Richard Dawkins interview with Bill O'Reilly

[Lucin]

Re: Richard Dawkins interview with Bill O'Reilly

The "atheism" of most self-assessed "atheists" is fundamentally an intellectual/conceptual attitude. As such, it cannot serve as an existential foundation for life, as life (and love, first and foremost) is not driven by intellect or ideology.

I'm not sure if I understand you correctly but how can our life not be driven by ideology? It just haunts you everywhere you go even if we're not conscious of its existence. Even your talking about 'ideology' in here is ideological, in my opinion.

PS about atheism, it is very sad to see this passion flourishing among armenians.

I share you concern. What is not understandable is that how can people (Atheists here) put Christianity in the same sack as Islam and Judaism and then kick it under the guise of 'religion'? The two latter being narcississtic, racist (at times), childish by nature and concentrating on mundane issues do not have much in common with Christianity, in my opinion.
Also, have you guys even read the NT in its entirety?

[hipeter924]

Re: Richard Dawkins interview with Bill O'Reilly

Buddhism is Atheistic, they don't worship gods as such and it is a religious belief, so you don't have to believe in a god to be religious.

But none the less you can pick and choose over theists and atheists and you will get nowhere. You can pick Stalin and say all Atheists are like him, yet then we point out another Atheist John Lennon that dedicated his entire life to Peace and was murdered by a Christian fanatic. In the end its a rather stupid argument to suggest someone is evil or corrupt from the first because they are Atheist. I would not make the same assumptions about a theist or anyone who believes in other ideologies or beliefs.

But I find many theists instantly assume non-theists are inherently evil, corrupt people on the basis they don't believe in a god. This amuses me and annoys me no end, because no belief system or ideology is evil or corrupt from the first, only how it is applied can be corrupt or evil.

Why Atheists consider many Theists blind, ignorant is simply on the basis they can't physically prove their beliefs, beyond the point of religious texts, spiritual events and hearsay. What many have pointed out is that if Theists could physically prove their beliefs beyond reasonable doubt then there would be no Atheists, because we could all understand and see 'god's work' but the reality is that there are no clear physical proofs of god, if any at all that can't be disproved.

[Yeznik]

Re: Richard Dawkins interview with Bill O'Reilly

One of the many reasons why Atheism seems to be appealing is because it falsely depicts itself as an “intellectual liberation”.

The whole idea, in the Western world, that the universe is rational is based on a religious foundation, mainly Christianity. Furthermore, most of science in its development has been understood in the context in how God created things. Here is a quote from Sir Isaac Newton:

“It became Him (God) who created it to set it in order; and if he did so, it is unphilosophical to seek for any other origin of the world, or to pretend that it might arise out of a chaos by the mere laws of Nature.”

The whole concept of religion being irrational and illogical would only make sense if religion was wholly based on nonsensical blind faith rather than reasonable faith. There are other scientists such as Geneticist Francis Collins who is considered "one of the most accomplished scientists of our time" and John Lennox, who is a Mathematician, who are highly accomplished in their respective fields and are also Christian and speak about their faith openly and more specifically rationally.

Francis Collins: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis...8geneticist%29
John Lennox http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Lennox

Re: Richard Dawkins interview with Bill O'Reilly

Haygagan, I am afraid you totally missed my point, first and foremost, the distinction to be made between reason/rational thinking and rationalism.

You were in a room. You've opened a door but you are still in the house.
Maybe you will stay in the house, maybe you will be find a way to the outside world. I assume the room was crowded and now that you've met Siggie (hanging out in the living?), you think you are breathing fresh air. But you haven't looked through the window yet. You haven't seen the people outside the house. You're hearing one on the radio and you think the voice is coming from the room.

Cheers,
Gabriel

[Haykakan]

Re: Richard Dawkins interview with Bill O'Reilly

Atheism is a strange passion that desperately attempts to dissimulate itself under the guise of rational thinking.
Most people who hold themselves to be "atheist" are not.
A consequent atheist is a nihilist.
What people believe to be atheism is often anti-clericalism, a-dogmatism or lack of faith.

