War in The Middle East

[Sip]

Re: War in The Middle East

Yes, that is manly. Maybe you American Christian men could learn something from them about fighting for honor, family and homeland. Maybe you could try to emulate Hezbollah. They might teach you a lesson or two in manliness. And if you’re nice, they might even lend you some testosterone.

Yah learn from Hezbolla .. learn how to treat women like your property, given them less rights than dogs, point rockets to anyone who doesn't share your ideology, and pretend you are going to heaven to have sex with virgins when you do allah's work. Emmm ... yah, that's very "manly" indeed.

The poor kids following "Hezbollah" and spilling their guts for these rediculous ideologies are the ones that could be great men. But in the end, they are brainwashed by the likes of Hezbollah and led to believe they are on some sort of holy crusade set in motion by some magical being in the sky. Hezbollah is "manly"? Paaaaaaalease. There is NOTHING manly about someone who wants to kill you because you don't believe what he believes.

[Sip]

Re: War in The Middle East

As to opinions, Sip's are the most illogical, irrelevant, simple minded and vacuous you will see anywhere.

Why? Because I don't tend to share your obvious and pure hatered of the j*ews? Let me guess, if I suddenly started to hate the j*ews like you do, I would magically be transformed into the most intelligent being that ever existed, right?

[Davo88]

Re: War in The Middle East

That article was good. Nothing to say..

A UN observation post was hit by Israeli airstrikes, killing 4 UN workers/soldiers, including a Canadian.

http://today.reuters.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=newsOne&storyid=2006-07-26T010253Z_01_N25237440_RTRUKOT_0_TEXT0.xml&WTmodLoc=NewsArt-L1-RelatedNews-2

[Anonymouse]

Re: War in The Middle East

Yah learn from Hezbolla .. learn how to treat women like your property, given them less rights than dogs, point rockets to anyone who doesn't share your ideology, and pretend you are going to heaven to have sex with virgins when you do allah's work. Emmm ... yah, that's very "manly" indeed.

The poor kids following "Hezbollah" and spilling their guts for these rediculous ideologies are the ones that could be great men. But in the end, they are brainwashed by the likes of Hezbollah and led to believe they are on some sort of holy crusade set in motion by some magical being in the sky. Hezbollah is "manly"? Paaaaaaalease. There is NOTHING manly about someone who wants to kill you because you don't believe what he believes.

While I am no fan of Islam and radical Muslim organizations, your characterization of both Hezbollah and Hamas is a very simplistic one and an understatement at best.

You must first realize that Hezbollah and Hamas are reactions to the existence of Israel and Israeli policies of state terrorism, Hamas being originally funded into existence by Israel as a counter to Palestinian nationalism embodied in the PLO. Terrorism is not simply a monopoly of Muslim zealots and fanatics. It is very much and more so a product of States than anything else.

While at the time Israel and America feared Arab nationalism, they heavily funded these radical Islamic groups into existence that have come back to bite them in the ass.

More than being obsessed with "killing people who don't believe as they do" they are, at least they see themselves as, legitimate contenders for power and a buffer against what they perceive as Zionist-American aggression. They see themselves as defenders of their people and lands against a perceived enemy, they also see themselves as fulfilling the function of many failed Arab states providing charities, services and other avenues to help the people. It is much more than your simplistic brush stroke of mere Muslim fanatics who want to obliterate everyone.

For every cause (Zionist-American aggression) there is a reaction.

If these poor kids follow Hezbollah and Hamas, what about those kids that follow Israels army? Why is it that only one side is brainwashed (usually the side we are against) but the other side is not brainwashed (the one we identify with)? What about those Zionists that believe non-xxxs are not worth a xxxish fingernail? If you are going to condemn ideologues and zealots, don't limit it to your average Mohammed fanatics, but include your Star of David variety as well.

