Is it wrong to date Turkish Cypriot people?

[Էլիա]

Re: Is it wrong to date Turkish Cypriot people?

And since you are originally not western people (which I think you also do not want to face with this reality) the 3th and 4th generation have also adopted this racism and apply to Turks.

Armenians don't say that they are "western people"... that's another stereotype.

[Gunner14]

Re: Is it wrong to date Turkish Cypriot people?

Only sometimes focus to your diaspora. Because my idea is you can never impose Turkey to accept genocide with international pressure. The dialogue is the only way, and to make a dialogue first both sides should stop this blind hatred.

OK...

[exfo]

Re: Is it wrong to date Turkish Cypriot people?

Most Armenians, yes most.... Don't hete middle easterners or people from the caucuses .... In fact Armenians get along the best outside of ARmenians with Persians, Greeks, and even Arabs... because there are a lot of ARmeians who speak Arabic... so exfo you're wrong thinking Armenians are xenophobic toward the people you listed....

Again, Armenians at Armenia, Syria, Lebanon, Turkey are never xenophobic towards Turks or another nation. Because our region do not have that kind of tradition. Yes, we have some other very bad behaviours such as rising blind nationalism in Turkey, radicalism at Arabic countries, territorial and historical disputes among Caucasia, etc.
BUT
We never have that kind of xenophobic and racist behaviours. This is the tradition of the western world, mainly of Europe and after 9/11 USA also adopt this trend.
Diaspora Armenians who live at western countries like France, USA and Canada have this "asiatic barbarians, mongolian savages" thing which you never get tired of repeating the same racist and xenophobic attitude at this internet forum. And since you are originally not western people (which I think you also do not want to face with this reality) the 3th and 4th generation have also adopted this racism and apply to Turks.
This is my last post about the discussion. If you have questions I welcome, but I also agree that we do not get any point. You will continue your campain (which I do not contradict with you on principle), but only one thing, when you conduct your campain about 1915 just try to focus with your peoples attitudes, too. Only sometimes focus to your diaspora. Because my idea is you can never impose Turkey to accept genocide with international pressure. The dialogue is the only way, and to make a dialogue first both sides should stop this blind hatred.

[Gunner14]

Re: Is it wrong to date Turkish Cypriot people?

[QUOTE=gizzy;173701][QUOTE=Gunner14;173698]

well, everybody have prejudices and I do aswell...its the human nature am afraid...BUT there is a level of prejudice which is acceptable and a level that is not acceptable...This example is beyond prejudice:
"Racism is a belief or ideology that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, especially to distinguish it as being either superior or inferior to another race or races. It is also the prejudice based on such a belief.Racism has been a motivating factor in social discrimination, racial segregation, hate speech and violence (such as pogroms, genocides and ethnic cleansings). "

Am sure there have been many turks here who have been rude to you guys and I have read some examples...There have been some who have been rude to me as well...But if I see an Armenian and I think "she must be defintly rude to me since am a turk" and I avoid talking with her just coz she is armenian then I am going wrong...agreed?This is prejudice...But at least its at minimum level, didnt hurt anyone...However if I go and insult her when she speaks to me using these words "you armenians are all stupid and I hate you all" for example...that would be beyond prejudice.
My point is...Am not expecting from you to wellcome every single turk here with open arms of course...I know you have many reasons for not liking them. But also many issues to discuss as well...So my advice is to be a bit more friendly, hmm at least less fanatic and give everyone a chance to express themselves before judging them... One should keep in mind not all individuals from the same ethnic background are the same (at least am not a clone, I can guarantee it)...

As I said before am not from Turkey and am not a turkish citizen...I am a citizen of Cyprus government... I dont like turkish govenrment as well ( think I made this speech b4)... I do not like turkish people who come to cyprus just to become citizens and vote in elections...I do not like turkish people who claim "cyprus is our property"...I do not like turkish people who are fanatic and I would rather not speak with them coz they make me angry...etc..
see, I have many reasons to hate turkey but I know that not every single one of their citizen are the same...My people suffered from war 30 years ago...I grew up with hate speechs towards greeks...Turkey was always praised as our "protector"...We all knew we used to live in peace in our island before the english came and this rang a bell to me...I know that we were all played by the english...It was a trap and we didnt see it coz we were manipulated...Turkey also got involved to get a bit of land for his army..these games have been played for many years and is still being played in the middle east ...does this sound familiar?

