Atheism and being Armenian

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Siggie replied

06-06-2011, 11:44 AM
Re: Atheism and being Armenian

Umm... okay? See what I mean about posting for yourself only though?
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gkv replied

06-06-2011, 11:04 AM
Re: Atheism and being Armenian

or i tried something with you but it didn't work. at least i tried.
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Siggie replied

06-06-2011, 10:59 AM
Re: Atheism and being Armenian

Originally posted by gkv View Post

this either says something about the teacher or the student. or maybe this says nothing at all for there is neither a teacher nor a student. or the teacher only exists in the student's mind. does the student have a mind? this is yet another open question. but what is a question to start with?

I'm fairly confident it's not me. You seem to have a gift for using a lot of words, but saying nothing.
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gkv replied

06-06-2011, 10:25 AM
Re: Atheism and being Armenian

Originally posted by Siggie View Post

<iframe width="425" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/XrbumvF-Oe4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

this either says something about the teacher or the student. or maybe this says nothing at all for there is neither a teacher nor a student. or the teacher only exists in the student's mind. does the student have a mind? this is yet another open question. but what is a question to start with?
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Siggie replied

06-06-2011, 10:15 AM
Re: Atheism and being Armenian

Originally posted by gkv View Post

the issue with "atheists" is that their grasp of reality is restricted by their intellect.

Originally posted by Siggie View Post

In what way?

Originally posted by gkv View Post

Mt 5:3 “Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

what i said earlier is true of a number of "believers" too.
if one starts putting words to describe reality, one is already conceptualizing, breaking down the whole into parts.
this is what i'm doing here. i'm conceptualizing conceptualization.
from there, one could conceptualize non-conceptualization as being the opposite.
conceptualizing and living/"enacting" are very different things.
breaking out of the "conceptualizing" mode cannot result from a discussion which, by definition, stands on the mental plane.

Once Zhuangzi dreamt he was a butterfly, a butterfly flitting and fluttering around, happy with himself and doing as he pleased. He didn't know he was Zhuangzi. Suddenly he woke up and there he was, solid and unmistakable Zhuangzi. But he didn't know if he was Zhuangzi who had dreamt he was a butterfly, or a butterfly dreaming he was Zhuangzi.

<iframe width="425" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/XrbumvF-Oe4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
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gkv replied

06-06-2011, 10:09 AM
Re: Atheism and being Armenian

Originally posted by Siggie View Post

In what way?

Mt 5:3 “Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

what i said earlier is true of a number of "believers" too.
if one starts putting words to describe reality, one is already conceptualizing, breaking down the whole into parts.
this is what i'm doing here. i'm conceptualizing conceptualization.
from there, one could conceptualize non-conceptualization as being the opposite.
conceptualizing and living/"enacting" are very different things.
breaking out of the "conceptualizing" mode cannot result from a discussion which, by definition, stands on the mental plane.

Once Zhuangzi dreamt he was a butterfly, a butterfly flitting and fluttering around, happy with himself and doing as he pleased. He didn't know he was Zhuangzi. Suddenly he woke up and there he was, solid and unmistakable Zhuangzi. But he didn't know if he was Zhuangzi who had dreamt he was a butterfly, or a butterfly dreaming he was Zhuangzi.
Leave a comment:
Siggie replied

06-06-2011, 09:28 AM
Re: Atheism and being Armenian

Originally posted by gkv View Post

the issue with "atheists" is that their grasp of reality is restricted by their intellect.

In what way?
Leave a comment:
KanadaHye replied

06-06-2011, 09:22 AM
Re: Atheism and being Armenian

Originally posted by Siggie View Post

It shakes people's world's a little less to think that you're being "trendy" or that this "trend" is over (in fact, people are becoming more and more non-religious) than to think that your lack of belief is defensible.

In regards to "trends" and "behaviour" How America works.....