[Anonymouse]

Re: War in The Middle East

Lebanon - The Israeli Game Plan

By Terrell E. Arnold
7-22-6

Yesterday the Israelis issued an injunction to all people to evacuate southern Lebanon. The Israeli instructions are to clear the coastal region of Lebanon from the Israeli border to the Litani River. The zone to be evacuated is about 25 miles deep and normally contains about 250,000 people. However, many foreigners have been evacuated through Tyre, the main city of the region, and the Lebanese population is left to its own devices to escape. At the same time, the Israel Defense Force (IDF) has massed forces in the Lebanon/Israeli frontier under an obvious plan to initiate occupation of the territory Israel has asked people to evacuate. In preparation for these moves, the IDF has been conducting air and naval artillery attacks across Lebanon that appear designed to reduce the country to rubble, rendering large parts of it uninhabitable. Several hundred people have been killed and many more have been wounded.

Could this carnage really be about release by Hezbollah of two captured Israeli soldiers? The answer obviously is no, unless, of course, Israeli leadership have lost their collective minds. But then, what is it about?

On the face of things, as reported by mainstream media, the immediate plan is to decimate Hezbollah, and that plan appears tacitly to be approved by the United States, Western European countries and maybe a number of Arab governments. However, while somewhat more than half of the Lebanese people are Shi'a Muslims, an unknown number of the Shi'a are members of Hezbollah, while the Israeli attacks are being carried out forcefully against all Lebanese. At least 500,000 people have been displaced and the infrastructure to support Lebanon's approximate 4,000,000 people is being systematically destroyed. In short, as the Israeli have collectively punished all Palestinians for the existence of Hamas, the IDF is now collectively punishing all Lebanese, including the large Shi'a Amal community, for the presence of Hezbollah.

Such all out war is not possible on the spur of the moment. Israel obviously has been planning such a maneuver for some time, and building its inventory of American munitions and aircraft, such as Cobra helicopters, for launch on short notice. As several commentators have noted, it only needed a pretext. The actual pretext was not the capture of two Israeli soldiers, however, but the fact that Hezbollah had moved to help the Palestinians after weeks of IDF bombardment and harassment designed to cause the fall of Palestine's Hamas government. The Hezbollah reaction to Israeli attacks on the Palestinians was predictable. Thus, Hezbollah appears to have walked into a well-prepared Israeli trap, but there is evidence it knew what was coming and was preparing for it.

The question therefore becomes: What was the Israeli game plan before Hezbollah played into their hands? The plan must be viewed through the window of long term Israeli goals. Some Israelis have for decades sought occupation and ownership of all of Palestine. Israeli refusal to negotiate settlement of any critical issue (boundaries, compensation, right of return, Palestinian statehood, access to Jerusalem), has not been due to recalcitrance or steadfast refusal of the Palestinians to come to terms; it has been due simply to Israeli leadership refusal to give on any issue where long term Israeli interests would have to be in some way reduced, prejudiced, redefined or given away.

The opportunity presented by failure to agree on any key issue has been used repeatedly by Israel to create new facts on the ground. The Palestinians have gained nothing from this process but accumulating losses, i.e., (1) reduced Palestinian presence in Jerusalem due to defacto expulsion, (2) increased Israeli presence in the West Bank through creation of settlements and exclusive roads to reach them, (3) increasing cooption of water resources by Israelis and decreasing allocations of water to Palestinians, (4) increasing time, distance, death of parties, and erection of competing rights to lands, buildings, olive trees and other valuable assets, (5) incremental shifts in boundaries due to settlements, the wandering wall and other boundary creep, (6) long term and systematic expulsion of Palestinians from their lands, villages and homes in present day Israel (7) systematic exclusion of Palestinians from the Jordan Valley, and other examples such as denial of citizenship to Palestinians who live in Israel.

If history is any guide, this same game plan will now be extended to Lebanon. Note the deliberate and generalized destruction of the Lebanese infrastructure: Roads, bridges, port facilities, airport runways and buildings, urban housing and roads. The Israeli argument for these attacks is that any feature of the Lebanese infrastructure is part of a terrorism support system. But in the long run this destructive attack pattern is all designed to assure that the Lebanon that exists after a ceasefire will not be capable for a long time of any significant resistance. This plan may backfire, however, because the Syrians may decide to cross the Lebanon Mountains and re-enter what is left of Lebanon. Moreover, the sizeable Shi'a Amal population may be provoked by Israeli pounding into combining forces with Hezbollah in militant as well as in the political terms that already exist. The pattern of attack assures that Israel will have few, if any, friends in the future Lebanon.

