Armenian-Turkish Relations

[Haykakan]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

While I do not doubt that Armenians are great traders, that article is actually quoting some of these Armenian entrepreneurs themselves and they don't seem to be too optimistic. Besides this, how does Armenia expect to be in the middle of participating in regional projects when all regional projects (railroad, pipelines) include "Azerbaijan"? Our border is permanently shut with that country.

It wont be shut for long, as i have been saying there is a plan designed for the caucuses by the big powers and Armenia is in the middle of it. The fears regarding the economy are similar to the fears of Armenia assimilating into turckey, dont forget we have been armenian much longer then turcks have been turcks.

[Eddo211]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

it wouldn't be a long battle - there would be little or no opposition and Turkish forces could be driving into the center of Yerevan within an hour of crossing the border. There were no defensive structures in Armenia during the Cold War, no massive army bases and vast stockpiles of weapons, because the Soviets realised that Armenia was undefendable in a conventional war - Armenia has been undefendable in a conventional war ever since the bulk of its historical territory was lost after WW1. But everything else you wrote is true. And, as America has found, merely capturing a place and then controlling it on paper means nothing - a $20
roadside bomb, or a 20c sniper's bullet, can kill a solder that cost a million dollars to train and equip.

We will welcome you in Turk. hahaha

The Armenian Wedge will hold even if you take Yerevan.

[Federate]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

It wont be shut for long, as i have been saying there is a plan designed for the caucuses by the big powers and Armenia is in the middle of it. The fears regarding the economy are similar to the fears of Armenia assimilating into turckey, dont forget we have been armenian much longer then turcks have been turcks.

The only way the border with Azerbaijan will be opened is if we either hand Artsakh in its entirety back or if we hand the liberated territories around the fictitious NKAO back and somehow they accept this. Neither of these "solutions" are settling the conflict in Armenia's favour and I would never support the "return" of an inch of land to Azerbaijan. I also doubt Armenia's leadership would be ready to accept any of these two scenarios though with Serge I am not too sure anymore since the buffoon had already decided Agdam is not Armenian a few years back only to be made look like an imbecile with the discovery of Tigranakert in 2005.

[Federate]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

We will welcome you in Turk. hahaha

He is not Turkish. Everyone stop with the provocations and concentrate on the topic please. Thank you.

[Eddo211]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

He is not Turkish. Everyone stop with the provocations and concentrate on the topic please. Thank you.

My bad............but I think cat already knows I like him, regardless where he is from.

[Federate]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

Guess that Turkey declared war upon Armenia, and somehow Russia did not stand against it and after long battles Turkish Army entered Yerevan...

So what? It is full of Armenians, Turks would not be able to control that land. And there is nothing to gain from it, no sources no seaports.. Ankara already has everything that Armenia also has.

There would be serious problems with EU and UN.. Probably there would be an embargo, most probably would lost her NATO membership; economy would be damaged, would be a radical country such as Iran and N. Korea...

lots and lots of loses just for a small land.

I do not think that would be possible... As long as ultra-fascists dont take the control.. even NMP can not take that risk.

Think of everything you just said and now replace Armenia with Cyprus. Sure, no Turks in Armenia but do you really think there will be international pressure against Turkey?

[Haykakan]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

The only way the border with Azerbaijan will be opened is if we either hand Artsakh in its entirety back or if we hand the liberated territories around the fictitious NKAO back and somehow they accept this. Neither of these "solutions" are settling the conflict in Armenia's favour and I would never support the "return" of an inch of land to Azerbaijan. I also doubt Armenia's leadership would be ready to accept any of these two scenarios though with Serge I am not too sure anymore since the buffoon had already decided Agdam is not Armenian a few years back only to be made look like an imbecile with the discovery of Tigranakert in 2005.

What you me or Serj think is irrelavent. You and i have as much power to change Armenias destiny as Serj does. The azeris and the armenians will accept whatever mother Russia tells them to accept. The only true battle raging in the caucuses for well over a decade now has been the one between usa and russia and in my opinion russia won this battle thus it will do as it pleases there. Lucky for us it needs a anti turckish wedge and we are it. Perhaps being refered to as a wedge is demeaning but i figure the bigger the wedge the happier russia is so i think we will hold on to much of our gains but i dought all of it. Once the peace treaty with the azeris is signed you will see huge developments in Armenia which will render the usa controlled georgia completely useless. Russia will do this to prove a point and to punish georgia till it accepts a russian puppet vs a usa one. Russia has a proven strategy for controling its neighbors, it does not let one get too much stronger then the other, this way it can dominate them both. Under Russia the caucuses can become a great place, the center of business..which will benefit all involved parties but it has no interest in making Armenia any more powerful then it needs her to be. People don't look at things in perspective and prefer to think in terms of how things ought to be vs how they are or really can be. This is human nature but to survive one needs to be able to control ones own nature.

[Davo88]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

If Armenia is the kind of Russian satellite that you portray it to be, Russia would be smart to not antagonize the current Armenian republic with the Armenian diaspora. Armenia's national integrity is of Russia's best interests. Armenian organizations outside the border will not really consider the Russia factor either because it is an emotionally charged issue.

Moreover, the protocols are more favourable to Turks and also improve their image in Europe, which would make Turkey's EU accession easier. In the big picture, is Turkey's easy accession to the EU (thus strengthening it) advantageous to Russia? I seriously doubt it.

[gegev]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

Our state hired employees/politicians claim that using the “historical sub-commission" they can convince the Turks that AG happened.

They “don’t know” that every single Turk in Turkey knows that it happened.

Meanwhile every intelligent creature knows that they don’t recognize it, because they are not willing to return the Armenian land and homes they, or their compatriots are living in.

But our FM and “State employees” can do it, I’m “sure”, if they would cry bitterly.

Turks, after several decades of discussions, will declare that the sub commission could not come to a unanimous conclusion on AG, therefore the Genocide claim is not proved.

It didn’t happen.

In this protocol Armenia made all the possible/impossible concessions that could be done. And Turkey made just one concession and agreed to listen while the Armenian “politicians” who would try to prove AG, by crying. But they didn’t pre-sign that their conclusion will be positive for the weepers.

[Haykakan]

Re: Armenian-Turkish Relations

If Armenia is the kind of Russian satellite that you portray it to be, Russia would be smart to not antagonize the current Armenian republic with the Armenian diaspora. Armenia's national integrity is of Russia's best interests. Armenian organizations outside the border will not really consider the Russia factor either because it is an emotionally charged issue.

Moreover, the protocols are more favourable to Turks and also improve their image in Europe, which would make Turkey's EU accession easier. In the big picture, is Turkey's easy accession to the EU (thus strengthening it) advantageous to Russia? I seriously doubt it.

Russia is hardly anatagonizing the Armenian republic, it is russia that has protected and developed it for the last 90+ years. If armenian organizations outside the borders do not consider the "russian" factor then they will never achieve any meaningful goals, kind of like they have done for a long time now. The open borders will be far more advatagous to Armenia then for Turckey, i actually worry about the turcks closing the border after opening it for a little while. As for Turckey i it is hard to say if eu assention is in Russias interest or not but it would be in Armenias interest to have a eu country next door for both security and trade purposes.