New program against the Armenians and Greeks in Istanbul?

[Eti]

Re: New pogrom against the Armenians and Greeks in Istanbul?

Joseph and Urmistake (btw thanks for the welcome) I want to tell that:

Demographic transition of our country was completed in late 1950s. If our faschists are trying to keep the homogenization of our society, unfortunately it is too late for this. Today, this will not be tolerated in 2009.

I say again I am prone not trusting any foreign press at all. There are too much prejudices about my country in western world, because we are not known enough by them, because the upper class ignores the lower class.

Even if this is true (marking the doors of christians) it means nothing for me, because I know such movements in vain in today’s Istanbul as well.

My nationalist part makes me understand the feelings of our faschists. We suffered a lot because of the christian habitants of Anatolia. Even if you don’t agree with that The Rum (The Anatolian Greek, in fact Eastern Roman) and The Armenian brought physical and mental troubles to the Muslim habitants in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. It is not secret, on the contrary very clear that both side (Rums and Armenians) wanted to found their own states in Anatolia and they began to collobrate with Western European countries and Russia vs Ottomans as they were making use of the weakness of the Empire.

So christians of Turkey have to understand that trauma made by their ancestors and should not complain about this small price. Perhaps they weren’t so happy under the rule of Ottomans I can easily throw out that Muslims didn’t cause such a traumatic experience for the christian habitant of Anatolia. (I tell this although I know you don’t agree).

Of course there is a serious reason for the deportation of christian population of Anatolia done between 1915 and 1930.

[UrMistake]

Re: New pogrom against the Armenians and Greeks in Istanbul?

I haven’t heard such a news recently, most probably it is not true.

These kind of news are always fabricated about Turkey especially in such countries like Greece, but it seems also in Armenia of course. Remember the news published in Greece when Erdoğan canceled his visit to your country. Even serious newspapers such as “To Vima” or “Ta Nea” made up some stories and they told some tales that as if Erdoğan came and turned back to Turkey after some tensions between Karamanlis and him.

It is understood that in some countries particularly where a lot of anti-turkist people live, it is such a usual thing making up stories about Turkey. While the real stories are ignored (for instance: “burned Turks by Neo Nazis in Germany) your media frequently tells lies about Turkey to make easy money. (I know that news about Turkey take a lot of attraction in Greece).

And probably you'll tell that our media don't want to tell such news, but believe me our media is more reliable. Any time, when I watch an European or US TV broadcasting a news about Turkey, they usually show our women with headscarf, as if they tell a news about Iran not Turkey.

Welcome to our site Eti,i must tell you of how much uncorrect is your statement ,but my replay to you is not about that,u showed us your concerns of how the other countries view Turkey, which is good cause from that point we can find numerous problems coming from Turkey,in a way u can open your ayes and maybe we(Armenians+Greeks) can find a solution for better establishmend of our relations with Turkey.

[Joseph]

Re: New pogrom against the Armenians and Greeks in Istanbul?

I haven’t heard such a news recently, most probably it is not true.

These kind of news are always fabricated about Turkey especially in such countries like Greece, but it seems also in Armenia of course. Remember the news published in Greece when Erdoğan canceled his visit to your country. Even serious newspapers such as “To Vima” or “Ta Nea” made up some stories and they told some tales that as if Erdoğan came and turned back to Turkey after some tensions between Karamanlis and him.

It is understood that in some countries particularly where a lot of anti-turkist people live, it is such a usual thing making up stories about Turkey. While the real stories are ignored (for instance: “burned Turks by Neo Nazis in Germany) your media frequently tells lies about Turkey to make easy money. (I know that news about Turkey take a lot of attraction in Greece).

And probably you'll tell that our media don't want to tell such news, but believe me our media is more reliable. Any time, when I watch an European or US TV broadcasting a news about Turkey, they usually show our women with headscarf, as if they tell a news about Iran not Turkey.

I guess Eti is right, despite what Armenian and Greek residents have said and how they were targeted, if Eti said it didn't happen, I guess it didn't.

[Eti]

Re: New pogrom against the Armenians and Greeks in Istanbul?