At school I have been thought to hate a greek cypriots but I instead have a positive approach towards all coz I know they were thought to hate me as well...I think it was clever of me to deal with our problem this way coz they are as human as me and my family still have land on greek territory which they want to return if there be a solution...I met many greek cypriots and we were distant for a while but I liked them all coz I saw they were like mirror image of my people...

anyway to sum things up...I fought my precuidice and this made me a more objective person and I hurt less people...It wouldnt hurt to try become less precudiced in order not to hurt the innocent...being aggressive is never the solution to the problem but its a start to another problem...

this is for Էլիա...I frankly still dont know much about the genocide and I dont think its right of me to speak in behalf of all turks (since am not a citizen of their country and my ancestors probably never met yours).However I think one should do anything for peace and if peace means everyone accepting the armenian genocide then I do accept it...

p.s: gosh, this is a way too long post...did anyone actually read all this?

I read it.....


There is no point discussing these matters on here.... english, turks, americans, armenians...

This is the last thing I'm going to say about it.... I believe what happend in 1915 was a genocide, and that's my belief and as long as I have an interest in politics and foreign affairs.... I will try to get USA to recognize the genocide....

Because I feel that not properly addressing this genocide has left a whole in the history of the world...

Most Armenians, yes most.... Don't hete middle easterners or people from the caucuses .... In fact Armenians get along the best outside of ARmenians with Persians, Greeks, and even Arabs... because there are a lot of ARmeians who speak Arabic... so exfo you're wrong thinking Armenians are xenophobic toward the people you listed....

[tamara48]

Re: Is it wrong to date Turkish Cypriot people?

Living in the Usa,doesn't make it right.Usa made Japan citizens to go in ww2.Because they are to harmful for country.don't you see it is same,you may say that is from devil or you may say that is capitalism or you may say that is genociderism-i made the word right now-but gizzy says right turks say Cyprus is our property.i hate them
In turkey there is no life for minority.but there is no life in Usa for minority.Armenians are not only minority in Usa.Armenians are strong.What about mexicans?what about muslims?
In my opinion if i can not understand being 'other',nothing will change.

[gizzy]

Re: Is it wrong to date Turkish Cypriot people?

[QUOTE=Gunner14;173698][QUOTE=Esther;173697]

My comment on "Turks and collegiate" education was sarcastic.... sorry for causing confusion...

I stand by for my hatred of the historic Turks.... I can't quite judge them individual so i judge them based on the things they have "accomplished"

I don't have to justify myself to anyone.... you people act like you have no prejudices ....

Find me a single rational person without prejudices
and.... well find me one ......

if you claim u r a person without ANY prejudices... your full of crap

well, everybody have prejudices and I do aswell...its the human nature am afraid...BUT there is a level of prejudice which is acceptable and a level that is not acceptable...This example is beyond prejudice:
"Racism is a belief or ideology that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, especially to distinguish it as being either superior or inferior to another race or races. It is also the prejudice based on such a belief.Racism has been a motivating factor in social discrimination, racial segregation, hate speech and violence (such as pogroms, genocides and ethnic cleansings). "

Am sure there have been many turks here who have been rude to you guys and I have read some examples...There have been some who have been rude to me as well...But if I see an Armenian and I think "she must be defintly rude to me since am a turk" and I avoid talking with her just coz she is armenian then I am going wrong...agreed?This is prejudice...But at least its at minimum level, didnt hurt anyone...However if I go and insult her when she speaks to me using these words "you armenians are all stupid and I hate you all" for example...that would be beyond prejudice.
My point is...Am not expecting from you to wellcome every single turk here with open arms of course...I know you have many reasons for not liking them. But also many issues to discuss as well...So my advice is to be a bit more friendly, hmm at least less fanatic and give everyone a chance to express themselves before judging them... One should keep in mind not all individuals from the same ethnic background are the same (at least am not a clone, I can guarantee it)...

