IRAN declared itself a nuclear nation

[ashot24]

Re: IRAN declared itself a nuclear nation

Also, it isn't my "Assumption" that people have gone to wars over Religion and fairy tale stories. That's simply the facts of the region and the world.

Also, I don't think Ashot's saying that religion hasn't been a factor, so the fact that there have been religiously motivated wars or acts of violence doesn't change his point. Christians have blood on their hands too.

I was referring to the particular recent events that were labeled as acts of revenge because of religion and "insulting one's prophet" that the world has experienced. I was not referring to wars, massacres, genocides, violent events, etc. because of religion in history, which I know have been many, have been and are actually a major trigger in conflicts, and that no religion in the world can claim its hands are clean of blood.

You clearly misunderstood me, if I gave my idea in a rather not clear war, I'm sorry.

So what's your point?

My point is that people have somehow forgot that it was the USA that launched the first nuclear bomb and started the worldwide nuclear terror. Not even Nazi Germany, also was known to be developing nuclear armory at the time of WWII, not even the USSR, with the worldwide terror older generations were given as of the 'nuclear apocalypse' the unleashing of an actual war could happen during the period of the Cold War, or more recently Iraq and Cheney's imaginary "weapon's of mass destruction", have made the world stare at the horror of a nuclear disaster as it was in Hiroshima and Nagasaki. In my opinion, the US government claiming that other countries (funny enough only Muslim countries) "may" have this kind of weapons and "may" be threatening world peace, when they have wide experience on both issues their own, it's just hypocritical.

That's my point.

[Muhaha]

Re: IRAN declared itself a nuclear nation

So we should say "sorry, you can't take advantage of the cheapest and safest energy source because we don't trust Islamic countries not to do more with it?"

Yes.

Having nuclear energy doesn't equal being able to make and launch a nuclear bomb.

I know it doesn't, but it's a step in that direction.

Also, I don't think Ashot's saying that religion hasn't been a factor, so the fact that there have been religiously motivated wars or acts of violence doesn't change his point. Christians have blood on their hands too.

Of course Christians have blood on their hands, that's why I'm also opposed to any nations that are run by Priests/Popes getting their hands on Nuclear weapons. I don't have anything special against Muslims that I don't have against Christians, xxxs, Buddhists, etc. The only reason I'm emphasizing Islam right now is because it's the loudest of today's religions and it's supporters are the most passionate. I also emphasize the Middle East because it has the largest concentration of Religiously run nations. The only other state that's run by Religion that's not in the Middle East that I can think of is the Vatican.

[Muhaha]

Re: IRAN declared itself a nuclear nation

Again, what does this have to do with Muslims or the Middle-Easterns? Can you name me ONE person in power (as in presidents, politicians, prime ministers, etc.) who aren't bad?

Russia, China, France, etc aren't going to start lobbing nukes over religion anytime soon. That's what I mean by 'bad'.

[KarotheGreat]

Re: IRAN declared itself a nuclear nation

How are you so sure they will never use it? How do you know they won't have an irrational leader in 5 years or 10 years or tomorrow?

And also, Iran's history is FAR from just being defensive. If I remember correctly, I think Armenians have had to fight them off on a couple of occasions....

In the last 200 years the Persians haven't attacked any one they were the ones who were being attacked. And those wars were so long ago that they don't matter for today.

And no one can be more irrational than Kim Il of North Korea and he's got an A-bomb do you see him using it? No, because he knows the moment he uses it, it will be the moment that his country will be attacked and bombed back o the stone age by every nation on this planet.

Only ones has a A-bomb been used in the last 60 years, if the Russians and Americans didn't use it on each other Iran isn't going to use it either.

[Eddo211]

Re: IRAN declared itself a nuclear nation

In my opinion Iran is a long way from manufacturing nuclear weapons (anybody thinks they wouldn't want nukes are kidding themselves). You need to enrich Uranium to 90% before you can have a bomb. Currently USA, Russia, and France have suggested a deal to Iran for Russia to enrich Uranium to the 20% needed for nuclear power with France being one of the few nations capable to make the sophisticated fuel rods for Iran’s power generation and medical use. At 20% the Uranium can no longer be enriched to weapons grade. Iran has refused so far and stated that they can manage to make the rods themselves and they already are capable of enriching to 20%.

