Armenia: A Second Israel

[londontsi]

Re: Armenia: A Second Israel

hi londontsi,
among all the outragouse claims and plans where I suggested the fall of an independant state you only grabed the populating of Ajaria? Anyway you are perfectly right about populating Ajaria and even uniting Djavakhk with Armenia and Russia advancing southwards. This is just an idea or somekind of a premative plan not all ideas can me implemented but its through brain storming something can be found and in the end we ae just discussing here.

Now you make sense !!

[Hye]

Re: Armenia: A Second Israel

Sure Armanen you are right i just edited it I hope its much better now
thank you

[Armanen]

Re: Armenia: A Second Israel

Hye, please use more spaces between your paragraphs, it hurts my eyes trying to read what you wrote.

[Hye]

Re: Armenia: A Second Israel

hi londontsi,
among all the outragouse claims and plans where I suggested the fall of an independant state you only grabed the populating of Ajaria? Anyway you are perfectly right about populating Ajaria and even uniting Djavakhk with Armenia and Russia advancing southwards. This is just an idea or somekind of a premative plan not all ideas can me implemented but its through brain storming something can be found and in the end we ae just discussing here.

Suedia,
If your numbers are taken to be acurate we can see that Tukish population in Turkey have grown 7 times whereas Armenian population have grown 4.67 times well if you look at it its not that far off bearing in mind that Armenians had more harship after the Armenian Genocide than Turks it more difficult to increase in numbers in foreign counties than your own. Not to forgeth the "tsulum" factor if someone lives outside of his homeland. Did you know poland had huge Armenian population in the past where are they now? Either they megrated to another country or more important lost their identity. Moreover we shouldn't forget the factor of Soviet Union where again many Armenians were killed were exiled to Siberia its not the same as having an independant country with GREAT geographical location and in the end don't forget about World War 2 where Armenains gave 300,000 (10% of the Armenian population then) victims to the war fighting against Germany whereas Turkey didn't take part in the war.


Now for the sake of the discussion I want to take this one step forward.

In my opinon if we give Armenians a suitable enviroment they will get more in numbers now we can see in advanced countries the population actually is declining because of so many factors i don't want to talk about now this may happen in Armenia too even if we make the socioeconomic situation better in Armenia people now are just giving birth to 2 children in average but I think in case of Armenians if we put some kind of finential help or reward we can imporve the birth rates and if we have enough money as a nation even though bizzare and unthinkable we can manage to populate Ajaria but the first step in all this is the money how to make the whole Nation ritch cherity? I have already said i don't believe in it. we have been trying cahrity till now All Armenian fund this year collected I donno 17 mill or less? if we add all the charity organisations all together how much money are they sending to Armenia? 300 mill max? (I think Im still being genurouse) so if we continue like this we won't get to anyplace or we atchieve a little.

In my opinon WE MUST FIND ANOTHER WAY MORE EFFICIENT WAY TO MAKE MONEY AS A NATION. hOW? i have talked bout this befor i had a few replies by Haykakan who dismissed the idea. I want to repeat it beacause I believe its the only way to get stronger. Bear in mind Im basing my observations and formulas based on Lebanon becasue I live there and I see and know what is happening over here maybe based on your experiances in your countries you can change and imporve the idea.



I donno if you all know, there is something called "azkayin durk" meaning "national Tax" collected by the church or "azkayin Arachnortaran" in the diaspora it is around 30$ a year to all adults. recently I have asked many people and talked to priests where does this money go if there is a booklet printed every year that shows and talks about the spending of the money, the asnwer was no there is no booklet no one could know exactly where this money goes and according to the Lebanese society corruption is a common thing in this case (let me tell little you understand more) by the way NO ONE pays this tax on time or very few pay it on time this tax accumulates till the day you want to get married or baptise your child etc by the church and in this occation you pay all the amount that you have acumulatd through the years.

Frist of all we must make the population willing to pay this tax but to do so the minimume thing required is trancparency show where is the money going to all of the populkation and let them see that the money isn't going in vain.

