The Ottomans

[lampron]

Re: The Ottomans

Armenians won the war against all odds, that is what matters.....another thing that matters is that Armenians have always won against Turks in fair battle.

you are mistaken! Armenians lost battles against Seljuks, Turkmens, Ottomans 900, 800, 700, 600 years ago, or they just didn't fight any more. Many joined the ottomans. Human beings are attracted to successful empires! Why did Armenians lose? No Armenian has written a book about this subject!

Armenians won because of men like Monte....Azerbaijan had all the external supports.

Monte was highly exceptional. How many diaspora Armenians went to battle? Maybe 20. Out of 2 million!

Armenians were slautered in large numbers in Ottoman Empire....Christianity and their strong culture maintained their identity.

In the early periods, yes. Mehmed the conqueror invited Armenians to Constantinople after he captured the city. Many Armenians became Muslims, not all by force. Armenians do not trust each other and do not respect one another. The ottomans (and Muslims in general) are very welcoming to people from other religions who convert into Islam. Human beings like to be treated with respect! This is normal

Yes, Turks are more cunning than any other race.....after all, they beat us with stolen Christian babies raised as Muslim warriors. Even though outnumbered and facing hoards of Borgs, they manage to maintain a Kingdom up to 14th century in a sea of evil.

Empire builders are cunning. Aggression has been around since the beginning of time. If you are united, you can fight back.The ottomans had a big dream - to take Europe. What was the Armenian dream? Does anyone know?

[Eddo211]

Re: The Ottomans

you are mistaken! Armenians lost battles against Seljuks, Turkmens, Ottomans 900, 800, 700, 600 years ago, or they just didn't fight any more. Many joined the ottomans. Human beings are attracted to successful empires! Why did Armenians lose? No Armenian has written a book about this subject!

Like I said, in an equal battle (1 Armenian vs 3 Turks)....I didn't mean when Armenians were overwhelmed.....also as hard as it for them you must remember Armenians had already fought many ancient battles of survival, conquered, slaved, fought for freedom, lost many warrior blood lines before Turks ever showed up at our doorsteps.

Monte was highly exceptional. How many diaspora Armenians went to battle? Maybe 20. Out of 2 million!

Monte was an Armenian....diaspora has nothing to do with it.

In the early periods, yes. Mehmed the conqueror invited Armenians to Constantinople after he captured the city. Many Armenians became Muslims, not all by force. Armenians do not trust each other and do not respect one another. The ottomans (and Muslims in general) are very welcoming to people from other religions who convert into Islam. Human beings like to be treated with respect! This is normal

Empire builders are cunning. Aggression has been around since the beginning of time. If you are united, you can fight back.The ottomans had a big dream - to take Europe. What was the Armenian dream? Does anyone know?

Ottoman dreams have been crushed and will never return, other Turkic countries do not support it....and little Armenia as always stands in the way.
What were Armenians dreams?....live and respect for other nations however location made that into a battle of survival, long before Turks were hatched from the belly of Shewolf Adena.

[lampron]

Re: The Ottomans

Like I said, in an equal battle (1 Armenian vs 3 Turks)....I didn't mean when Armenians were overwhelmed.....also as hard as it for them you must remember Armenians had already fought many ancient battles of survival, conquered, slaved, fought for freedom, lost many warrior blood lines before Turks ever showed up at our doorsteps.

for 300 or 400 years after the Seljuk Turks showed up, Armenians were a majority in the traditional areas. If they fought hard (as you believe) then the Seljuks, then the ottomans should have lost

Ottoman dreams have been crushed and will never return, other Turkic countries do not support it....and little Armenia as always stands in the way.
.

Armenia was not little. the ottomans invested vast amount of organization, energy, money, human effort in administration, military campaigns, trade, diplomacy over many centuries!

what did Armenians do during this time?

The result? Turkey is sitting on one of the best real estates in the world!

[Haykakan]

Re: The Ottomans

Armenians (generally speaking)are not good at working together. I have plenty of personal experience with this aspect of my people. Petty jealousies etc.. stand in the way of well organized anything and this is perhaps our biggest downfall as a nation. Armenians are more of a 1v1 type of people vs the Turck who are more of a pack mentality. To succeed as a nation you must have strong organizational structures and the people have to have faith in these structures..such a scenario has never existed for us Armenians.

[Eddo211]

Re: The Ottomans

for 300 or 400 years after the Seljuk Turks showed up, Armenians were a majority in the traditional areas. If they fought hard (as you believe) then the Seljuks, then the ottomans should have lost

Are you talking about the general population of Armenians in the Ottoman Empire? Armenians had no surviving strong leadership anymore at that time and the pockets of resistance could only do so much. Armenian men of fighting age were not free to organize.
There is a reason why Armenian military unites were never dismantled after Armenia was conquered by Empires, because they were good at it....in Ottoman they served the Ottoman military.

Armenia was not little. the ottomans invested vast amount of organization, energy, money, human effort in administration, military campaigns, trade, diplomacy over many centuries!

what did Armenians do during this time?

What did they do? they built the Ottoman empire for them.

Also Armenia was not that big.....Turks had bigger problems to the West.

The result? Turkey is sitting on one of the best real estates in the world!

Turkey is sitting on lands taken from others......little do they know these strategic lands are cursed and soaked with the blood of peasants and innocent.

[lampron]

Re: The Ottomans

Armenians (generally speaking)are not good at working together. I have plenty of personal experience with this aspect of my people. Petty jealousies etc.. stand in the way of well organized anything and this is perhaps our biggest downfall as a nation. Armenians are more of a 1v1 type of people vs the Turck who are more of a pack mentality. To succeed as a nation you must have strong organizational structures and the people have to have faith in these structures..such a scenario has never existed for us Armenians.

In the Ottoman empire and Russian empire the Turks and Tatars were usually suspicious of foreigners but they trusted each other. The Armenians were the opposite

[TomServo]

Re: The Ottomans

In the Ottoman empire and Russian empire the Turks and Tatars were usually suspicious of foreigners but they trusted each other. The Armenians were the opposite

Didn't trust each other enough to oversee the empire. That's what minorities and the Janissaries were for.

[Eddo211]

Re: The Ottomans

Back from the dead the Ottoman thread.....yawn.

[TomServo]

Re: The Ottomans

Back from the dead the Ottoman thread.....yawn.

Nobody is forcing you to post and yet prior to its revival you were the most recent contributor.

[Eddo211]

Re: The Ottomans

I was not contributing......I was calling bullsh1t out.


you seem to like to beat a dead horse....don't like what I say? too bad.