Why are atheists disliked in America?

[KanadaHye]

Re: Why are atheists disliked in America?

And the rest? Conveniently ignored for the opportunity to talk about a conspiracy theory?

You're right. The CIA doesn't exist. The FED doesn't take taxes. The U.S. government isn't forcing its military on nearly every country in the world. The American people aren't gullible.

I don't get it. I don't watch garbage. Don't make random comments; defend your position.

If we're going to argue about evolution, perhaps you should create a separate thread. Start it off by describing (or do it here if for that matter) evolutionary theory as you understand it.
We can start there and make sure we all understand the theory before talking about what is consistent or inconsistent with it. Otherwise, it's a futile exercise.

You started on the evolution based argument which has absolutely nothing to do with atheism.

[Siggie]

Re: Why are atheists disliked in America?

Lobotomies were experiments (with CIA and government backing) and scientists learned a lot about the human brain. They weren't intended to be legitimate surgeries for medical purposes. Besides, that was just in the mid 1900's!! Hospitals were also removing tonsils as regular practice because "they weren't necessary" not so long ago.

And the rest? Conveniently ignored for the opportunity to talk about a conspiracy theory?

I'm saying a theory is a theory and evidence changes over time so trying to figure out a crime scene 100 or 1000 years after the crime lessens the chances of collecting valid evidence. The same can be applied in cases of evolution. The world undergoes change and is never constant (what might hold true for a certain time period might not be the case for another)

They have not encountered a single piece of evidence that contradicts. It's not as if they stopped looking after they made the first few observations.

You think something that happens today won't leave any evidence that it happened 100 years or more later?
Whether it presents a challenge or whether you understand the details of a field that is neither your own nor one you have looked much into is not the question here...

The yolk sac is empty during pregnancy? The function of the yolk sac during pregnancy in humans is MUCH different than that of a chicken egg.

They are not gill slits! They are intermediate stages in human embryo development. The throat (or pharyngeal) grooves and pouches, falsely called "gill slits" are not mistakes in human development. They develop into absolutely essential parts of human anatomy. The middle ear canals come from the second pouches, and the parathyroid and thymus glands come from the third and fourth. Another pouch, thought to be vestigial by evolutionists until just recently, becomes a gland that assists in calcium balance. Far from being useless evolutionary vestiges, then, these so-called "gill slits" are quite essential for distinctively human development.

Okay gill freakin' folds, okay? What does it change? Show me an academic peer reviewed source that demonstrates that these same folds turn into mid-ear structures. Same ones... not that these folds form over that area.
These are not the only examples you know (e.g. limb buds in dolphins)... Again... WATCH THE VIDEO.

Have you been watching Shallow Hal again?

I don't get it. I don't watch garbage. Don't make random comments; defend your position.

If we're going to argue about evolution, perhaps you should create a separate thread. Start it off by describing (or do it here if for that matter) evolutionary theory as you understand it.
We can start there and make sure we all understand the theory before talking about what is consistent or inconsistent with it. Otherwise, it's a futile exercise.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Why are atheists disliked in America?

Oh no... we're still talking about humors, we're still blood-letting, we're still dissecting cadavers and then delivering babies without washing hands, we're still conducting lobotomies, we're still rubbing mercury into every wound, and we're still treating coughs with heroin.

Lobotomies were experiments (with CIA and government backing) and scientists learned a lot about the human brain. They weren't intended to be legitimate surgeries for medical purposes. Besides, that was just in the mid 1900's!! Hospitals were also removing tonsils as regular practice because "they weren't necessary" not so long ago.

Are you saying we shouldn't collect new evidence once we answer a question in science? We're done, close the book on it forever, never re-evaluate in light of new evidence?
They constantly evaluate whether new observations fit with evolutionary theory and so far, they always have.
I don't understand exactly what you're arguing here...

I'm saying a theory is a theory and evidence changes over time so trying to figure out a crime scene 100 or 1000 years after the crime lessens the chances of collecting valid evidence. The same can be applied in cases of evolution. The world undergoes change and is never constant (what might hold true for a certain time period might not be the case for another)

Do you not actually read what I post? I'm also 100% certain that you never watched the video I posted.

It's not a genuine yolk because it's EMPTY, but it is a yolk sac.
It's not functioning gills, it's the gill slits that in fish, then develop into gills.
It's the protrusion that develops into a tail in tailed creatures. Of course it wouldn't have vertebrae.

The point is that the genes for these things are broken by mutations.
When they look at the dna for these things and compare to dna for other animals, they can see it's the same, but with some mutations that have "broken" it.
If a creator created humans independently, then why would we have a broken egg yolk gene?

The yolk sac is empty during pregnancy? The function of the yolk sac during pregnancy in humans is MUCH different than that of a chicken egg.

