What do you guys think? Armenian w/ non-Armenian?

[Armenian]

Re: Dating non-armenians

Even in Armenia, my dad's cousin married a Russian. Now he is the most unhappy camper our family knows. His wife of 30 years is a royal bytch, the families don't get along with her, nor does he. His daughters side with her against him, and it isn't pretty. Often times people like to bring up examples of stupid hypotheticals such as:

If you had the choice to marry an Armenian girl and be miserable or marry a non-Armenian girl and be happy, which would you choose?

Hypotheticals such as these are not real for they are not reflective of a world of a choice, but are designed to corner the person in question to pick A or B, when in fact, in reality there is the choice of rejecting both. And furthermore who said happiness is something you should look for in external things, even other people? You must first be complete and happy within yourself to seek another soul to compliment you. Another cousin of mine who is engaged to a non-Armenian girl cited a similar reasoning to the above. The truth is, marriage is a big deal for in any marriage it is not just you that is getting married, but families as well, as it is not just a union of individuals, but families, tribes and nations for it is only an extension of the biological life force. My grandfather used to say, "Amusnutyuna cheketrats dzemeruk eh". It means that marriage is a watermelon that is not cut yet, so you can't really see the inside, what it will be like, or what to expect. As such, hypotheticals about future happiness are at best self-delusions as no one can know that.

Its all a matter of what we promote within our diasporan societies.

We can't control peoples feelings. People will fall in love regardless of patriotic considerations, for love is blind. Will inter-ethnic unions occur within the Diaspora? Of course it will, its quite natural when you are surrounded by non-Armenians. However, we can't promote inter-ethnic unions, nor can we take them lightly, for we must help - preserve- our dispora as long as possible for reasons stated above.

On the other hand, within the Armenian Republic, I would not mind it if Armenians intermingled with compatible peoples, for within Armenia there is no danger of assimilation.

[Anonymouse]

Re: Dating non-armenians

Perhaps I wasn't clear. Love is a choice. Who you choose is a choice. After that, and only after that, when you have allowed yourself to fall, when you have given the green light of your feelings to take over, only then is love blind. I refuse to believe in a world without choice.

Furthermore, it is still not okay, even in Armenia I wouldn't want people to 'intermingle' with 'compatible peoples'. I am for preservation all the way, not half-way, not a third of the way, etc.

[tunot]

Re: Dating non-armenians

I see mixing as an enrichment to our blood (you gotta admit that we have some m... ugly inbred-like members.)

[Armenian]

Re: Dating non-armenians

Perhaps I wasn't clear. Love is a choice. Who you choose is a choice. After that, and only after that, when you have allowed yourself to fall, when you have given the green light of your feelings to take over, only then is love blind. I refuse to believe in a world without choice. Furthermore, it is still not okay, even in Armenia I wouldn't want people to 'intermingle' with 'compatible peoples'. I am for preservation all the way, not half-way, not a third of the way, etc.

Well, I guess I am a romantic, for I believe in love as a "feeling" and as a "choice," not merely a "choice." If marriage/love was just a choice, then its a form of contractual prostitution.

Wife - I will sleep with you, bear you children and clean up after you if you put a roof over my head and feed us.

Husband - I will take care of you if you cook for me, wash my dirty laundery, have sex with me and bear me children.

Personally, I would not be able to handel such a marriage. Perhaps that is why so many "arranged" marriages are not very happy marriages. However, I also don't agree with the - its my life and I'll do as I please - attitude of the west either.

In choozing a "life" mate one must use his/her brain and heart together - using one without the other will make a person miserable for the rest of his/her life.

[Anonymouse]

Re: Dating non-armenians

Well, I guess I am a romantic, for I believe in love as a "feeling" and as a "choice," not merely a "choice." If marriage/love was just a choice, then its a form of contractual prostitution.

Wife - I will sleep with you, bear you children and clean up after you if you put a roof over my head and feed us.

Husband - I will take care of you if you cook for me, wash my dirty laundery, have sex with me and bear me children.

Personally, I would not be able to handel such a marriage. Perhaps that is why so many "arranged" marriages are not very happy marriages. However, I also don't agree with the - its my life and I'll do as I please - attitude of the west either.

In choozing a "life" mate one must use his/her brain and heart together - using one without the other will make a person miserable for the rest of his/her life.

You are misconstruing my position. I never denied the feeling aspect. It is only a given that there is a melange of heart and mind that goes into our decision making. The key is, there is still decision making before any thing can unfurl. I have stated that before any of that, we make choices. You can deny that, but doing so would mean that you believe man to be an automaton, totally helpless to the impulses and forces beyond his control and every wind that blows from hither and thither. Don't get me wrong, I like to believe I am the biggest romantic and I will do anything for the girl I love, but that is different, for it is a state of being and feeling, not an action. It is praxis, i.e. action, which results from choice, that results in our propulsion to that state of feeling.