Christian houses in Istanbul marked

05.09.2009 18:55 GMT+04:00

/PanARMENIAN.Net/ Christian houses in the Ferikoy und Kurtulus, areas in Istanbul, where many Armenians and Greeks live, were marked with red or green labels in the past weeks, Die Presse reported.

The labels appear to be in conjunction with complaints from Christians about increasing harassment, according to Sehabat Tuncel, a member of parliament asked in a parliamentary questioning.

Besir Atalay, minister of interior, is now forced to answer these allegations. “Who affixed these markings?” is only one of the questions cited by the press. The ministry must also make clear whether the police received orders to take action and investigate.

The marking on Christian buildings in Istanbul is a reminder of pogrom against Christian minorities in September 1955. Back then Christian buildings and shops had been marked by nationalist activists. The bloody riots with dozens of dead in Istanbul and Izmir were ostensibly triggered by the Cyprus conflict; however, the true reason was the search for scapegoats at a time of economic recession for Turkey.

Link

I haven’t heard such a news recently, most probably it is not true.

These kind of news are always fabricated about Turkey especially in such countries like Greece, but it seems also in Armenia of course. Remember the news published in Greece when Erdoğan canceled his visit to your country. Even serious newspapers such as “To Vima” or “Ta Nea” made up some stories and they told some tales that as if Erdoğan came and turned back to Turkey after some tensions between Karamanlis and him.

It is understood that in some countries particularly where a lot of anti-turkist people live, it is such a usual thing making up stories about Turkey. While the real stories are ignored (for instance: “burned Turks by Neo Nazis in Germany) your media frequently tells lies about Turkey to make easy money. (I know that news about Turkey take a lot of attraction in Greece).

And probably you'll tell that our media don't want to tell such news, but believe me our media is more reliable. Any time, when I watch an European or US TV broadcasting a news about Turkey, they usually show our women with headscarf, as if they tell a news about Iran not Turkey.

[Alexandros]

Re: New pogrom against the Armenians and Greeks in Istanbul?

ISTANBUL RIOTS 1955

What happened on 6-7 September?

"Our father Atatürk's house has been bombed" was the headline of the Istanbul Express newspaper's second issue in 1955. Years later, retired general Sabri Yirmibeşoğlu refers to the pogrom of 6-7 September as an "excellent special warfare operation that reached its aim".

Tolga KORKUT [email protected]

Istanbul - BİA News Center 08 September 2009, Tuesday

Supporting the views of Democratic Party, Istanbul Express Newspaper was owned by Mithat Perin, editorial director of that time was Gökşin Sipahioğlu. "Our father Atatürk's house has been bombed" made the headline of the newspaper's second issue. On 6 September 1955 290,000 issues were printed, exceeding the usual newspaper circulation of 20,000 papers by far. Members of the Cyprus Turkish Association started to distribute the issue all over Istanbul to agitate the people.

Due to reports from eyewitnesses, the riot started from a place in Pangaltı, nowadays the location of Ramada Hotel owned by a Greek citizen. In 1955 this was the place of popular localities such as the 'Haylayf' pastry shop. The riot started with attacking Haylayf pastry shop at 7.00 pm. From here the attacks spread all over Istanbul and all over the country.

Years later journalist Fatih Güllapoğlu interviewed retired general Sabri Yirmibeşoğlu about the Istanbul Riots. Yirmibeşoğlu described the attacks by saying "It was an excellent special warfare operation and it reached its goal." In those days the Greek authorities announced that the bombings in Thessaloniki were a provocation organized by the Turkish state. Oktay Engin, scholarship student at the Thessaloniki Faculty of Law and agent of the National Intelligence Agency (MİT), and Hasan Uçar, tipstaff of the consulate in Thessaloniki, were arrested in regards with this event. After some time in detention Engin and Uçar were released because of the immunity of consular officials. Later on, Engin was appointed to important tasks in MİT, progressed quickly through the different administrative levels of the state and was promoted to the Governorship of Nevşehir in 1992.

According to the press, 11 people died in the riots, according to Greek sources 15 people lost their lives. Officially 30 people were injured, unofficial numbers amount to 300. The number of raped women is estimated to be above 200.