They are not gill slits! They are intermediate stages in human embryo development. The throat (or pharyngeal) grooves and pouches, falsely called "gill slits" are not mistakes in human development. They develop into absolutely essential parts of human anatomy. The middle ear canals come from the second pouches, and the parathyroid and thymus glands come from the third and fourth. Another pouch, thought to be vestigial by evolutionists until just recently, becomes a gland that assists in calcium balance. Far from being useless evolutionary vestiges, then, these so-called "gill slits" are quite essential for distinctively human development.

"It's the protrusion that develops into a tail in tailed creatures. Of course it wouldn't have vertebrae."

Have you been watching Shallow Hal again?

It is a wonder that atheists are more disliked than the faithful.

I don't find the above to be only stupid, but also disgusting and dangerous. This ridiculous billboard campaign is only being allowed because it is in the name of faith, but suppose that I, in my wisdom, predicted that a terrorist attack would occur on May 21st, or that some other natural disaster was coming that I had some sort of information about. Not only would the authorities be likely to come an investigate me, but it would also be treasonous to be campaigning for and celebrating the impending end of the world (and by implication, the end of this country).

In addition, why is it acceptable for me to drive around my city with signs put up that are meant only to frighten the public, potentially inciting a riot. Now I'm hoping there won't be a riot, and I don't think there will be, but telling the population that you, beyond a shadow of a doubt, know that the world is going to an end would be grounds for inciting a riot.

At the very least, I don't want children seeing these signs and hearing these advertisements and being scared out of their wits because they simply don't know better. There is no way around it, this is simply a disgusting and unsettling campaign by people who claim to be the righteous and holier than us unbelievers who will be left here to writhe and burn in anguish while they watch on from heaven.

In the poll that started this thread, it said religious people who dislike atheists do so because they feel atheists are "in their face." Well, trying to deliberately frighten me and my children* with slogans of the end time, which by the way there has been no public outcry against, is far more in your face and repulsive than anything Christopher Hitchens or Richard Dawkins has ever done to offend the faithful.


*(This was a hypothetical, I don't actually have any children of my own)

This is propaganda.... only the Zionist Christians/ Evangelicals are fed this stuff through their brainless ministers. The "end of times" refers to the "end of an era", not the "end of the world".

[Jinx]

Re: Why are atheists disliked in America?

It is a wonder that atheists are more disliked than the faithful.

I don't find the above to be only stupid, but also disgusting and dangerous. This ridiculous billboard campaign is only being allowed because it is in the name of faith, but suppose that I, in my wisdom, predicted that a terrorist attack would occur on May 21st, or that some other natural disaster was coming that I had some sort of information about. Not only would the authorities be likely to come an investigate me, but it would also be treasonous to be campaigning for and celebrating the impending end of the world (and by implication, the end of this country).

In addition, why is it acceptable for me to drive around my city with signs put up that are meant only to frighten the public, potentially inciting a riot. Now I'm hoping there won't be a riot, and I don't think there will be, but telling the population that you, beyond a shadow of a doubt, know that the world is going to an end would be grounds for inciting a riot.

At the very least, I don't want children seeing these signs and hearing these advertisements and being scared out of their wits because they simply don't know better. There is no way around it, this is simply a disgusting and unsettling campaign by people who claim to be the righteous and holier than us unbelievers who will be left here to writhe and burn in anguish while they watch on from heaven.

In the poll that started this thread, it said religious people who dislike atheists do so because they feel atheists are "in their face." Well, trying to deliberately frighten me and my children* with slogans of the end time, which by the way there has been no public outcry against, is far more in your face and repulsive than anything Christopher Hitchens or Richard Dawkins has ever done to offend the faithful.


*(This was a hypothetical, I don't actually have any children of my own)

[Siggie]

Re: Why are atheists disliked in America?

Read up on Roman and Greek medicinal practices. We haven't really advanced THAT far in 2000 years.

Oh no... we're still talking about humors, we're still blood-letting, we're still dissecting cadavers and then delivering babies without washing hands, we're still conducting lobotomies, we're still rubbing mercury into every wound, and we're still treating coughs with heroin.

If the truth keeps changing with new evidence and the world isn't constant, what does that tell you about the evidence?

Are you saying we shouldn't collect new evidence once we answer a question in science? We're done, close the book on it forever, never re-evaluate in light of new evidence?
They constantly evaluate whether new observations fit with evolutionary theory and so far, they always have.
I don't understand exactly what you're arguing here...

How does this change the fact that the yolk, gill and tail were found to be false evidence in regards to placing humans into the evolutionary tree?

Do you not actually read what I post? I'm also 100% certain that you never watched the video I posted.

It's not a genuine yolk because it's EMPTY, but it is a yolk sac.
It's not functioning gills, it's the gill slits that in fish, then develop into gills.
It's the protrusion that develops into a tail in tailed creatures. Of course it wouldn't have vertebrae.

The point is that the genes for these things are broken by mutations.
When they look at the dna for these things and compare to dna for other animals, they can see it's the same, but with some mutations that have "broken" it.
If a creator created humans independently, then why would we have a broken egg yolk gene?

