Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

[Siggie]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

Because no woman is ever happy with an ass-kissing wimp.

There you go making it black and white. Any man that doesn't think like you must be an ass-kissing wimp?

And where do you get the idea that a traditional man treats his wife as personal property. As for what I said, read again, I mean during sex.
And lets not kid ourselves, 99% of women would settle with a wealthy guy, regardless of how he treated her.

She doesn't want to be treated like property during sex either (fetishes and rp stuff excluded)... If you're treating her like property there, then you don't care if she's enjoying the experience or not.

She better behave as he sees fit? If you treat people as if they don't have mind and will of their own, then you're essentially treating them like property.

That's what every other western woman says. That is until divorce, then suddenly all his flaws start to matter. Love doesn't last long enough for a marriage to succeed. Genuine love is bullsh!t.

If they marry for the right reasons and knowing each other well enough at the outset, why would they be getting divorced at all?
Two smart people, equity in the relationship, mutual respect, two incomes and so enough money... that really eliminates most things people split over.

[levon]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

In what sense? The traditional middle class wife certainly couldn't vote, couldn't hold property, didn't really have any freedom to pursue any of her self interests. So how did she have it "better"?

You're just reiterating what feminazis have been saying; however, I'd like to see how much you really know about what you're saying. Let's just make sure you're not another dumb feminazi who just repeats lies without facts.

Prove for me please, the following. But first, lets define a few terms.

Traditional woman = any woman in the US prior to the hit of mainstream feminism. Meaning, any woman before 1960s

So, prove that

1) Women prior to 1960 couldn't vote
2) Women prior to 1960 couldn't hold property
3) Women prior to 1960 didn't have any freedoms
4) Women prior to 1960 couldn't pursue their interests

Now, be sure to be accurate in your conclusions. Make sure not to compare an average woman to a well off man. If you're making any assertions about a middle class woman, then they should be in comparison to a middle class man. Similarly, when discussing a lower class woman, it should be in comparison to a lower class male, and finally when discussing an upper class woman make sure it's in comparison to an upper class man.

Now, to make things even better, please make sure to discuss 1-4) for each of the following: lower class women, middle class women and upper class women.

....Go. If you prove that you're not full of sh!t, we'll continue from there.

Not sure what you mean by this? Do you also mean a group of men can be no different than a group of sheep? But what does this have to do with anything?

Think fascism, Nazism, communism. Now think feminism = (feminazism).

[levon]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

There you go making it black and white. Any man that doesn't think like you must be an ass-kissing wimp?

No, ass-kissing wimps are ass-kissing wimps, and they make up most of the western world. That is the reason western men have given up all the rights they used to have.

She doesn't want to be treated like property during sex either (fetishes and rp stuff excluded)... If you're treating her like property there, then you don't care if she's enjoying the experience or not.

Tell me, what do you think of when you hear "treating a woman as property". Is it when the woman says "oh yes, I'm your personal xxxxx", or is it something else?

She better behave as he sees fit? If you treat people as if they don't have mind and will of their own, then you're essentially treating them like property.

You know, though you claim otherwise, your responses scream feminist. Traditional families have rules that are meant to be followed by the husband and the wife. When a woman comes into a mans family through marriage, she is expected to follow the family's rules. That is what it means to behave as seen fit.
You accuse me of thinking in black and white, yet all you can see is "traditional woman = property=bad."

If they marry for the right reasons and knowing each other well enough at the outset, why would they be getting divorced at all?

Hmm, that would imply that half the women in the US don't marry for the right reasons, and/or don't know their spouse well enough, especially since women initiate most divorces.

Two smart people, equity in the relationship, mutual respect, two incomes and so enough money... that really eliminates most things people split over.

yep, two jobs, kids, stress, divorce.

[Sip]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

You're just reiterating what feminazis have been saying; however, I'd like to see how much you really know about what you're saying. Let's just make sure you're not another dumb feminazi who just repeats lies without facts.

Prove for me please, the following. But first, lets define a few terms.

Traditional woman = any woman in the US prior to the hit of mainstream feminism. Meaning, any woman before 1960s

So, prove that

1) Women prior to 1960 couldn't vote
2) Women prior to 1960 couldn't hold property
3) Women prior to 1960 didn't have any freedoms
4) Women prior to 1960 couldn't pursue their interests

Wait I am confused? So you think women should be able to have property, should be able to vote, and should have freedoms? When you say "traditional" wife, are you thinking a wife that can vote, have property, and have a legal standing like any other person (man) in society? I guess I am not clear on what you mean by "traditional wife" then.

[levon]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

Wait I am confused? So you think women should be able to have property, should be able to vote, and should have freedoms? When you say "traditional" wife, are you thinking a wife that can vote, have property, and have a legal standing like any other person (man) in society? I guess I am not clear on what you mean by "traditional wife" then.

Don't be a smart-ass. Prove the points, or stay silent (and prove that you have no idea what you're talking about).

Prove for me please, the following. But first, lets define a few terms.