The "atheism" of most self-assessed "atheists" is fundamentally an intellectual/conceptual attitude. As such, it cannot serve as an existential foundation for life, as life (and love, first and foremost) is not driven by intellect or ideology.

Such an attitude either reveals a lack of conscious understanding of what life really is and at the same time the existence of an implicit creed that has not been brought to the conscience, or, the existence of a creed that is conscious but kept hidden.

Ideologists are driven by the irrational love of their ideology, rationalists, by the love of reason they deify.

Rationalism is only a modern form of idolatry.

PS about atheism, it is very sad to see this passion flourishing among armenians.

I strongly disagree with most of what you said here. The foundation for life and love can be different things to different people. A atheist is not necesseraly a nihilist, he/she may think that life indeed has a purpose just not a devine one. The persuit of rational is one that i strongly encourage far more so then the misguided misdirection religion has to offer. The only thing preventing me from calling myself a atheist is the fact that we cannot prove the non-existence of diety (although there is far more proof for that argument then for the existence of a diety). There is no dought we do not have a good comprehention of our universe and that many things are far beyond our understanding but rationality gives us more answers every day and will continue to do so-expanding our understanding of all things. Rationality should be encouraged not villified by people like you and the spread of rational thinking among our people is only a good thing which i hope continues. Obviously some people are scared of rational thought and its consequences mostly because it sometimes goes against some long time tradition or train of thinking. Fear is what keeps people from being rational and conquering ones fears is a very liberating thing. Pretty much all religions try to use fear and they all lose their grip on people once people conquer their own fears and think for themselves. Once a fear is conquered, one can appreciate how silly it was in the first place and how much it was holding you back. Don't let fear drive your life, it will limit you to a nerrow mind and you will missout on most of what life has to offer.

Re: Richard Dawkins interview with Bill O'Reilly

Atheism is a strange passion that desperately attempts to dissimulate itself under the guise of rational thinking.
Most people who hold themselves to be "atheist" are not.
A consequent atheist is a nihilist.
What people believe to be atheism is often anti-clericalism, a-dogmatism or lack of faith.

The "atheism" of most self-assessed "atheists" is fundamentally an intellectual/conceptual attitude. As such, it cannot serve as an existential foundation for life, as life (and love, first and foremost) is not driven by intellect or ideology.

Such an attitude either reveals a lack of conscious understanding of what life really is and at the same time the existence of an implicit creed that has not been brought to the conscience, or, the existence of a creed that is conscious but kept hidden.

Ideologists are driven by the irrational love of their ideology, rationalists, by the love of reason they deify.

Rationalism is only a modern form of idolatry.

PS about atheism, it is very sad to see this passion flourishing among armenians.

[HyeClown]

Re: Richard Dawkins interview with Bill O'Reilly

This is hilarious. You have absolutely no idea what I'm talking about and you keep repeating yourself. Go on, say it again. It's incredibly significant. Or, more likely you'll do some research and finally get what I'm talking about then either claim you knew all along or just change the subject.

I know very well I'm insulting your sham of a hero... it's only my opinion, don't take it too personally.

[Stark Evade]

Re: Richard Dawkins interview with Bill O'Reilly

Let me put it this way.... Richard Dawkins is much a scientist as George Bush is a Christian. Does that make any more sense?

This is hilarious. You have absolutely no idea what I'm talking about and you keep repeating yourself. Go on, say it again. It's incredibly significant. Or, more likely you'll do some research and finally get what I'm talking about then either claim you knew all along or just change the subject.

[HyeClown]

Re: Richard Dawkins interview with Bill O'Reilly

It seems like the ad hominem and the red herring are raising this baby to be strong and healthy.

Let me put it this way.... Richard Dawkins is much a scientist as George Bush is a Christian. Does that make any more sense?

[Stark Evade]

Re: Richard Dawkins interview with Bill O'Reilly

Called it what you will, it's the truth. Those aren't popular scientists, those are scientists that made significant changes to our quality of life through discoveries and inventions.

It seems like the ad hominem and the red herring are raising this baby to be strong and healthy.