Voting: Moral or Immoral?

[Stark Evade]

Voting is boring.

[Anonymouse]

Voting is boring.

Indeed. I couldn't have put it better myself.

[loseyourname]

I usually just vote for whichever third party is most popular at the time, hoping they'll get the 5% they need to receive federal funds and break up the two-party system a bit. California is never a swing-state anyway, so a presidential vote here counts for nothing. I almost always vote no for any ballot initiative or referendum, in particular anything that raises public funds. Funding a public entity is as useful as throwing your money into the Pacific, so the only thing I'll vote yes for is privatization. Until then, I will continue not to pay taxes and hope for the best. If moderates can ever take control of the Republican party, I might start voting for them. We'll see.

I'd like to see a far more libertarian government, but I will always be of the belief that there will always be some people who cannot be trusted to make decisions for themselves. Free the markets and get rid of social engineering, but we need to have some form of coherent national policy, as well as basic contract-enforcement and defense agencies. These don't necessarily need to be public entities, but it's hard to imagine how they could be funded any other way - they certainly won't be turning any profits.

[jilbagh]

A major right in being a citizen of the United States is that in the democratic system in place, you have the power of the right to vote. Voting for a certain candidate can signal what issues you most believe in because that candidate advocates them.

You can vote government out! As we saw in California with the special recall election. You can contact and lobby your local official representing you, that you voted for, to vote in the level they serve in to vote against a bill, or vote to impeach.

It is important to vote, how a certain vote goes is important in how your life is impacted by the laws, legistation, propositions and the lawmakers that represent you.

And if you don't vote, don't complain about paying the taxes, people in office making the wrong decisions, raised fees (medical, education, etc...).

The right to vote is yours, so is the decision to empower yourself with it.

*I'm Sevag Amo and I approved this message.*

[nunechka]

i agree with you jilbagh... very good point...

i also believe that this is the way our world functions, and to believe that there is no need for a governing body, is to believe that there is no need for order and law... the only way to have a governing body is to have it by selected by people, so it will serve the people...
right now, the bushies, dont have this, they have a rather slightly different form of anarchy over our governemnt, and it is discouraging people to do anything...

i understand that i hear it from my parent all the time... "our vote doesnt count" but thats exactly what THEY want you to think, and hence you will not vote and they will have control over you and every move you make... if this is how many people start to feel, then they have succeeded... they have made a mass populas of people who feel that voting is a waste of time... so they win, and we loose, and thats it...

i like voting... and i think its a right we ought to exercise... after all if there is no one that can keep law and order then how are we going to get rid of crimals? or stop human rights abuse in countries and by corporations... ???

so how do we stop another type of armenian genocide from happening, we vote out bad people like bush, who kills people all over the world, and we vote in people who are not violent and who will not abuse the rights of people...

VOTING COUNTS, and VOTING is IMPORTANT...

if you dont agree, there is no reason to insult me... i understand your position, but you must understand my position also...

[Anonymouse]

A major right in being a citizen of the United States is that in the democratic system in place, you have the power of the right to vote. Voting for a certain candidate can signal what issues you most believe in because that candidate advocates them.

You can vote government out! As we saw in California with the special recall election. You can contact and lobby your local official representing you, that you voted for, to vote in the level they serve in to vote against a bill, or vote to impeach.

It is important to vote, how a certain vote goes is important in how your life is impacted by the laws, legistation, propositions and the lawmakers that represent you.

And if you don't vote, don't complain about paying the taxes, people in office making the wrong decisions, raised fees (medical, education, etc...).

The right to vote is yours, so is the decision to empower yourself with it.

