Vote now: Armenia-diaspora-turkey relations

[Palavra]

Re: Vote now: Armenia-diaspora-turkey relations

You think that physically or monetarily Diaspora Armenians will not lose from Armenia's bargains; but our minds and souls are always with Armenia. Should I remind you that although we're here outside of the state yet we think and support Armenia as our own lovely child.

I am not saying diaspora is not loving ROA but as you said, Diaspora wont be harmed from physically or monetarily. So They can easily ignore trade agreement or even threat of war.

I should also add that I am talking as a turk.

ROA need to give something back to diaspora for their loyalty and support. Only thing ROA can offer is cooperation with diaspora about AG issue and governing of ROA. ROA cannot easly ignore diaspora.

I hope ROA can limit effect of diaspora.(for Turkey.)

Iranians though have no hidden agendas, I pray and hope that turkey will start being as good a neighbour as Iran.

Turkish people have no hidden agendas.(Cash is cash.) Turkey may have agendas but both russia and iran have that agendas too..

Anyway, 50% of ROA is already sold to russia. You dont need to afraid from Turkey about this issue.

[Anoush]

Re: Vote now: Armenia-diaspora-turkey relations

I am not saying diaspora is not loving ROA but as you said, Diaspora wont be harmed from physically or monetarily. So They can easily ignore trade agreement or even threat of war.

I should also add that I am talking as a turk.

ROA need to give something back to diaspora for their loyalty and support. Only thing ROA can offer is cooperation with diaspora about AG issue and governing of ROA. ROA cannot easly ignore diaspora.

I hope ROA can limit effect of diaspora.(for Turkey.)



Turkish people have no hidden agendas.(Cash is cash.) Turkey may have agendas but both russia and iran have that agendas too..

Anyway, 50% of ROA is already sold to russia. You dont need to afraid from Turkey about this issue.

I appreciate your honesty about talking as a turk; yet may I remind you that on my part I always speak as an Armenian and obviously for ROA's interest until I die.

Yes it's true Diasporan Armenians are not effected economically; however as I said our hearts and souls are always with Armenia, we're always watching and supporting Armenia as much as we can from outside.

We don't want ROA to give anything to us; our republic is new and it is us who want to give to our beloved republic; it is called (unconditional love to our Armenia).

Now why would ROA limit our effectiveness towards our republic? We are watching closely, living with the ups and downs of our republic; therefore whatever we offer from our hearts and souls should be welcomed by Armenia as we only mean well. It goes without saying. Plus whatever we do, it isn't done without knowledge and intelligent calculations.

[Palavra]

Re: Vote now: Armenia-diaspora-turkey relations

Yes it's true Diasporan Armenians are not effected economically; however as I said our hearts and souls are always with Armenia, we're always watching and supporting Armenia as much as we can from outside.

Heart and soul is not realist. It generally want more and ready for more conflict. It is a good thing If you have enough power(Like, It helped you at karabag war.) but when It comes to politics, You need realism.

We don't want ROA to give anything to us; our republic is new and it is us who want to give to our beloved republic; it is called (unconditional love to our Armenia).

It is not unconditional. If Supporters dont like politics of ROA, They will decrease their support. So That is why I said, ROA should cooperate diaspora.

Now why would ROA limit our effectiveness towards our republic?

Because It would be better that If a decision maker effected from that decision. Otherwise, decisions cannot be decided by mind but "soul and heart."

By the way, I am talking about diaspora effect over armenian politics.

We are watching closely, living with the ups and downs of our republic; therefore whatever we offer from our hearts and souls should be welcomed by Armenia as we only mean well.

But I think, people who live at ROA will know what is best for them. They should take their decision without the large effect of diaspora. They are not children. They can rule their own country.

[Anoush]

Re: Vote now: Armenia-diaspora-turkey relations

Yes they are not children; but since we're here thanks to the jeudeo-turkish Genocide, we will give support and any guidance that they need. That's our patriotically derived business.

