously pursuing the events of September 11, 2001?

I agree, it needs to be looked into. Although I stop short at saying the government actively pushed for something like that to happen, there are a lot of reasons to believe the Bush Administration let it happen. That's just as bad and I'm the last person on Earth to defend the guys currently occupying office.

Who the xxxx today is pursuing serious charges against America's most wealthy and most corrupt entities like Haliburton, Bechtel, Black Water?

Exactly, you're not the first person to notice there's something fishy. I agree completely that not enough is being done about these criminals.

Who the xxxx today is seriously pursuing the trillions of dollars gone missing in this country during the past several years?

I had heard about billions missing, not trillions. It doesn't matter, that money is all taxes and needs to be accounted for. This is another thing not too many are covering and I'm not going to defend it.

My God... Your shallowness and ignorance seems to have no limits nor shame. How old are you? Regardless of your age, I am glad you are here. I want other Armenians to see just how intellectually challenged and ethically deficient American-Armenians tend to be, and the reason why I spend so much time here providing alternative points of view...

You are a shining example of ignorance and shallowness. My weekend advice for you: you need to pull your head out of your ass as well.

I'd also like to thank you for your criticism, one of the only ways to make progress is to listen to and reflect on critique,criticism, and judgment.

Sorry Anon, I thought for a moment this was the "Ankap" thread. Nonetheless, had Muhaha been polite in attempting to engage me in a debate in several other threads I would not have been as condescending towards him/her/it.

How was I condescending? I've used nothing but plain English in all my posts, whether it's with you or others. I've never used slang, I've never used four letter words.

[Armenian]

Re: America's Financial Crisis

Nazi Germany inflicted more than 30+ Million deaths. You're going to have to tell me what the United States has done to top that.

Try tens of millions of native Americans to start with. Then throw in several million Africans, several million Vietnamese, well over a million Iraqis, the direct or indirect murder of Serbs, Central Americans, Afghans, Iranians, Cubans, Palestinians, Russians... And may I add that unlike the Second World War deaths, most of the figures I am bringing up are none war related deaths. Thus, they can be characterized as genocide or mass murder. Plus, Nazi Germany never packaged itself as champions of freedom and democracy.

What's more, the Obama administration will be just as bad if not worst then the previous thieves and criminals that administered the empire. You know why, Muhaha? It's because there is no such thing as "democracy" here. Elections here are a two ring circus, and the ring masters are the financial elite. Democrats and Republicans are two factions of one party. In order for an individual to be able to rise to the throne of this massive empire he or she needs to pledge obedience to the ruling elite. Simply put, presidents in America are nothing but representatives or chief executive officers of special interests.

You may want to debate me four years from now regarding how much of an "open book" or a change in course the Obama administration is.

Judging by your words, I am not expecting you to understand any of what I'm saying. And I am sorry if I was harsh towards you, it's just that I know your type all to well. Frankly speaking, I tired of stupidity, especially the kind of stupidity Armenians in America portray.

Anyway, I'm done with you

[Muhaha]

Re: America's Financial Crisis

I know you said you're done with me, but it's only natural for me to want to respond.

EDIT: If you don't respond, I'd like to state this has been a debate that I enjoyed.
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Try a hundred million native Americans to start with.

You said:

for a regime that is overtly exporting "freedom", "democracy" and "human rights," the ruling elite in this nation has caused more death and destruction than Nazi Germany.

"The Ruling Elite",We're obviously talking about today's politicians and the United States after World War 2. Surely you don't mean a hundred million Native Americans were killed during the last half century?Do you?

Then throw in several million Africans

Same story unless you mean the current government is currently oppressing most of the African American population, that's an entire debate by itself.

several million Vietnamese, well over a million Iraqis, the direct or indirect murder of Serbs, Central Americans, Afghans, Iranians, Cubans, Palestinians, Russians... And may I add that unlike the Second World War deaths, most of the figures I am bringing up are none war related deaths. Thus, they can be characterized as genocide or mass murder.

The deaths of these people are tragic and I won't defend the U.S regarding them. But the numbers don't come close to 30 Million.



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Also, since you didn't respond to the rest of my post, is it safe to assume we're in agreement with the statements I made?