If the West decides to take out the Iranian facilities they face many problems. First of all Israel cannot do it by itself and it will fail badly due to large area that has to be covered. There are three ways to get to Iran that Israel considers. Through Iraq by obtaining clearance from the US controlled Iraqi airspace. Through Syria or through Turkey (which seems doubtful with their latest fiasco).

Also the latest pentagon intelligence states that in order to be successful in reaching the deeply buried facilities scattered around the large country tactical nukes have to be used. First a bunker buster bomb will make a hole and then the low radiation tactical nuke to take out the facilities (which are very close to populated areas btw). The other way would be to take out power generators and water factories (both needed in great quantity for nuclear power/weapon construction) which would also adversely affect the people of Iran. This will only set them back for two years according to the studies.

I personally think that a nuclear Mullah is a very very bad idea but are they going to use it on Israel or say Saudi Arabia? I say No. Destroying the futures state of Pals or damaging Al Aqsa mosque or killing Arabs in big numbers will be met with great reaction from the Arab word, not to mention Western powers retaliation.

The biggest nuclear threat that I see in the world is Pakistan with Al Qaeda growing influence in that unstable country. If the authorities’ loose control there is a chance that jihadists will get their hand on at least a dirty bomb and decide to light it off in USA.

[ArmSurvival]

Re: IRAN declared itself a nuclear nation

Russia, China, France, etc aren't going to start lobbing nukes over religion anytime soon. That's what I mean by 'bad'.

What about Israel? Their state ideology is based on Old Testament stories from the Bronze Age, which is even crazier than an Islamic theocracy. Nontheless they have hundreds of nukes stockpiled in secret silos. Do you know how Israel obtained their nuclear weapons? They developed them secretly, and nobody would have known about it if it weren't for a brave J ewish whistleblower named Mordechai Vanunu, who was later kidnapped in Italy by Mossad agents and thrown in an Israeli dungeon where he is still rotting. If he didn't sacrifice his own life by opening his mouth, no one today would have known that Israel has nukes. Yet Israel is treated as a legitimate nation.

And how did the world react to Israel's secret nuclear program? Instead of punishing or sanctioning them, they gave them jets that were capable of carrying and dropping their nukes hundreds of miles outside of Israel. But somehow, its Israel out of all countries thats worried about Iran, and the west is mostly concerned because Israel feels threatened. Israel is like the west's high-maintenance girlfriend who always gets in trouble with strange men.

And realistically, Iran's leaders are not stupid, they're not going to start dropping nukes on people, and they're not going to sell their nukes to people on the blackmarket who can turn around and use them on Iran. Nukes are simply a weapon which discourages people from attacking your country. Iran doesn't want to be the next Iraq, which is what the west is planning for them REGARDLESS whether they have nukes or not.

[Parskahay]

Re: IRAN declared itself a nuclear nation

btw armenia can use iran as advantage again.we can get nuclear things from them and prospect armenia to be stronger against turkey and azerbaijan

[Mos]

Re: IRAN declared itself a nuclear nation

btw armenia can use iran as advantage again.we can get nuclear things from them and prospect armenia to be stronger against turkey and azerbaijan

nuclear things from Iran?? What do you want Armenia to get carpet bombed and economically isolated by the West? Armenia should stay away from Iran's nuclear program. Iranian people much more support muslim Azerbaijan than Armenia, mostly because of religion and the fact so many Azeris are in Iran.

[Muhaha]

Re: IRAN declared itself a nuclear nation

What about Israel?

One of the first things I said in this thread was that Israel should also be disarmed and I've already stated numerous times my beef isn't with only Muslims or Iran. It's with any nation run by a group of people who think there's an invisible man in the sky giving people orders.

The only reason I'm emphasizing Islam is because it's the loudest and most passionate of today's religions.

[Muhaha]

Re: IRAN declared itself a nuclear nation

Not to mention Armenia...

Isn't ANYBODY worried a nuclear weapon might be smuggled by one of the millions of azeris living in Iran into Azerbaijan and then used on Armenia? I'm sure Iran's military contains a high number of people who support Azerbaijan, and would love to pass one over to Alyiev.

No matter how you look at it, it just creates way too many problems for everybody if Iran gets nukes.