What about divorced people?

[Anonymouse]

Re: What about divorced people?

No. I used extreme examples to illustrate a point. Every situation is different. Divorce stats tell you nothing but the stats. I appreciate and agree with your concern with people viewing (if I understand you correctly) marriage as disposable. I find that sad. I'm not at all convinced this is the 'norm' of divorce, though. How are you certain that you aren't speaking of singluarities?

Of course every situation is different, but in the grand scheme, all human behavior can be mapped as a general rule. That is the funny thing about humans, which you may not like, but is the truth. Humans behave in general tendencies, otherwise we wouldn't have psychologists, psychiatrists, marketing consultants, and the list is endless.

There are general tendecies that pervade as the rule, rather than the exceptions. I'm certain because of precisely what you state - statistics. The numbers, the figures, the statistics which have quantified, measured, and mapped humans in broad numbers, categories and sections, displaying general tendencies. You state that they are nothing but "stats", but that begs the question. For what are stats other than what the government invented as a device and a method, of trying to gain the most quick and calculated knowledge about a large group? Statistics is and was never about the absolute truth. It is bent and curved to conform to generalities rather than absolutes. Also, if it's any consolation my friend's dad is a Family Law attorney, so all the stats I do hear are usually through him.

[Anahita]

Re: What about divorced people?

Again, you are talking bell curve. I am talking outliers.

I feel for those outliers. I am one.

omg omg u just stereotyped

I think we will find the bell curve (at least dealing with some things about human beings), in time, to be somewhat 'bunk,'

You do seem (like quite a few here) to have testicular fortitude, though. I'd like the women here to speak their minds, too! (and challenge me, or anyone here... grlpwr math, no subtraction, just addition of power, boys.)

[Anonymouse]

Re: What about divorced people?

Again, you are talking bell curve. I am talking outliers.

I feel for those outliers. I am one.

See, you keep thinking this is about you, but it's not. Why assume it is? I am not speaking about you. Someone made a thread, and I commented on it in generalities. I am not talking about you. About 40% of marriages end in divorce. Of that 40%, if we deal with that as a whole category, then it becomes 100%. So from the 100% of people that divorce, there is that 10% or 20% that are exceptions, but then there is that irresponsible 80% that are the statistics I'm talking about.

I think we will find the bell curve (at least dealing with some things about human beings), in time, to be somewhat 'bunk,'

Actually, it's not 'bunk', it just displeases those politically correct special interests such as the 'racism police' and so on.

You do seem (like quite a few here) to have testicular fortitude, though. I'd like the women here to speak their minds, too! (and challenge me, or anyone here... grlpwr math, no subtraction, just addition of power, boys.)

I don't know what this is about, especially your bit about 'testicular fortitude'. I am simply stating an argument about most of divorces that occur, and they mostly occur because of the ineptitude toward life by the people who get married. I never once spoke about you. In fact, beyond this, my only worry about divorce is what it does to children. That is my biggest concern of our divorce culture.

[Anahita]

Re: What about divorced people?

See, you keep thinking this is about you, but it's not. Why assume it is? I am not speaking about you. Someone made a thread, and I commented on it in generalities. I am not talking about you. About 40% of marriages end in divorce. Of that 40%, if we deal with that as a whole category, then it becomes 100%. So from the 100% of people that divorce, there is that 10% or 20% that are exceptions, but then there is that irresponsible 80% that are the statistics I'm talking about.



Actually, it's not 'bunk', it just displeases those politically correct special interests such as the 'racism police' and so on.



I don't know what this is about, especially your bit about 'testicular fortitude'. I am simply stating an argument about most of divorces that occur, and they mostly occur because of the ineptitude toward life by the people who get married. I never once spoke about you. In fact, beyond this, my only worry about divorce is what it does to children. That is my biggest concern of our divorce culture.

Whhhhooooaa. You had me there with the 'about you.' I had a rebut, but not in any way something that is commonly accepted as 'evidence.' Testicular fortitude to = the 'balls to"

A funny thing for me, Anonymouse, is that I think you and I think in very similar ways, and often (but not always.) We are talking about some of (! not all) the same ideas as polar magnets, yet saying much of the same. I can't seem to communicte that...

See, you keep thinking this is about you

"All about me." Another funny thing is that lots IS ABOUT ME, like it or not. Sometimes, THAT even ticks me off...

"Ever wonder if it's all for you"
http://www.lyrics007.com/Red%20Hot%20Chili%20Peppers%20Lyrics/Can't%20Stop%20Lyrics.html


but the irony is that I think it being 'about me' is that 'it is about' everyone.