Very true

Virgil, the above paragraph that you said "Very true" to; it was I who wrote it NOT Palavra. You put his name as a quote and it was not his words, but mine.

[Palavra]

Re: Vote now: Armenia-diaspora-turkey relations

If I am a diaspora armenian, I would only give my support to ROA, not guidance.

[Anoush]

Re: Vote now: Armenia-diaspora-turkey relations

If I am a diaspora armenian, I would only give my support to ROA, not guidance.

However as Armenians and Armenia's supporters we deem to stand and think for ourselves. Whatever we can do and for the good of our Republic; that's our prerogative.

[Virgil]

Re: Vote now: Armenia-diaspora-turkey relations

Let Armenia the official country of Armenians make the decisions about Armenia.

I don't like to get involved, but Mos jan, you are a very wise man. I can not begin to tell how proud I am that there truly exists Armenians like you that understand. A government that is a slave to slaves is not independent nor does it have a future as a state. This is exactly what the Diaspora wants; they are a cancer for the Armenian people.

[Virgil]

Re: Vote now: Armenia-diaspora-turkey relations

If I am a diaspora armenian, I would only give my support to ROA, not guidance.

Exactly, the only true Armenian is the one residing in Armenia, anyone else that has "Armenia's interests in mind" should exercise her or his opinions in the Republic of Armenia. Essentially, when you physically leave a country, you forfeit your rights and move on.

Yes they are not children; but since we're here thanks to the jeudeo-turkish Genocide, we will give support and any guidance that they need. That's our patriotically derived business.

Very true!

[VartanK]

Re: Vote now: Armenia-diaspora-turkey relations

ANCA stop interfering with the agenda of the Armenian Government!! ANCA you are not armenia and are not associated with Armenian government! Just bunch of axpars trying to do something armenian in cozy America, with most of them not even going to Armenia. Let Armenia the official country of Armenians make the decisions about Armenia.

Mos, I agree with you but I don't like the word "axpars".
I think that the Armenian government should invite the diaspora to be part of it, but the diaspora shoud support and respect the choice of those who live in Armenia. So unless the diaspora is invited by the Armenian government it should step aside and do its best to help Armenia negotiate the est deal
By the way, we don't know if it does not do it secretly or indirectly.

I have voted PROBABLY NOT but I think that the poll is missing: Should Armenian invite the diaspora to be part of the negotatiations?

[Sako]

Re: Vote now: Armenia-diaspora-turkey relations

I have some sad news, guys . I don't know if you've heard about this yet but Serj apparently met with Turkish officials SECRETLY and decided to open the borders without us knowing. The radio's have been talking about all this very seriously. On TV, the prime minister continues to reassure us that nothing secret is going on but here's the catch. Newspapers in Turkey, including Hurriet if I'm not mistaken, were the first ones to mention that Turkish officials met with Armenian officials privately so it's not like the Armenians here just made up this story.

On TV, the prime minister frankly speaking seemed very nervous and had no freakin idea what he was talking about today. Last time he acted like this was when he was "reassuring" us all that the price of the US dollar wouldn't be going down. Guess what? .... IT DID, and this isn't the only time they've lied to us. I'm very serious. I think something fisheye's going on and I'm completely against these borders opening. 100%. One simple reason why is because our "officials" haven't been telling us anything about their plans ... just that everything will be ok. A new map has been drawn, I'm sure you've all heard. Ironic, isn’t it, that NO ONE has seen it yet? Hell, most don't even understand what it is completely or what it represents. It’s been awhile and many people have requested to see it and the gov. hasn’t shown anything yet. Our gov. is screwing with us like they've been doing for the last 18 years. I don't trust them and I don't think everything's going to be fine and dandy. I hope and pray that I'm wrong...

Without foresight and measures by the Armenian Government…………….10 years is just about right hrai, Armenia will be bought and sold for.