The Israeli attack on Lebanon has revealed a pattern of double standards that may permanently change the global attack on terrorism and insurgency, if not warfare in general. First, absent significant US, UN and European objections, the Israelis are being encouraged to virtually destroy Lebanon as a state. This establishes a pattern for any who care to use it of deliberate disassembly of any state that willingly or unwillingly harbors an insurgent/terrorist group. However, any other government that uses this pattern should expect sharp criticism, not the tolerant indulgence being shown Israel. Second, the Israelis are attacking another country with American weapons in violation of US laws. While far from objecting, the US is undertaking emergency supply of smart bombs to compound the destruction of Lebanon. Third, the Israelis are being given free rein to destroy Lebanon and Palestine on the pretext that Hezbollah has captured two Israeli soldiers and the Palestinians have captured one. But at the same time the whole world is silent about the fact that the Israelis hold hundreds of Lebanese and thousands of Palestinians, some who have been confined for decades, but few of them have ever been charged with any specific crime or brought to trial. Fourth, Hezbollah is being encouraged to lay down its arms and stop fighting, but the Israelis are tacitly being given enough time, by the US particularly, to complete their destruction of any Hezbollah infrastructure; if the Hezbollah forces quit now, the Israelis are likely to decimate them. Fifth, Hezbollah, and implicitly the whole of Lebanon, are being charged with the sin of being supported by Syria and Iran, while it is patently OK for Israel to receive massive support from the United States, Britain and others.

Such a pattern of standards is working to polarize the planet in a manner we have never before witnessed. This is not about the traditional bi-polar collisions of great powers. This is about the rights and interests of the great majority of the world's people being abused and xxxxxled upon by a small cluster of elites. That pattern of catering to Israeli aggression is dominated by, but is not limited to, the United States.

In the meantime, Israel has been given perfect cover for achievement of a long held goal. If the Israelis have their way, key new facts on the ground will be created in what is now southern Lebanon. Israel has had its eye on that area for decades.

The prize is the Litani River, a stream that rises in the Lebanon mountain range, flows south for more than half its length, then turns west and enters the Mediterranean some miles north of the city of Tyre. As seen from Israel, there is no other comparable potential source of potable or irrigation waters in the region other than costly desalination of the sea itself. With that river in mind, in the 1930s Ben-Gurion, one of the founding fathers of Israel, conceived of boundaries for the fledgling state of Israel that extended from the Litani River in Lebanon across the Syrian Desert and Jordan and south into the Sinai Peninsula. Others have dreamed of the waters of the Litani and have concocted schemes such as pipelines and tunnels to bring the water to Israel. Ben-Gurion's map not only scooped up the Litani but grabbed the Yarmuk River as well, the only significant feed to the Jordan River from the Jordanian side.

In brutal terms, in a land where water is life, the Israelis are willing to kill, wound and displace many thousands of people, and remake the regional map to get water. That pattern has preempted most of the waters of the Jordan basin, both aquifers and flowing streams for Israeli use--at the expense mainly of the Palestinians.

It is clear that the Israelis now plan to take the territory and plant themselves on the banks of the Litani. Under the guise of ending the threat posed by Hezbollah to the northern areas of Israel, the idea will be to create a "buffer zone". As the Israelis see it, Hezbollah has underscored that necessity by successfully dropping missiles on Haifa in the current engagement.

The idea of a buffer zone is unlikely to be opposed by the US, the Europeans or the UN. The problem the Israelis have to solve is how to keep the buffer zone from being manned by foreign troops. Foreign troops in the zone will be no help to Israel's scheme. They must be in charge and able to create new facts on the ground that will make the occupied Lebanese territory part of Israel. That scheme has worked successfully to acquire virtually every inch of Israel at no acquisition cost to the Israelis. So why adopt any other scheme? The starting gambit is to get the United States, the Europeans, and the UN to support Israeli occupation of the territory "for the time being", while the dust settles and the Lebanese in the rest of the country try to put their lives back together. That recovery process will take longer than the Israelis need to defacto finish annexation of southern Lebanon.