4,214 houses, 1,004 offices, 73 churches, one synagogue, one monastery, 26 schools and 5,317 other places such as hotels and bars were attacked.

The property damage is estimated between 150 million and 1 billion Turk Lira as an equivalent to the value of those days. The Democratic Party government paid about 60 million Turkish Lira in compensation.

Newspapers of the time blamed the Greeks as the actual criminals because they had allegedly provoked the Turks. Yet, as a matter of fact 59 percent of the destroyed offices belonged to Greeks, 17 percent belonged to Armenians and 12 percent to xxxish people. Even places of converts and Muslims from Belarus were among the properties under attack, which shows that the riot cannot be seen as retaliation against the Greeks in connection with Cyprus.

When the riot got out of control Prime Minister Adnan Menderes was called from Sapanca and martial law was declared. In regards with the riots first 3151 people were arrested. Later on this number raised to 5104 people arrested.

Churches and cemeteries were attacked as well: holy pictures, crucifixes, icons and other sacred objects were destroyed. All 73 orthodox churches in Istanbul were set on fire.

Looters from İzmit and Adapazarı were caught with the goods they had plundered in Haydarpaşa train station on their way back. It turned out that many of the looters had been brought form other cities. According to documents from retired judge Fahri Çoker's History Foundation, 145 looters were brought from Sivas, 117 from Trabzon, 116 from Kastamonu and 111 from Erzincan. (TK)

Link

[egeli]

Re: New pogrom against the Armenians and Greeks in Istanbul?

Thanks for the clips!

[Alexandros]

Re: New pogrom against the Armenians and Greeks in Istanbul?

Thank you, with English subtiles too, fantastik.

Gavur, try this one instead.It has better audio sync.Make sure you enable your YouTube captions or the English subtitles by clicking the menu button located on the bottom right of the video player.


Part 1---> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Br-xyLdnXZc

Part 2---> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GdAOK7NyJzw

Part 3---> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hdMt3phcrTA

Part 4---> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kAJNboJqog

Part 5---> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xjh8SK4bgzI

Part 6---> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QvC5lp7dipU

Part 7---> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMrLfzqTif0

Part 8---> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_uzluo0J9o

Part 9---> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWco56PySaU

Part 10---> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4nI5ZJTD0E

Part 11---> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XE6nce7m1hM

Part 12---> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jvH-7FiI8FI

[Gavur]

Re: New pogrom against the Armenians and Greeks in Istanbul?

....and what a huge loss for Turkey.

[Alexandros]

Re: New pogrom against the Armenians and Greeks in Istanbul?

For the record, the 1955 pogroms had nothing to do with Cyprus. Istanbul in 1955 lagged behind the rest of Turkey's purification from indigenous Christians, at least a fourth of the city was non-muslim.

The Turkish Intelligence Agency (MIT) bombed Ataturk's childhoood House in Selanik (modern day Thessalonica, Greece) under a falseflag operation that was blamed on radical Greeks. This was done to provoke retribution by Turks on the huge Greek population in Istanbul.

The Turks who looted and burned the Greek quarter were actually SHIPPED in from conservative Anatolian towns. Hrant Dink's murderer was also not from Istanbul, he was shipped in from the black sea city of Trabzon. Turks in Istanbul, especially in 1955, would have never committed such a crime.

The 1955 pogrom was carefully planned by the Turkish State. '

-
As for the current markings, i wouldn't be too concerned. There will always be people harassing Armenians in Istanbul. What matters is if the STATE is involved or not, which I doubt. A honestly believe even in Hrant Dink's murder that the Turkish state was not directly involved.

I agree with most of what you said however I would like to add that in 1963 - although I wouldn`t call it exactly a pogrom - the remaining Greeks were deported to Greece as a punishment for those TC`s who were killed in the intercommunal fightings between the GC`s and TC`s on Cyprus.

It was all organized from the beginning to get rid of the Greeks who were living in Istanbul.

[Gavur]

Re: New pogrom against the Armenians and Greeks in Istanbul?

Thank you, with English subtiles too, fantastik.