Atheism and being Armenian

[KanadaHye]

Re: Atheism and being Armenian

You are wrong.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanitation_in_ancient_Rome -- read the "rubbish" section.

Obviously there were no garbage trucks circling cities to collect trash so it was left up to individual citizens to dispose of their rubbish. The poor districts of cities were more than likely neglected. Much like America, only the top 5% were wealthy. However, there is evidence that points to massive waste dumps that the Romans created http://news.nationalgeographic.com/n...crement-italy/

[Sip]

Re: Atheism and being Armenian

On the contrary, places like Rome and Pompeii were more than likely spotless.

You are wrong.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanitation_in_ancient_Rome -- read the "rubbish" section.

[Siggie]

Re: Atheism and being Armenian

I wouldn't call knowing how many RBI's Babe Ruth had in his career or what hair products Kim Kardashian uses as "knowledge". They don't even know how to balance a checkbook!!

Neither would I.

They have at least a basic understanding of nutrition (even if they don't practice it), causes of various illnesses and how to prevent many (STDs? Schizophrenia? Epilepsy? Heart disease? Tooth decay? Polio? Measles? Small pox? food borne illness), hygiene (hand washing, tooth brushing, deodorizing, etc.), they know the functions of at least basic organs (brain & spine, lungs, heart, stomach, intestines, kidneys, the skin), they know about reproduction, they know how to disinfect a wound, to prevent bleeding out by tying tourniquets, etc. And a significant proportion of people know how to administer cpr and administer the Heimlich. Did the general public know these sorts of things in Ancient Greece and Rome?

[KanadaHye]

Re: Atheism and being Armenian

You can't guarantee that a lot of poor people died in ancient Rome and Greece due to unsanitary living conditions?

That's ok. I can guarantee you a much larger fraction of the poor died back then from unsanitary conditions than today. You somehow seem to forget people would just dump out their garbage in the middle of the street in Rome. I don't know how it is in Canada but here in the US, even the poorest of the poor get to enjoy some level of garbage removal service. What "developed countries" did you have in mind in specific?

On the contrary, places like Rome and Pompeii were more than likely spotless. Even in Jerusalem one of the old city gates is called Dung Gate because refuse was hauled out of the city through the gate, hence the name.

That's the nature of knowledge and that's part of what made your claim outrageous when you made it.

And no, that's not what I said. I didn't say they know a lot of garbage and very little knowledge. I said they know a lot, but some of it is garbage. I didn't make a statement as to what the proportions are. Note, I am not going to say "that's right you don't read well" like you say to me.

I wouldn't call knowing how many RBI's Babe Ruth had in his career or what hair products Kim Kardashian uses as "knowledge". They don't even know how to balance a checkbook!!

[Siggie]

Re: Atheism and being Armenian

THAT is not a fair comparison. Obviously, collective knowledge compounds over generations. That does not mean however that the overall rate of knowledge in the public is greater per capita. As you said, the average person knows a lot of garbage and very little if any actual knowledge.



Really? I'm really surprised at the ignorance of poverty (fiscal, cultural and educational) in the "developed" countries because I can guarantee that a lot of poor people die in developed countries due to unsanitary living conditions.

That's the nature of knowledge and that's part of what made your claim outrageous when you made it.

And no, that's not what I said. I didn't say they know a lot of garbage and very little knowledge. I said they know a lot, but some of it is garbage. I didn't make a statement as to what the proportions are. Note, I am not going to say "that's right you don't read well" like you say to me.

You can't guarantee that a lot of poor people died in ancient Rome and Greece due to unsanitary living conditions?

That's ok. I can guarantee you a much larger fraction of the poor died back then from unsanitary conditions than today. You somehow seem to forget people would just dump out their garbage in the middle of the street in Rome. I don't know how it is in Canada but here in the US, even the poorest of the poor get to enjoy some level of garbage removal service. What "developed countries" did you have in mind in specific?

I was also thinking of the physicians delivering babies or performing surgery. They weren't washing their hands before and couldn't understand why so many were dying.

What did poor Gevork ever do to you?

I needed an Average Armenian "Joe" *shrugs*

[Sip]

Re: Atheism and being Armenian

.. day compared to the average Gevork of today.

What did poor Gevork ever do to you?

[Sip]

Re: Atheism and being Armenian

I can guarantee that a lot of poor people die in developed countries due to unsanitary living conditions.

You can't guarantee that a lot of poor people died in ancient Rome and Greece due to unsanitary living conditions?

That's ok. I can guarantee you a much larger fraction of the poor died back then from unsanitary conditions than today. You somehow seem to forget people would just dump out their garbage in the middle of the street in Rome. I don't know how it is in Canada but here in the US, even the poorest of the poor get to enjoy some level of garbage removal service. What "developed countries" did you have in mind in specific?

[KanadaHye]

Re: Atheism and being Armenian

In one case you're citing the most knowledgeable and intelligent people who were doing autopsies and surgery and then you're comparing them to the general public/average person today. That's not a fair comparison. Why don't you compare surgeons of their day with surgeons of today. THAT is a fair comparison. Not the most advanced of their day compared to the average Gevork of today.
Even with your biased comparison, you're wrong. The average person today knows a great deal, the problem is that they also "know" a lot of garbage and their problem is that they don't know how to determine what is true and what isn't.

THAT is not a fair comparison. Obviously, collective knowledge compounds over generations. That does not mean however that the overall rate of knowledge in the public is greater per capita. As you said, the average person knows a lot of garbage and very little if any actual knowledge.

GERM THEORY!

Practically everyone (talking about developed countries of course) understands germs and the importance of sterilization.

Really? I'm really surprised at the ignorance of poverty (fiscal, cultural and educational) in the "developed" countries because I can guarantee that a lot of poor people die in developed countries due to unsanitary living conditions.

[Siggie]

Re: Atheism and being Armenian

What I said was the average Greek or Roman household was more advanced in terms of general knowledge of medicine, health, food, etc. than the average idiot today getting tips from TV "doctors" and late night infomercials.

Although you are right... there were no Christians at the time of Jesus's death

In one case you're citing the most knowledgeable and intelligent people who were doing autopsies and surgery and then you're comparing them to the general public/average person today. That's not a fair comparison. Why don't you compare surgeons of their day with surgeons of today. THAT is a fair comparison. Not the most advanced of their day compared to the average Gevork of today.
Even with your biased comparison, you're wrong. The average person today knows a great deal, the problem is that they also "know" a lot of garbage and their problem is that they don't know how to determine what is true and what isn't. I can utter two words that will demonstrate unequivocally demonstrate that even the dumbest of today know more than the Ancient Greeks and Romans (or people from 1800s even)...

Ready?

GERM THEORY!

Practically everyone (talking about developed countries of course) understands germs and the importance of sterilization.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Atheism and being Armenian

Jesus didn't just die for Christians. He died for me too

Yes you are right. I am intolerant. But I am intolerant of stupidity. If you say something dumb (like ancient Greeks and Romans were more advanced than us), I'll call you out on it. If you say something smart (like when you said Earth and Sun go around each other), I will praise you and will try to have meaningful discussions and dialogue.

What I said was the average Greek or Roman household was more advanced in terms of general knowledge of medicine, health, food, etc. than the average idiot today getting tips from TV "doctors" and late night infomercials.

Although you are right... there were no Christians at the time of Jesus's death