If this scheme works, through yet another irrational appearing, but calculated, act of carnage, Israel will have pulled off a three part coup. It will have removed Hezbollah as a threat to Israel from Lebanon; it will have eliminated Hezbollah as a paramilitary and psychological source of support to the Palestinians; and it will have stolen the waters of the Litani River. To initiate such a grand design, Prime Minister Ehud Olmert's strategic planners needed only an excuse to start. The Hezbollah capture of Israeli soldiers was plausible. Eliminating Hezbollah had resonance in the West. It can be hoped that neither reason lasts long enough to cover the Israeli plan to steal the Litani River and southern Lebanon from the Lebanese people.

http://www.rense.com/general72/plan.htm

[HayotzAmrotz]

Re: War in The Middle East

i am both armenian and xxxish.

OMG

I agree with the Armenian when he says that you can’t be both an Armenian and xxxish. You are either one or the other.

Ever since the birth of Zionism in the 19th century any xxx who supported it and then later on supported Israel is called Zionist, full stop.

Currently the vast majority of the xxxs support Israel and that’s natural for them to do so because Zionism is the best thing that has happened to them for a very long time.

HOWEVER, from the Armenian point of view, Zionism from its very beginning was, and currently even more so is, essentially anti-Armenian and there are no two ways about it.

The current Israeli-Turkish love affair goes back much further then the year 1948 when Israel came to existence.

The fall of Constantinople in 1453 and the subsequent destruction of the Byzantine Empire by the Turks was seen by the xxxs as a divine sign heralding the coming of the Messiah.

What followed was a huge xxxish migration from all over the Europe to Ottoman Empire, which was enormously encouraged by all of the Ottoman rulers.

Immediately after their arrival xxxs have began establishing a tradition of political influence at the highest level of the Ottoman Empire, a tradition that continued very strongly all the way to the establishment of the Turkish Republic in 1923.

In the middle of the 15th century there were people such as the xxxish woman, Esther Chiera (died 1592) who stood high in the favour of the Sultan’s harem, and was considered by foreign diplomats to be one of the most influential persons in the capital, or Joseph Nasi, (died 1579) who personally created many European conflicts (for example between Spain and Netherlands) and is easily considered the most powerful Turkish-xxx ever.

Fast forward to the 19th century when one Theodore Herzl (1860-1904), who is regarded by the xxxs as the father of Zionism, was very influential man frequented in the palaces of almost every European leader from the German Kaiser to the Pope. Herzl volunteered his services to Sultan Abdul Hamid and tried his best on Sultan's behalf to persuade the leaders of the Armenian community to submit to Sultan. After failing that he went to Europe and used all his formidable influence on the European press and public opinion to diminish the Armenian massacres...

…Look, OMG - at the end of the day it’s in your hands to choose whether you are an Armenian or a xxx, but you can’t be both!

[Nemesis]

Re: War in The Middle East

Why? Because I don't tend to share your obvious and pure hatered of the j*ews? Let me guess, if I suddenly started to hate the j*ews like you do, I would magically be transformed into the most intelligent being that ever existed, right?

Thanks for proving my case.

[Armenian]

Re: War in The Middle East

Good job Anonymouse and Hayotzamrotz.

There is a lot of childish talk about Muslim Arabs/Iranians being the greatest enemy of western civilization/Christianity. As an devout Christian I want to state the following:

The Arab/Persian/Islamic world is not a monolith like we are lead to believe here in the west. There are as many deep divisions in the Mideast as there are in Europe. Nations like the Gulf states, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Jordan and Pakistan are essentially American client states. The only regional players that are not on the same boat as the "one world zionist order" crowd are Iran and Syria - and not too long ago, Iraq. That is why the powers that be are trying to destroy those who don't go along with the "grand" plan.

Also bear in mind that:

THE GLOBAL ISLAMIC TERRORISM WE ARE SEEING RECENTLY HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH SYRIA, IRAN AND LEBANON. SO, WHY ARE WE WESTERNERS TARGETING THESE NATIONS?

THE ISLAMIC PROBLEM THAT EXISTS IN ENGLAND IS PAKISTANI.