[KanadaHye]

Re: Why are atheists disliked in America?

E.g. transfer of infection right?

Read up on Roman and Greek medicinal practices. We haven't really advanced THAT far in 2000 years.

Quoted for truth.

If the truth keeps changing with new evidence and the world isn't constant, what does that tell you about the evidence?

Incomplete. Doesn't consider the newer evidence since it was originally suggested and doesn't address DNA evidence.
This is why I said you should look also at the evidence for as well.

How does this change the fact that the yolk, gill and tail were found to be false evidence in regards to placing humans into the evolutionary tree?

[Siggie]

Lets please not go down the line of questioning evolution. There are many good discussions about theism vs atheism vs agnosticism and there is basically 0 good discussions about evolution. When it comes to evolution, there are basically two types of people: Those who know the facts and those who don't. Among those who know the facts, there is very little debate on whether evolution is "true" or not

Quoted for truth.

Scientists believed in the middle of the 19th century that the human embryo went through all stages of the evolution of the species. Scientific theories of that time said that the impregnated ovum grows into the freshwater hydroid, turns into the gilled fish, develops into a tailed animal and finally becomes a human being.

It was proved long ago that the hypothesis was incorrect, to put it mildly.
...

Incomplete. Doesn't consider the newer evidence since it was originally suggested and doesn't address DNA evidence.
This is why I said you should look also at the evidence for as well.

They may have not had the ability to treat or the technology to diagnose but they sure as hell knew how to prevent.

Like how to prevent pregnancy, transfer of germs, infections, etc., death from kidney failure, tuberculosis, heart disease and strokes, scurvy... Shall we go on?
Yeah, they prevent most of the diseases we're dealing with today by dying long before they became issues. E.g. by dying from tooth infections, falling off cliffs, being eaten by wild animals long before they could die of heart disease.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Why are atheists disliked in America?

Yes, people 2000 years ago knew more about health and medicine.

They may have not had the ability to treat or the technology to diagnose but they sure as hell knew how to prevent.

[Siggie]

Re: Why are atheists disliked in America?

Sure, if you think knowledge is about knowing how to use your blackberry! People are clueless about everything from food to health to medicine. If government didn't hold their hand, they'd be lost like little children.

Yes, people 2000 years ago knew more about health and medicine.

If you want to ban me you can go ahead and ban me for good after this one.

First you send me a private message and warn me by banning, then you come here and post this? It takes a coward and a sissy to do what you did, especially since you are a moderator and you’re abusing your power.

You must be a very happy person now that your ignorant clowns are cheering you on this one.
How ignorant you can be since you don’t know one of God’s 10 commandment “Thou shalt not kill.” Yet you bring this pathetic example to demonstrate your ignorance.

And for the "hallucination" thing, let's try this…
What is the percentage of people around the world who believe in God in your opinion? It doesn’t matter what kind of God as long as they consider it their god, be it Muslims, Christians, Buddhists, Joows, Satanists, devil worshipers etc. etc…
What is the percentage of nonbelievers and atheists around the world in your opinion?
When we put both believers and nonbelievers/atheist on the opposite sides of a scale which side do you think will tip?
After answering that, what do you think most believers do when they pray? Let me explain if you don’t know the answer to that: praying means talking with God.
So according to you and your ignorant clowns the majority of people around the world are hallucinating?

This is precisely what the article in the original post described...

You are a very angry person. This is a beautiful way to speak to a lady who only asked that you not engage in personal insults and to try and control your temper.
I'm sure if I had been agreeing with you in the thread, but had asked you to refrain from personal insults anyway (rules?!), you would never have replied with "kiss my @ss!"
Why don't you talk to your god and see what he thinks about your behavior.

You think everyone who disagrees with you is ignorant and that speaks volumes about true ignorance.
I didn't share a stupid pointless exercise with you. I was actually sharing the beginning of a couple different scenarios meant to be illustrative. Something I learned in law school. Forgive me for trying to share my "ignorance."

I usually try to at least defend the other side for future readers than those I'm engaging in discussion, so there's more a balanced view for posterity. Here, I think there's little need for it.
As if what you originally said wasn't laughable already, you counter with, and I'm paraphrasing, "duh, people pray all the time." Who equated prayer with hallucination? When God starts answering you then you're hallucinating.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Why are atheists disliked in America?

KanadaHye, it's hard for me to know whether you are joking or being serious so I am going to assume you are joking ... The average person just maybe 15-20 years ago didn't know nearly as much as the average person now ... let alone 2000 years ago.

I mean come on 2000 years ago people actually thought some magical God created everything in 7 days and then made a flood that wiped out everything except for one boat with ... hmmm ... wait .. maybe you ARE right!!! Yes, average people are still idiots.

Sure, if you think knowledge is about knowing how to use your blackberry! People are clueless about everything from food to health to medicine. If government didn't hold their hand, they'd be lost like little children.