I bet it'll be sold sooner then that . . . the big faces in Armenia have sold everything else practically speaking, so why not sell this little piece of land? We have bigger enemies RIGHT HERE IN YEREVAN ... then in Turkey. Let's talk about them, shall we? It's about time. They are the real wolves …………

Armenia has many economic levers it can use; turkey needs this much more than Armenia. Land purchase should be another obvious thing on that big DO NOT list. Immigration and Visa restrictions, ect.

I completely agree. The thing I would like all of us to remember is that Armenia doesn't need this. I may be wrong but at the moment Turkey is the winner if the borders open. They are the ones that will get the most profits. THEY need the borders to be open ... WE DON'T. At least not right now. We're barely starting to get on our feet. Let's be serious about this. Our nation and our people are going through a VERY CRITICAL identity crisis and suddenly, Turkey wants to open our borders? Open your eyes, people. The end of our nation is much closer then we think or want to believe. Many people here are already talking about what a big liar Serj is. He isn't telling us everything about his plans and I don't know what to expect except the following:

WHEN (Not IF … anymore) the borders open, the Turkish gov. will PAY Turkish families to enter Armenia and settle down. What happens then, boys and girls, is that they start producing children EVERY YEAR and not just one or two. Remember, many Muslims, if not most, have more then one wife. So very soon, the Turkish population will grow year by year and that's where our problems will begin. Armenian families have a maximum of 4 children and small majorities have 5. Muslims have 12-15 children (If not more) so what happens then? Let me put it this way. Do you all know what happened to one of the Armenian towns near Meghri? Years back, it was an Armenian town but soon, almost no Armenians lived there. It completely became a Turkish town and eventually AUTOMATICALLY became a part of Turkey. If you wanted to go to Meghri BEFORE, you went through this town and it took you about 3-4 hours MAX to get there. Now, it takes you approx. 8-9 hours because you have to go via Kapan, not that other town (I forgot its name, I apologize).

There's a great chance that all this will take place again and I'm afraid that this time, not only will we lose one of our little towns ... but our COUNTRY itself! This is not far from reality. And even IF (and that's a big if) emigration becomes very difficult for the Turks thanks to a bunch of laws, it won't change much. The Turks will enter our country gradually and in a matter of years, everything will begin to change. The Armenians right now are having a rough time with their own people so I can expect what will happen when the Turks come in. They will use us to their advantage like they have for years.

We have a very serious identity crisis, people. Our culture, our music, our art, EVERYTHING is threatened because they aren't receiving the attention they deserve financially, morally, or from the Armenian people :angry: . So when the Turks come, mark my words, our entire culture will be threatened more then ever before. We are not ready for such a big step. Most Turks still hate us and most Armenians hate them as well. Right now, we need to talk more and try to inspire friendship and more conversations. Instead, some retards decide to open our borders and this basically FORCES us to artificially work things out and I don't expect anything pretty to come out of it.

Obama visited Turkey as we all know and you know what he said? He said that if Turkey doesn't agree to open its borders without preconditions, he will use the word Genocide in his speech. So what does this mean, my friends? It means that America and not particularly Turkey or Armenia wants these borders to open up and not simply to help us out. I mean, come on, Armenia doesn't really gain much if these borders open up. Let's be clear about this. So the question is, why does Obama want these borders open??? Or better yet ... who else wants these borders opened?

I have a very bad feeling about this and I fear we have a lot of problems waiting for us. Let's stay strong my brothers and sisters . . . . . . . What else can we do? If we were strong before, we wouldn't be in this current state. I blame no one but the Armenian populace. Most Armenians here think only about themselves, never standing together with the other Armenians. Everyone thinks only about his/her skin. That's why we have always BEEN .... and will always BE broken down and abused by the bullies. We need to stand together ... ALWAYS, not only on April 24th . We have to ALWAYS BE TOGETHER. Our nation is talented. Our people have the ability to be strong. We are smart ... just not smart enough to stick together.

I'm sorry guys but I have to say this ... perhaps it will help us learn ...

.::Shame on us::.