THE ISLAMIC PROBLEM THAT EXISTS IN FRANCE IS AFRICAN.

THE ISLAMIC PROBLEM THAT EXISTS IN GERMANY IS TURKISH AND KURDISH.

THE ISLAMIC PROBLEM IN SERBIA IS ALBANIAN, BOSNIAN AND TURKISH.

THE ISLAMIC PROBLEM IN RUSSIA IS PAKISTANI, CHECHEN, GEORGIAN, SAUDI AND TURKISH.

THE ISLAMIC PROBLEM IN INDIA IS PAKISTANI.

THE ISLAMIC PROBLEM IN AFGHANISTAN IS PAKISTANI.

THE ISLAMIC PROBLEM IN INDONESIA IS SAUDI AND PAKISTANI.

JUST IN CASE NO ONE NOTICED THE NATIONS OF PAKISTAN, ALBANIA, SAUDI ARABIA, BOSNIA, TURKEY ARE AMERICAN STRONGHOLDS.

AND AL-QAEDA IS EITHER A SAUDI, PAKISTANI, AMERICAN OR ISRAELI SPONSORED ORGANIZATION.

MOST WESTERNERS TODAY ARE UNABLE TO SEE THIS ALL THIS.

Nations like Syria and Iran are vital for the well being of the western world. Without a viable Iran and Syria, the entire region in question will either get saturated by Sunni fundametalists (read Taliban and Al-Qaeda types) or it will get overun by Zionists and pan-Turkists. This matter has nothing to do with being pro-Islam, this is real politics, something many of you here know nothing about.

The strategic value of Iran and Syria is reason why nations like Russia and Armenia defend them. We do ourselves no favors when we make claims like - we should not take sides in this war, or Islami is the enemy. I WILL TAKE THE SIDE OF SYRIA AND IRAN ANY DAY AND IN MY OPINION THOSE TWO NATIONS ARE HEROIC NATIONS.

The western world is a slave to liberalism, globalism and zionism. Moreover, greater turmoil in the region means more Middle Eastern refugees flowing to the west. I say let Arabs live in their nations, let them overthrow their dictators, let them keep their oil money, let them do whatever they want to their women. Let them do what ever they want with Israel. TELLING MUSLIMS HOW TO LIVE IS NOT OUR BUSINESS. We have more important things to worry about, like our borders, our economy, our security and international reputation.

[Sip]

Re: War in The Middle East

I definitely notice a pattern in the list above... or maybe it's my simple-minded intellect and illogical reasoning and all... unless y'all want to claim Israel and America are behind "The Islamic Problem ..." in the whole rest of the world too.

[Anonymouse]

Re: War in The Middle East

I definitely notice a pattern in the list above... or maybe it's my simple-minded intellect and illogical reasoning and all... unless y'all want to claim Israel and America are behind "The Islamic Problem ..." in the whole rest of the world too.

But the fact that radical Islam is rising fast and has been so the past few decades is interesting because it is a symptom of American and Israeli policies. Why else would it rise to begin with? What reason do they have to see Islam as an alternative instead of the conventional nationalist based statecraft? It is because when they tried the conventional approach to nationalist based statecraft they have always gotten the short end of the stick with nothing more than puppet regimes that report to America. Furthermore, American hegemony and empire, as well as Israel's aggressions over the years have done more than anything to rally the people to alternatives to the Western model.

I do claim that Israel and America are precisely the reasons for the surge of radical Islam. The world and history are interrelated in causal links and relationships and the smallest steps result in the greatest unintended consequences. For example, America during the Cold War funded the Mujahadeen which is now considered "evil" and terrorist organization. Israel funded Hamas, which has now won in free elections and Israel has seen it as a threat.

The link you posted was interesting. I definitely agree that states like Iran and Syria and Lebanon are very important for the Western world. Perhaps Israel and America do not realize how vital it is that these states are functional and they have an actual state to deal with. When the states are replaced by stateless militias reporting to a higher authority than the earth, then you have a problem, one which even the most powerful and economically advantageous states cannot even subdue. Just look at Iraq and Afghanistan.