As I said before am not from Turkey and am not a turkish citizen...I am a citizen of Cyprus government... I dont like turkish govenrment as well ( think I made this speech b4)... I do not like turkish people who come to cyprus just to become citizens and vote in elections...I do not like turkish people who claim "cyprus is our property"...I do not like turkish people who are fanatic and I would rather not speak with them coz they make me angry...etc..
see, I have many reasons to hate turkey but I know that not every single one of their citizen are the same...My people suffered from war 30 years ago...I grew up with hate speechs towards greeks...Turkey was always praised as our "protector"...We all knew we used to live in peace in our island before the english came and this rang a bell to me...I know that we were all played by the english...It was a trap and we didnt see it coz we were manipulated...Turkey also got involved to get a bit of land for his army..these games have been played for many years and is still being played in the middle east ...does this sound familiar?

At school I have been thought to hate a greek cypriots but I instead have a positive approach towards all coz I know they were thought to hate me as well...I think it was clever of me to deal with our problem this way coz they are as human as me and my family still have land on greek territory which they want to return if there be a solution...I met many greek cypriots and we were distant for a while but I liked them all coz I saw they were like mirror image of my people...

anyway to sum things up...I fought my precuidice and this made me a more objective person and I hurt less people...It wouldnt hurt to try become less precudiced in order not to hurt the innocent...being aggressive is never the solution to the problem but its a start to another problem...

this is for Էլիա...I frankly still dont know much about the genocide and I dont think its right of me to speak in behalf of all turks (since am not a citizen of their country and my ancestors probably never met yours).However I think one should do anything for peace and if peace means everyone accepting the armenian genocide then I do accept it...

p.s: gosh, this is a way too long post...did anyone actually read all this?

[exfo]

Re: Is it wrong to date Turkish Cypriot people?

Anyway... gizzy, are you now convinced that there actually was an Armenian Genocide?

Confess Gizzy! Lets repeat together: For the sake of Armenian diaspora, I confess that Turks made genocide to Armenians at 1915.

Otherwise no way of making a mature dialogue with them and they will continue to insult you.
I visited many countries in the world and I dont see that much narrow minded and racist community anywhere.


Dear Gunner,

You, esther and sev zeytun may be an exception here but just read what the rest of your people post here about Turks, once a second try to forget that "Turks made genocide to Armenians" and try to focus your peoples blind hatred. Then you will understand your reality. Personally I am sorry of your pains and sufferings because of us in the history. But nothing is an excuse for the hatred of the 4th or 5th generation towards another nation. Unfortunately diaspora is really obsessed with a sort of racism and hatred. Of course same for some Turks in Turkey, too. But you draw a so biased picture here that I dont mention the racist Turks here to make you see your own reality. (I always try to distinguish the diaspora and thr Armenians at Armenia because they are more mature, more open minded and sorry but more Armenian than you. Your people forget the good values of your asian, middle eastern and caucasian culture and become narrow minded and xenophobiac wersterners.)
Anyway, I also get bored, my accusations trigger yours and yours trigger mine. I would agree for an international mediator can find a solution between Turks & Armenians, but as you confess that you will make your best to promote your case with your lobby, this (probably western) mediator will be also biased because of the orientalistic reasons I counted above. My idea is that it would be better if Turks and Armenians COULD discuss their problems face to face together. But your diaspora also make its best to pressure Armenia (with supporting the nationalist groups like Kocaryan) and our stupid, obsessed groups in Turkey trigger the Armenian hatred here.
So lets wait and see what will happen, thanks for not insult me because of I amd Turkish and have a nice day all......

[Gunner14]

Re: Is it wrong to date Turkish Cypriot people?

[QUOTE=Esther;173697][QUOTE=gizzy;173652]

Gunner, I'm sorry dude if I claim something you don't agree with^^ (MY opinion):
Do you really have no idea why this reaction is just logical, when turkish people sign in as members on our forums almost in a weekly basis? And I must tell you there are some of them who are not really trying to become friends with us.
So our behaviour is just a result of the several tries of your people, who were showing their disapproval of our aims...
You may have your own opinion, but his is not hatred my friend, this is justified dislike. Of course you shouldn't insult someone just because of the fact that he/she belongs to a disliked race/..., but if you keep in mind, that this is a forum where you can't be seen nor judged as a person right away (because I think you will agree with me if I say we have reasons to be suspicious) you might understand why the way we act seems a bit harsh. But this cannot be called hatred! That's like the only thing we are being accused of: "All of you are racists!"