[Armenian]

Re: America's Financial Crisis

EDIT: If you don't respond, I'd like to state this has been a debate that I enjoyed.

Ow... I feel all warm and fuzzy now.

Judging by 'some' or your replies (in which you more-or-less agreed with me ), I think there is hope for you. You just need to wake up from your deep sleep to see the big picture.

[jgk3]

Re: America's Financial Crisis

The deaths of these people are tragic and I won't defend the U.S regarding them. But the numbers don't come close to 30 Million.

How convenient of you to blame the loss of 30 million lives on the political losers of WWII.

[Muhaha]

Re: America's Financial Crisis

How convenient of you to blame the loss of 30 million lives on the political losers of WWII.

The total losses of WW2 were more than 50 Million, I blame the other 20 on the political winners. But how can you not blame Nazi Germany for the loss of 20 million Soviet Union citizens...? How can you not blame Nazi Germany for the loss of give or take 5-6 million xxxs?

[jgk3]

Re: America's Financial Crisis

The total losses of WW2 were more than 50 Million, I blame the other 20 on the political winners. But how can you not blame Nazi Germany for the loss of 20 million Soviet Union citizens...? How can you not blame Nazi Germany for the loss of give or take 5-6 million xxxs?

We simply can't know the actual figures. It is never the public that's allowed to investigate this stuff independently, and whenever they've tried, they had to play along with the politically motivated figures if it is to survive in academic literature.

The same goes to the figure of 1.5 million Armenians killed in the genocide, those who wish to politically side with Turkey don't want to admit such a figure, whilst those who want to side with Armenia on the issue, often for their own political aims (perhaps to help bolster talk of genocides done to certain groups, or to estrange Turkey from their nation), will opt to agree with Armenians on the 1.5 million dead.

Armenians stand on a conviction that the 1.5 million figure is true, xxxs stand on a conviction that their 6 million dead in the holocaust is true, the question is, what are the political consequences of other nations adopting these figures? This is the only interest when it comes to international politics, it is never about the humanitarian dimension.

In short, I may, as an Armenian, believe that 1.5 million Armenians were killed in the genocide. But what are the consequences of forcing the whole of Europe to publicly agree with my belief, or face imprisonment? Many Armenians would deem this situation desirable because it punishes Turkey, therefore, our humanitarian care, our sorrows, etc... suddenly takes on a very real, depersonalized political dimension. We feel happy with this situation, as it benefits us.

Well, the same could be said about the international consensus on the holocaust and the way it benefits Israel and modern xxxry. The same could be said about how blaming everything on Nazi Germany scares Europeans from nationalism and implicitly forces them to go along with the extremely loose immigration laws and multiculturalism that has all but destroyed the sense that they are natives on their own soil.

There's hypocrisy here and it doesn't take brains to notice.

[Muhaha]

Re: America's Financial Crisis

We simply can't know the actual figures. It is never the public that's allowed to investigate this stuff independently, and whenever they've tried, they had to play along with the politically motivated figures if it is to survive in academic literature.

I agree.

[Armenian]

Re: America's Financial Crisis

How convenient of you to blame the loss of 30 million lives on the political losers of WWII.

The point is Nazis were not parading around the world acting like some moral police force. Nazis made their intentions very clear - the eradication of the problematic Jewish infestation from within Europe and the total defeat of Bolshevism. Nazis did their best to avoid going to war against France, Britain and America but the aforementioned three chose to temporarily side with the Bolsheviks to rid Europe of National Socialism which they thought was more of an immediate threat for them than the bankrupt and primitive Bolsheviks at the time.

Nonetheless, based on some accounts, the Nazis were in a sense forced into the war. Had they not attacked the Soviet Union, many historians now believe that the Soviet Union was preparing to attack western Europe. In a sense, what the Nazi leadership did was carryout a preemptive strike. Anyway, it was a colossal war, a ruthless war to the death, and many millions of people perished as a result. But what's amazing here is the total free ride the Western ruling elite get for their crimes that historically speaking far outweigh what the Nazis did. And we know the reason why. It's because idiots like Muhaha here are told by the western establishment that its being done in the name of "democracy"...

Oops! Sorry, Muhaha.