[Armenian]

Re: Dating non-armenians

You are misconstruing my position. I never denied the feeling aspect. It is only a given that there is a melange of heart and mind that goes into our decision making. The key is, there is still decision making before any thing can unfurl. I have stated that before any of that, we make choices. You can deny that, but doing so would mean that you believe man to be an automaton, totally helpless to the impulses and forces beyond his control and every wind that blows from hither and thither. Don't get me wrong, I like to believe I am the biggest romantic and I will do anything for the girl I love, but that is different, for it is a state of being and feeling, not an action. It is praxis, i.e. action, which results from choice, that results in our propulsion to that state of feeling.

I'm in full agreement here - Romeo

[Anonymouse]

Re: Dating non-armenians

I see mixing as an enrichment to our blood (you gotta admit that we have some m... ugly inbred-like members.)

Mixing is a detriment to the blood. And who is to say that it isn't mixing that contributes to such ugliness? People like to tout mixtures as somehow evidence that 'what comes out is beautiful', but casually forget to include all the ugly mixes that far outnumber the good ones. And there is a big difference with mixing someone of a similar racial stock, i.e. Caucasian, than with someone who is an Asian or black.

[Armenian]

Re: Dating non-armenians

Mixing is a detriment to the blood. And who is to say that it isn't mixing that contributes to such ugliness?

The self-hater was trying to take a shot at me.

People like to tout mixtures as somehow evidence that 'what comes out is beautiful', but casually forget to include all the ugly mixes that far outnumber the good ones.

Only self-haters tout mixing as a way to achieve beauty.

And there is a big difference with mixing someone of a similar racial stock, i.e. Caucasian, than with someone who is an Asian or black.

That is what I meant when I said inter-ethnic unions with "compatible" peoples.

[Quarteria]

Those who want to marry outside the Armenian race...

Have you ever thought about the children? Not to get all Hellen Lovejoy on you, but, seriously, why are you doing this to them? UGH! I have so many things running around in my head about this issue, none of them coherent, so, please, bear with me.

Okay, first of all, there aren't that many Armenians around, not as many as there should be. 8 million...those are the thoroughbreds, right? That's it. Because of people who want to marry out side of this race, that number will not increase as it should...

AND, what about those half breeds? What will become of them? Will they be taught Armenian & brought up Armenian? Will they even CARE?!! Will it be something of which they are proud or will it just be something of which they are?

I can tell you that everybody on all sides of my family knows I'm partially Armenian because I'm sure my Dad had to explain it to everybody on my Mom's side and at the wedding, of course my Great Grandparents (and some of their friends) were there, so, everybody knows, AND, as such, most all know the history and are suprised that my Great Grandma is still alive and is doing as well as she is.

I also mention the other side of my family because as somebody here once said in reply to Ms. Canada being 1/4 Armenian, "If you're 1/4 Armenian, that means you're 3/4 something else". And that is true. I used to be proud that I was so diverse in ethnicity, I had relatives on the Mayflower as well as my Great Grandparent's who came over here in the 1900s, but, the more I thought about it, that 8 million is a low number... AND, I am mostly other ethnicities, and, those have also made me who I am and, as much as I would like to just ignore that side of the family, they are not bad people, they are fun, and I don't want to miss out on THOSE good times.

AND, I would LOVE to marry an Armenian man, but, guess what? Those who feel like I do about preservation DON'T WANT A MIXED BREED!!! Please remember this before you commit to marrying out of your race. This MAY be an issue for the half-breeds you create. One of three things may happen, 1. They wont care about the Armenianness and further dilute the blood that will produce a quarter-breed, 2. They MAY get lucky and marry somebody one half or better, 3. They may not be so lucky and wont get a good Armenian because they aren't as Armenian.

My three cousins (there are 8 of us great grandchildren altogether, all one-quarter, but, my three older cousins grew up more with our great grandparents, my two younger cousins via my grandma don't know so much about it (and, though their father knows PLENTY, I don't think they much care), and I don't know what my two cousins on my Great uncle's side know) and I, I think, have always had pride in being Armenian, it IS something that we are and something about which we have always been taught. Two out of those three cousins have married non-Armenians, and the other is living with his girlfriend, non-Armenian. I'm not sure if any of them plan to have children of their own...1/8s... NOR, to the best of my knowledge do any of them really WANT to preserve the culture. My one cousin, I know, wants this pencil drawing picture that was above our bed at our great grandmother's house, but, I don't think she's going to get it...and, if she does, God only knows what will happen to it. Nobody, I don't think, besides me is trying to learn the language, I'm not even sure if they know what April 24th is, and, let's face it, NONE of us know the history besides St. Gregory (and I'm not even sure if they know that).

Also, we (the 6 of us) all grew up Protestant...not Armenian Protestant, either. We had none of the Sacraments growing up. The other five still don't. IF one believes that this is detrimental to getting into Heaven, PLEASE consider that before marrying outside of your race.

I think that's all. Just, remember your race, remember your family, and remember your children's future, don't take any of that away from them.