[Anonymouse]

Re: What about divorced people?

Whhhhooooaa. You had me there with the 'about you.' I had a rebut, but not in any way something that is commonly accepted as 'evidence.' Testicular fortitude to = the 'balls to"

The funny thing for me, Anonymouse, is that I think you and I think in very similar ways, and often (but not always.) We are talking about some of (! not all) the same ideas as polar magnets, yet saying much of the same. I can't seem to communicte that...

I think I know what you are trying to say, and that was my thought as well. I know what you meant by fortitude, but I didn't understand nor see why you felt it applied here. Me stating my opinion isn't even an issue of that. It's simply my real concern about children who have to live through divorces, who have lived through dysfunctional moments. In any event, statistics speak for themselves, how we interpret those statistics is entirely on us.

We are gifted by the will to ask ourselves, "Do I want to be a statistic? Do I want to be the general rule?" or "Do I want to be the exception?" I cannot seem to understand why people are so eager to jump into marriage, and at such early ages as well. I do understand, however, the most people out there have no idea how much of a big responsibility it is. It's literally, a 'corporate merger', to put it in economic terms.

People who do not have even their own individual lives together, get married these days. Incomplete pieces, if merged, will only breakdown each other. Sadly, not enough people have their lives together before they take on the responsibility of marriage, much less bringing another life into this world.

[Anahita]

Re: What about divorced people?

Sadly, not enough people have their lives together before they take on the responsibility of marriage, much less bringing another life into this world.

I was married for awhile before I knew we were expecting a baby. I felt like I was going to pass out, often. My whole being seemed to change.

I went to my doctor (before I ever missed a cycle).

"Am I dying?" ...

LOL


"No. You are going to have a baby."

"Wow." say I (taking deep breath)

"So, you do have opions. How are you feeling now," my doctor said.

I said, without time to be thinking prior to that, I said, "I am thinkin I'll eat more mac'n'cheese.

I 'also' (simultaneoously) thought about the 'stats' of condoms. 99%? In what way?"

My child was a blessing, in my view (that of divinity, for sure, as well, as all babies are viewed).

I DO fear (know) that not all women and men view their kids as miracles.

[karoaper]

Re: What about divorced people?

Interesting topic. I hear you Mouse and I also understand what Anahita is saying.

I think that in many cases the blame for the implosion of the marriage is due to special and dire circumstances, like adultery, abuse, etc. But overall, from what I've seen, heard and considered it is not. One of the reasons marriages implode is because the two partners were not ready psychologically for this longwinded experiment in mutual coexistence, due to being immature, selfish, mentally unstable (too many issues), etc. Such people will invariably be unable to adapt, healthily compromise, and make the relationship grow, because their own persons require some growing still. Here's I agree with Mouse that unfortunately a huge part of today's society is full of such lacking and weakness. For every mentally healthy, balanced, mature person I see, there are 20 sniveling children in adults' bodies. Such people are incapable of a healthy and long relationship. By the way, I'm not without problems either, no one is, but I'd like to believe I'm on my way to become more complete and I refuse to tie a knot until I've achieve a minimal level of mental maturity and readiness for marriage.

The second reason is that they really hadn't found their best fit. So many people I think confuse 100s of things for love and mutual fit. People make decisions about marrying someone the same way they decide on dating someone, without realizing that it is not easy to live with a person 24 hours a day every day. They rush into marriage the same way they rushed into the sack and 2 years later they are shocked to find out they have nothing in common and they seriously rub each other the wrong way. My analogy is that of buying a car (sorry to cheapen the topic). People don't buy cars because of the bells of whistles or comfy seats; they buy cars foremost because of balanced and healthy engines and solid drive train. The CD player sweetens the deal, but foremost you've got to ascertain that you can drive the car long after the sunroof is broke.

So, leading from the above mess, I'd say that a person whose marriage ended due to their mental carelessness or utter incapability to nurture it would def not be my ideal to enter into wedlock with.

[Anahita]

Re: What about divorced people?

Interesting topic. I hear you Mouse and I also understand what Anahita is saying.

I think that in many cases the blame for the implosion of the marriage is due to special and dire circumstances, like adultery, abuse, etc. So, leading from the above mess, I'd say that a person whose marriage ended due to their mental carelessness or utter incapability to nurture it would def not be my ideal to enter into wedlock with.