Traditional woman = any woman in the US prior to the hit of mainstream feminism. Meaning, any woman before 1960s

So, prove that

1) Women prior to 1960 couldn't vote
2) Women prior to 1960 couldn't hold property
3) Women prior to 1960 didn't have any freedoms
4) Women prior to 1960 couldn't pursue their interests

Now, be sure to be accurate in your conclusions. Make sure not to compare an average woman to a well off man. If you're making any assertions about a middle class woman, then they should be in comparison to a middle class man. Similarly, when discussing a lower class woman, it should be in comparison to a lower class male, and finally when discussing an upper class woman make sure it's in comparison to an upper class man.

Now, to make things even better, please make sure to discuss 1-4) for each of the following: lower class women, middle class women and upper class women.

....Go.

[Siggie]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

No, ass-kissing wimps are ass-kissing wimps, and they make up most of the western world. That is the reason western men have given up all the rights they used to have.

Since we're not cooperating and defining terms and just taking your word as fact, I won't ask again that you explain.

Probability says you're likely an ass-kissing wimp as well.

Women don't and haven't wanted to take away men's rights. They just want equal rights!

You know, though you claim otherwise, your responses scream feminist. Traditional families have rules that are meant to be followed by the husband and the wife. When a woman comes into a mans family through marriage, she is expected to follow the family's rules. That is what it means to behave as seen fit.
You accuse me of thinking in black and white, yet all you can see is "traditional woman = property=bad."

No, that's not the only thing, but I'm sure I can elaborate once you define what you mean by "traditional woman."

Hmm, that would imply that half the women in the US don't marry for the right reasons, and/or don't know their spouse well enough, especially since women initiate most divorces.

It takes two people to get married, so that would imply that half of men and women don't get it right.

yep, two jobs, kids, stress, divorce

How do kids and stress only apply in the "modern" example?
I guess all the happily wed people have no stress in their lives or children?

[Sip]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

Where did 1960 come from? Why are you so hung up on 1960s? What is the point of me "proving" these things? I am very very confused. The entire argument is over what "traditional" wife means. What do you mean by "traditional wife"?

[Siggie]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

Don't be a smart-ass. Prove the points, or stay silent (and prove that you have no idea what you're talking about).

Prove for me please, the following. But first, lets define a few terms.

Traditional woman = any woman in the US prior to the hit of mainstream feminism. Meaning, any woman before 1960s

So, prove that

1) Women prior to 1960 couldn't vote
2) Women prior to 1960 couldn't hold property
3) Women prior to 1960 didn't have any freedoms
4) Women prior to 1960 couldn't pursue their interests

Now, be sure to be accurate in your conclusions. Make sure not to compare an average woman to a well off man. If you're making any assertions about a middle class woman, then they should be in comparison to a middle class man. Similarly, when discussing a lower class woman, it should be in comparison to a lower class male, and finally when discussing an upper class woman make sure it's in comparison to an upper class man.

Now, to make things even better, please make sure to discuss 1-4) for each of the following: lower class women, middle class women and upper class women.

....Go.

You can't just arbitrarily say that the feminist movement began in 1960. It's much older than that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-wave_feminism

In 1860, New York passed a revised Married Women's Property Act which gave women shared ownership of their children, allowing them to have a say in their children's wills, wages, and granting them the right to inherit property.[

Whereas first-wave feminism focused mainly on overturning legal obstacles to equality (i.e. voting rights, property rights), second-wave feminism addressed a wide range of issues: de facto inequalities, official legal inequalities, sexuality, family, the workplace, and, perhaps most controversially, reproductive rights.[1] It also tried and failed to add the Equal Rights Amendment to the United States Constitution. Many feminists view the second-wave feminist era as ending with the intra-feminism disputes of the Feminist Sex Wars, over issues such as sexuality and pornography

[Sip]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

You can't just arbitrarily say that the feminist movement began in 1960. It's much older than that.

Yah! All of a sudden when women have all these goodies in the US he wants to call them "traditional"! 1960s is far from traditional. A lot of women in other "traditional" countries don't even have what women in US had in 1960s!!! (e.g. a lot of the arab/muslim countries today who seem to still be 300 years or so behind the rest of the western world)

[levon]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

Probability says you're likely an ass-kissing wimp as well.

Damn, you're accusing me of specifically targeting you, yet you do the same thing. I am what I am, and I don't give two sh!ts about what you think I am. And, last of all, you are but a woman. I don't give a sh!t about what you think.

Women don't and haven't wanted to take away men's rights. They just want equal rights!

Sure, women want the right to say a guy raped her just to get back at him. Them, after 6 months (after he gets raped in jail) they'll tell the cops that she was lying. But, they don't want to be held responsibly for destroying the guys life, since they want equal rights.
I mean, they want equal chance at being a fire-fighter so standards should be lowered to allow more women in.
They want, they want, they want. It's not about equality, it's about wants.

Do you know why you are a feminists? It's because your rhetoric, your reason and your conclusions are based on feelings.