And I think that it's okay to date Turkish Cypriot people (if they are not brainwashed!), but not marry them due to the political/cultural differences. Groom and bride wouldn't have that much of a nice time

My comment on "Turks and collegiate" education was sarcastic.... sorry for causing confusion...

I stand by for my hatred of the historic Turks.... I can't quite judge them individual so i judge them based on the things they have "accomplished"

I don't have to justify myself to anyone.... you people act like you have no prejudices ....

Find me a single rational person without prejudices
and.... well find me one ......

if you claim u r a person without ANY prejudices... your full of crap

[Esther]

Re: Is it wrong to date Turkish Cypriot people?

[QUOTE=gizzy;173652][QUOTE=Gunner14;173593]

oh please...one should be blind to not to see what am talking about so please stop acting...If you want proof there are many to see on this forum amd you all know it well...Even the first wellcome I had the waves of prejudice...You need a reminder? there you go:

Gunner14:
Congratulations on being Turkish and getting a collegiate education.

Is Borat your boyfriend?

What was the point of your post?

I think you don't mean harm, but....

You say one should think objectively and not judge on biases, yet when history books told you what monsters your ancestors were, you chose not believe it.....

The Turks "explored" in the same way that the Vikings did.....

Sorrry for the animosity, but it is well deserved.

And, I love hearing that word "fairytale" from every Turkish poster... start using a thesaurus.

Cheers

arent these your words guner? They smell of hatret....Yess...you said sorry and I am really happy...I appreciate people can make mistakes but you insulted someone just coz you learnd she is turkish and that is whats called "racism"...I hope you change your mind sometime and try to evaluate people on individual basis next time...

Gunner, I'm sorry dude if I claim something you don't agree with^^ (MY opinion):
Do you really have no idea why this reaction is just logical, when turkish people sign in as members on our forums almost in a weekly basis? And I must tell you there are some of them who are not really trying to become friends with us.
So our behaviour is just a result of the several tries of your people, who were showing their disapproval of our aims...
You may have your own opinion, but his is not hatred my friend, this is justified dislike. Of course you shouldn't insult someone just because of the fact that he/she belongs to a disliked race/..., but if you keep in mind, that this is a forum where you can't be seen nor judged as a person right away (because I think you will agree with me if I say we have reasons to be suspicious) you might understand why the way we act seems a bit harsh. But this cannot be called hatred! That's like the only thing we are being accused of: "All of you are racists!"

And I think that it's okay to date Turkish Cypriot people (if they are not brainwashed!), but not marry them due to the political/cultural differences. Groom and bride wouldn't have that much of a nice time

[Էլիա]

Re: Is it wrong to date Turkish Cypriot people?

[QUOTE=gizzy;173652][QUOTE=Gunner14;173593]

oh please...one should be blind to not to see what am talking about so please stop acting...If you want proof there are many to see on this forum amd you all know it well...Even the first wellcome I had the waves of prejudice...You need a reminder? there you go:

Gunner14:
Congratulations on being Turkish and getting a collegiate education.

Is Borat your boyfriend?

What was the point of your post?

I think you don't mean harm, but....

You say one should think objectively and not judge on biases, yet when history books told you what monsters your ancestors were, you chose not believe it.....

The Turks "explored" in the same way that the Vikings did.....

Sorrry for the animosity, but it is well deserved.

And, I love hearing that word "fairytale" from every Turkish poster... start using a thesaurus.

Cheers

arent these your words guner? They smell of hatret....Yess...you said sorry and I am really happy...I appreciate people can make mistakes but you insulted someone just coz you learnd she is turkish and that is whats called "racism"...I hope you change your mind sometime and try to evaluate people on individual basis next time...

Anyway... gizzy, are you now convinced that there actually was an Armenian Genocide?