*I'm Sevag Amo and I approved this message.*

i agree with you jilbagh... very good point...

i also believe that this is the way our world functions, and to believe that there is no need for a governing body, is to believe that there is no need for order and law... the only way to have a governing body is to have it by selected by people, so it will serve the people...
right now, the bushies, dont have this, they have a rather slightly different form of anarchy over our governemnt, and it is discouraging people to do anything...

i understand that i hear it from my parent all the time... "our vote doesnt count" but thats exactly what THEY want you to think, and hence you will not vote and they will have control over you and every move you make... if this is how many people start to feel, then they have succeeded... they have made a mass populas of people who feel that voting is a waste of time... so they win, and we loose, and thats it...

i like voting... and i think its a right we ought to exercise... after all if there is no one that can keep law and order then how are we going to get rid of crimals? or stop human rights abuse in countries and by corporations... ???

so how do we stop another type of armenian genocide from happening, we vote out bad people like bush, who kills people all over the world, and we vote in people who are not violent and who will not abuse the rights of people...

VOTING COUNTS, and VOTING is IMPORTANT...

if you dont agree, there is no reason to insult me... i understand your position, but you must understand my position also...

I never imagine opinions can get as naive as these, however, they are still worth addressing.

The fact that "jilbaaaaaaakh" doesn't understand what "voting the government out" means, apparently is something the masses at large do not understand either. By voting the government out, Mr. jilbaaaaaaaaaaakh, we do not mean changing faces, we mean voting the government out, but the example you used in fact helped my argument for it reinforced my argument that the government always gets elected no matter who you vote for. So if voting would really changed anything, it would be illegal.

As far as your silly contention that those of us who do not vote have no right to criticize, I only pray that you familiarize yourself with real time concepts. Government by its nature is defined as a territorial monopoly of force. Taxation is nothing more than theft in the form of aggression. I have no choice or say in the matter, even if I did not want the government taxing me and taking my hard earned money, I have no say, no matter how much I do not agree with the idea of government itself. That, my little naive Care Bears, is aggression. Now, if I don't want to vote because I do not agree with the said system, then I have every right to criticize it, for I did not initially put my energies into the system to begin with. Those of you who voted for one of the two dumb candidates have only yourselves to blame. So the whole contention is backwards, as Gene Callahan put it best:

To see why, imagine a stranger approaching you, a gun in his hand, and declaring that you have the "right" to play Russian roulette with him. If you don't exercise your right, he says, he still plans to aim his gun at you, spin the cylinder, and then pull the trigger. If you agree to take part in his proposed game, it seems to me, then you have weakened the force of any protest you might lodge about the outcome. On the other hand, if you tell him you want no part of such foolishness, and that he should leave you alone, then how in the world would that negate your right to object to his plan?

Isn't our "right" to vote closely analogous to that situation? Although I'm offered the chance to take my own turn spinning the cylinder and pulling the trigger of the gun, I'm not permitted to opt out of my role as a potential target. If I attempt to ignore the outcome of an election, based on the simple fact that I never agreed to abide by it in the first place, the State is prepared to use deadly force against me, in order to compel me to pay attention. Why should my refusal to participate in the State's aggressive schemes mean that I could no longer criticize them?

By voting, all you do is plunge everybody else into the mess that you voted for. So technically, it is who you cannot criticize if the morons you vote for end up being bad apples, which they usually are. I, on the other hand, have every right to criticize the idiotic decision you voters have made.

[Anonymouse]

I believe G.K. Chesterton long ago identified the flaw in the system: “The democracy has the right to answer questions, but it has no right to ask them. It is still the political aristocracy that asks the questions. And we shall not be unreasonably cynical if we suppose that the political aristocracy will always be rather careful what questions it asks.”

[jilbagh]

Well then I suggest moving to a country that better suits the type of goverment you want

[Anonymouse]

Apathy is the second leading cause of death of most Americans.

[hyebruin]

Apathy is the second leading cause of death of most Americans.

ooo, i like that!!! there IS wisdom in that!! apathy can lead to heart disease and cancer (if you abandon the western mechanistic approach to medicine) and look at dis-ease as a consequence of the soul's unhappiness and restlesness and the lack of a fulfilling life!