Reese Witherspoon slams stars who make sex tapes

Paris Hilton and Kim Kardashian might have been blushing as they watched Reese Witherspoon at Sunday night's MTV Movie Awards.

Accepting her MTV Generation award, the Oscar-winning actress slammed stars who have appeared in sex tapes and nude-photo scandals, telling them they should be ashamed of themselves.

�I get it, girls, that it�s cool to be a bad girl,� the mom-of-two told the crowd. �But it is possible to make it in Hollywood without doing a reality show. When I came up in this business, if you made a sex tape, you were embarrassed and you hid it under your bed.�

Witherspoon also appeared to have a message for "Gossip Girl" star Blake Lively, who denied last week that she was the mystery blonde in a series of nude cell phone pics making the rounds on the Internet.

Said Witherspoon, �And if you took naked pictures of yourself on your cell phone, you hide your face, people! Hide your face!�

The "Water for Elephants" star concluded her speech with a message of hope.

�For all the girls out there, it�s totally possible to be a good girl,� she said. �I�m going to try to make it cool.�

What do you think of Witherspoon's speech?

http://marquee.blogs.cnn.com/2011/06...pes/?hpt=hp_t2
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gkv replied

06-06-2011, 09:13 AM
Re: Atheism and being Armenian

one could point out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%B6...ological_proof
which at least shows that atheism does not necessarily follow from intellectual sophistication, G�del being one of the great minds of the twentieth century.

but from a spiritual perspective, this is of (very) little interest.

speaking of great minds, i mentioned Pavel Florensky some time ago.
armenians are so quick to claim as their own, anyone remotely armenian, remotely famous that i find the lack of interest in this extraordinary personality quite astonishing.

Pavel Florensky - Wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pavel_Florensky

Pavel Florensky - OrthodoxWiki

http://en.orthodoxwiki.org/Pavel_Florensky

His father was russian, his mother from the armenian nobility.
He was raised in the most secular way by his agnostic parents.
Went through a spiritual crisis at the age of 17
A lot is related in this auto-biographical book (which does not appear to be available in english, alas)

�ditions l'�ge d'Homme

http://www.lagedhomme.com/boutique/fiche_produit.cfm?ref=9782825118603&type=1&code_lg=lg_fr&num=0

La maison d'�dition L'Age d'Homme est fond�e en 1966 � Lausanne par Vladimir Dimitrijevic. C'est sans doute � L'Age d'Homme, forte aujourd'hui de 4000 titres, que nous devons de ne plus r�duire la litt�rature russe aux seuls noms de Dosto�evski , de Tolsto� ou de Gorki. Gr�ce � la collection �Classiques Slaves�, les lecteurs ont pu d�couvrir les œuvres majeures du symbolisme russe, celle d'Andr� Biely (P�tersbourg, La Colombe d'Argent, Kotik Letaiev), d'Ossip Mandelstam, d'Alexandre Blok ; des auteurs aussi consid�rables que les polonais Witkiewicz ou Ladislas Reymont ; les �crits esth�tiques de Mal�vitch, les essais et les romans de Zamiatine, de Leskov ou de Boris Pilniak. De Ivo Andritch et Dobritsa Tchossitch aux chefs-d'œuvre d'Alexandre Zinoviev, la collection �Classiques Slaves� qui compte aujourd'hui plus de 500 titres, a permis de faire conna�tre un immense patrimoine litt�raire que le �r�alisme-socialiste� n'avait pas r�ussi � �touffer.

Last edited by gkv; 06-06-2011, 09:22 AM. Reason: added stuff about Florensky
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gkv replied

06-06-2011, 09:03 AM
Re: Atheism and being Armenian

the issue with "atheists" is that their grasp of reality is restricted by their intellect.
their approach of existence/world is conceptual only.

even as far as concepts go, they often lack conceptual knowledge of spiritual traditions.
they most likely ignore for instance the existence/preeminence of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apophatic_theology in eastern christianity.
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