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Հայոց ճակատագիր

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  • #1

    Հայոց ճակատագիր

    Originally posted by tunot
    If it makes our nation continue to exist as it is, then it's evil, because it is forcing us to be weak against our enemies, it is forcing us into a position which makes us vulnerable for another genocide, and it is forcing us to be under the constant threat of being on the verge of extinction.
    Could it be I just read the above statement from you? One would think you are me.
    Achkerov kute.
    Tags: None
  • #2
    Re: notes / comments

    Actually, I've been saying the same thing over and over again ever since you opened a thread on language.

    Comment

    • #3
      Re: notes / comments

      Originally posted by tunot
      Actually, I've been saying the same thing over and over again ever since you opened a thread on language.
      Actually, Nairi, you haven't and let's not go there and leave it at that.
      Achkerov kute.

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      • #4
        Re: notes / comments

        Originally posted by Anonymouse
        Actually, Nairi, you haven't and let's not go there and leave it at that.
        Stop twisting my words around. I did. And very clearly so. What you are saying, however, is that our solution lies in pumping out more pups than we are pumping out now. Moreover, your solution is that we should stop mixing because that would be a detriment to our so-called blood. I keep repeating over and over again that that is NOT our problem. Our problem is much simpler than that: namely, that we have plenty of members, but that most of them prefer to assimilate. In other words: you can pump out as many pups as you like, but it won't make a lick of difference when the overwhelming majority of them will choose at some point or another to stop belonging to your breed. Capiche? Now try to find a solution for that. It can't be that hard, can it?

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        • #5
          Re: notes / comments

          You say that no matter how pure or mixed you (diasporans) are, you'll be assimilated. Then when I say, "If they learn about their heritage, they'll feel more comfortable accepting their heritage and will support it (the good sides)", and you say, "They leave because they know more too much about their heritage"... There's no escape, Armenians are sentenced to extinction?

          What kind of solution do you have in your mind for Armenians?

          Comment

          • #6
            Re: notes / comments

            Originally posted by jgk3
            You say that no matter how pure or mixed you (diasporans) are, you'll be assimilated. Then when I say, "If they learn about their heritage, they'll feel more comfortable accepting their heritage and will support it (the good sides)", and you say, "They leave because they know more too much about their heritage"... There's no escape, Armenians are sentenced to extinction?

            What kind of solution do you have in your mind for Armenians?
            I think Ara has given quite enough solutions in his long career of writing. Maybe it's time we followed up on it, instead of merely reading it and either liking it or disliking it.

            Comment

            • #7
              Re: notes / comments

              Ara's solutions speak to us at the individual level, otherwise they would generate propaganda.

              We must work on our selves, unit by unit, to generate an intelligent group of people.

              When Ara criticizes Armenians, he doesn't really tell Armenians what the solution might be... Those "solutions" are "what if"s, they are merely designed to show an alternate path that can only be followed by one's own choice, and I stress the "one". If it's more than one person, it's a big bonus.

              Perhaps asking for a solution for Armenians as a whole was a stupid question. We are human beings before Armenians. We should learn to grow as human beings before taking part in our heritage, otherwise we'll do nothing but harm it further.

              Of course, our ideas of what it means to be human may differ, but I think it's important to ask this question before dealing with heritage.

              Comment

              • #8
                Re: notes / comments

                Originally posted by tunot
                Stop twisting my words around. I did. And very clearly so. What you are saying, however, is that our solution lies in pumping out more pups than we are pumping out now. Moreover, your solution is that we should stop mixing because that would be a detriment to our so-called blood. I keep repeating over and over again that that is NOT our problem. Our problem is much simpler than that: namely, that we have plenty of members, but that most of them prefer to assimilate. In other words: you can pump out as many pups as you like, but it won't make a lick of difference when the overwhelming majority of them will choose at some point or another to stop belonging to your breed. Capiche? Now try to find a solution for that. It can't be that hard, can it?
                I am not twisting anything. In the process it has actually been my words that have been twisted, for you see, what I advocate is only one part of the whole, for what I advocate cannot be or exist without what you advocate. It is, part and parcel, tied to each other, and I have more than once clarified this, only to have you ignore it.

                We don't need otaramol Armenians who cannot speak Armenian and want to dilute themselves and dabble in all sorts of self-hating escapades, just like we don't Armenians who may be the best Armenian speakers, but when it actually comes to be Armenian, they too want to dabble with anything and everything except Armenians, just like we don't need those who are Armenian conscious or lost if they do nothing more than than pointing and indictment of other Armenians who are actually trying to do something.

                And if you actually took into consideration Armenia's population implosion you would not speak so about "pumping out pups". You seem to forget that for any people to survive and grow, they need to at least have subsistence levels, to at least replace the current generation. The question you ask, who is there to carry the torch of the culture? Well? If size gradually shrinks, my guess is, less and less people will be there who will. The statistics of Armenia is what is more troubling than the fruitless diasporan jokers who are already headed toward oblivion and cannot even realize it for life is far easier to live with eyes closed. How many siblings did your grandparents have, and your parents in turn? And how many siblings did you or your sister/brother have? The comparisons will speak volumes. In my own family it does and those of my relatives and extended family. And while I do not expect uniformity in the answers to this, and there will be exceptions, but for the most part, by and large, the previous Armenian generation grew whereas this one barely sustains itself, and even that is a matter of debate.

                Capiche?
                Last edited by Anonymouse; 06-28-2006, 04:29 PM.
                Achkerov kute.

                Comment

                • #9
                  Re: notes / comments

                  Originally posted by jgk3

                  Perhaps asking for a solution for Armenians as a whole was a stupid question. We are human beings before Armenians. We should learn to grow as human beings before taking part in our heritage, otherwise we'll do nothing but harm it further.
                  I think that is a given, and all we want is to usher in the man of tomorrow who will be the Armenian of tomorrow, not yesterday, nor today. That is the goal, and how we get there is a matter of individual efforts, families and education. There are no two ways about it.
                  Achkerov kute.

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    Re: notes / comments

                    I agree.

                    Comment

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