You are a very observant person. Any problem with an 'individual' or 'marriage' or 'family' or 'community' or 'nation' or 'nationality' or ... 'the world' kinda comes, like a circle, back to each INDIVIDUAL.

However, I'd hope the individual supports all the individuals that make up the WHOLE. (lottery of love?)

http://www.worldrevolution.org/news/feature30.htm

http://www.smh.com.au/ffximage/2005/06/30/poverty_wideweb__430x387.jpg

Anyone who thinks that's a 'guilt trip' should think about that, and the kids... Damn, I don't do enough for these babies.

Anonymouse, I read and think about what you say (not as much the links, because of time issues), but I do hope we keep up 'debate.' Becuz sometime we is on same wave.... surf on sweetie.

[Anonymouse]

Re: What about divorced people?

Interesting topic. I hear you Mouse and I also understand what Anahita is saying.

I think that in many cases the blame for the implosion of the marriage is due to special and dire circumstances, like adultery, abuse, etc. But overall, from what I've seen, heard and considered it is not. One of the reasons marriages implode is because the two partners were not ready psychologically for this longwinded experiment in mutual coexistence, due to being immature, selfish, mentally unstable (too many issues), etc. Such people will invariably be unable to adapt, healthily compromise, and make the relationship grow, because their own persons require some growing still. Here's I agree with Mouse that unfortunately a huge part of today's society is full of such lacking and weakness. For every mentally healthy, balanced, mature person I see, there are 20 sniveling children in adults' bodies. Such people are incapable of a healthy and long relationship. By the way, I'm not without problems either, no one is, but I'd like to believe I'm on my way to become more complete and I refuse to tie a knot until I've achieve a minimal level of mental maturity and readiness for marriage.

The second reason is that they really hadn't found their best fit. So many people I think confuse 100s of things for love and mutual fit. People make decisions about marrying someone the same way they decide on dating someone, without realizing that it is not easy to live with a person 24 hours a day every day. They rush into marriage the same way they rushed into the sack and 2 years later they are shocked to find out they have nothing in common and they seriously rub each other the wrong way. My analogy is that of buying a car (sorry to cheapen the topic). People don't buy cars because of the bells of whistles or comfy seats; they buy cars foremost because of balanced and healthy engines and solid drive train. The CD player sweetens the deal, but foremost you've got to ascertain that you can drive the car long after the sunroof is broke.

So, leading from the above mess, I'd say that a person whose marriage ended due to their mental carelessness or utter incapability to nurture it would def not be my ideal to enter into wedlock with.

But see, that is what most marriages are these days, and the divorces that ensue are precisely these realizations of "Oh damn, what did I do?"

Ever heard of "No fault" divorce? It practically makes it so easy to get out of marriage, that what's the point of getting married to begin with? The "No fault" language is so elastic, vague and convoluted, it essentially grants the irresponsible among us even less responsibility and committment to those 'values' they supposedly heard uttered by the priest or whatever. And the way divorce laws in America are against men, it practically nullifies men's right to anything. With these trends, why should anyone get married? You may as well just live together as 'live in' partners.

[Anahita]

Re: What about divorced people?

... With these trends, why should anyone get married? You may as well just live together as 'live in' partners.

Last point first... I see NO problem at all with 'live in' partners. (whole big issue, but my main stance is

That can be very good idea and wise, if other issues are thought about first (like... if sex is involved, potential for children would be one very important 'issue'...)

---
I guess, in my head, marriage doesn't have to mean "till DEATH do us part." For some, that is very true. But what about for those that this is not?

I guess, in my head, marriage doesn't have to mean "till DEATH do us part." For some, that is very true. But for those that this is not? (repetiton ... )

I love the of kind of relationship that my grandparents had... ... ... but that takes TWO. Their marriage was based on mutual love and respect. Each thought the 'other' was the stregth. Truth, with them, the sum of the parts really much more than...

Within the last few months, I lost both two of my (this unity) grandparents (my mom’s parents.) I grew up 'on the farm' with my parents and them. My grandpa was very ill for a year before he died. My grandparents were pretty much a ONE, a unity (they finished sentences... they let each other talk about whatever whatever whatever and then the other spoke about whatever whatever whatever). Hearing them talk was somewhat like watching a practiced ballet...

They’d been together for 60 years… and, well I don’t know how to explain that. They were literally like a 1 plus1=1.

She died (of a massive heart attack, before him). He died not too long after (and there are beautiful stories about that, too.)

He said, a day before he died, I want to see [my wife] again. She is so beautiful.