The other question is how to use this money? in Lebanon if we say ther are 50000 Armenians who pay this taxt every year this means we have 1.5 mill USD income every year in my opinon this is nothing to be proud of but this is a lot to start with my idea is investment. Starting businesses in Lebanon creating jobs for Armenians here starthing with small steps opening companies with this capital and thinking only to make money to make the capital larger do not forget every year 1.5 mill USD income we will have through the taxes and [plus the revvenues through the businesses in 10 to 15 years we will have around 100 and 200 millon USD capital we will have a comunity that has more job oportunities and will not leave Lebanon and will get stronger in the mean times from this 100 or 200 mill we can send more money to Armenia and unlike charity this will be constant income.

moreover imagine if we can do such a thig all aroung the world in US Russia where we have bigger comunities and its just then we will exploit the full potential of the Diaspora who will be more efficient in helping Armenia to get stronger.

[Suedia]

Re: Armenia: A Second Israel

The current Republic of Armenia + Artsakh can hold the entire Armeniann population in the world and more. By having a higher population, we would also have a more numbered Armed Forces and other...

[Suedia]

Re: Armenia: A Second Israel

For Armenians, it is difficult to populate its own motherland, but it's really easy for them to populate Bairut, Halab, Glendale... One of the problems that we Armenians have is, we are few in numbers. True that quality is more powerful than the quantity, but still, for Us, quantity can change a lot of things. in 1923, we were 1.5 million in the world. Now 7 million. Turks were in 1923 about 10 million, now 70 million!!! Why can't we be more? the way is simple, have a lot of babies.

[londontsi]

Re: Armenia: A Second Israel

I think you suffer from verbal diarrhea.


Can you explain how you are going to "populate" Ajaria?

[Hye]

Re: Armenia: A Second Israel

I agree Russia is the most country that can protect Armenia and help it to survive but this doesn't mean Russia will remain such don't forget after 1917 revolution how did Russia change its policy it was very natural that it had to change and no one can blame her this is politics. In my opinon as long as Russia is on it's feet she will not get close to Turkey to the extand where it is a treat to Armenian existance because they both are competitors in the Caucasus with differnt agendas and natin intrests thast will always be on the others account BUT if Russia gets weaker there is the biggest treat for Armenia and even so grave to the extent we may lose Armenia and I repeat Russia is a power who fell in 2 occasions in the 20th century and nothing can assure that this will not happen in the near future. Im always with maintaining a complementary polacy with Rassia and the west but we can't rely on the west AT ALL. We learned this the hard way in the past. Russia can't affort to lose in its own neigborhood whereas the west can afford to lose in Russias neigborhood and in order to maintain her power Russia can and will do anything even forging wars look at what happened to Georgia ... Ukrainians seem smarter than Georgians ...
In this following part I will make some kind of bizzare statement bear me please it's just apoint of view want to discuss
In my opinon the strategic enemy of Armenians and Armenia is not Turkey nor Azerbaijan it's Georgia. How? Let's look at facts. Armenia is a landlocked country it's strategic partner and it's garantor is Russia and yet we have no common border with her. So geographically nearest sea or outlet to us is the Black Sea and its a relief to Armenians and will give Armenia big room to breath easiest way to reach to the black sea is through Georgia. Now we ahve javakhk reagion populated with Armenians but Javakhk itself doesn't have border with sea but there is Ajaria. if somhow we manage to unite javakhk to Armenia in the mean time populate Ajaria with Armenians and demend some form of autonomy or independance together with Turkey and in case of independance Ajaria would be governed by Armenians and muslems (since we would have settled Armenians there) we woulkd have somehow a way out the sea.
In the mean time to have common border with our strategic partner the easiest and nearest way is through north through Georgia so in my opinon as I said our stratigic "enemy" is Georgia the existance of Georgia as a state is a treat to Armenia and in order to atchieve all our goals Georgia must not exist must be divided between Armenia and Russia and a few independant countries.

[Eddo211]

Re: Armenia: A Second Israel

The way I see it Armenia will always need a big brother country as such (due to the the larger population of its neighbours aka 70 million potentially hostile Turks vs 3 million Armenian's), for Israel it is the USA and for Armenia it should put its efforts into maintaining a strong relationship with Russia.

I wouldn’t say always…………..but for now Armenia must play the balancing act between the superpowers and try to turn the tide in her favor at every opportunity by maintaining a good poker face.

[hipeter924]

Re: Armenia: A Second Israel

The way I see it Armenia will always need a big brother country as such (due to the the larger population of its neighbours aka 70 million potentially hostile Turks vs 3 million Armenian's), for Israel it is the USA and for Armenia it should put its efforts into maintaining a strong relationship with Russia.