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Discussion on Armenia's nation/culture/civilization/race

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  • #31
    Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

    Originally posted by Palavra View Post
    Haha so our noble(Turkish) blood comes from there..I do not think, we can find noble blood at central asia. Anyway, which blood is more noble? Greek blood or armenian blood?




    Tell me, who is murderer. I will inform Turkish police about him. It would be better to say who is murdered too..
    Not Turkish blood thats for sure.

    Comment


    • #32
      Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

      Unlike greek or armenian identity, "Turkish" identity is not about blood.

      Comment


      • #33
        Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

        Originally posted by Palavra View Post
        Unlike greek or armenian identity, "Turkish" identity is not about blood.
        Remember, there are culture creators and then there are culture bearers. Turks, for the most part are more on the spectrum of culture bearing, not culture creating. Thus, beyond their language, they've absorbed the people they have conquered and occupied. Hence, why you look more like a Middle Eastern than a Central Asian Mongol today and your food and music is a reflection of that more so than Mongol.
        Achkerov kute.

        Comment


        • #34
          Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

          Remember, there are culture creators and then there are culture bearers. Turks, for the most part are more on the spectrum of culture bearing, not culture creating.
          My friend, If there are people, So there is cultures. Culture is not a car which should be produced by intelligent nations like armenians.

          I hope you wont waste my time to show your culture is superior or Turks have no cultures.Do you realy think, before We see armenians, we are liking as dogs?

          Thus, beyond their language, they've absorbed the people they have conquered and occupied.
          Absorbed? If there is dolma or baklava at all older ottomans land, It looks like It is not only Turks who absorbed other cultures.. Oh, We absorbed more than other nations thanks to our empire. It happened to all empires.

          who took from whom is a little unknown. Ofcourse, for an armenian, It should be Turks who took from other nations.. May dolma comes from balkain, arabic lands or armenia. It is unknown..

          Also, It is absurd to claim, Turks did not produce any culture at last 2000 year. So what are the turks? Animals?

          Hence, why you look more like a Middle Eastern than a Central Asian Mongol today and your food and music is a reflection of that more so than Mongol.
          First of all, we were never mongols. You are talking about Turkish culture but You dont even know who are Turks. Funny..

          Secondly, Central asians are not mongols too..

          Thirdly, half of your people have turkish surnames and you are talking about absorb?

          Lastly, I said becoming Turkish has no relation with blood. So You dont need to show me a lot pictures.

          If you have encountered Armenians that have spoken about Armenian superiority and/or Turkish inferiority, I apologize on all of our behalf. That is certainly not the image nor vibe those of my stripe would like to exude.
          You think that Turks did not create a culture and You apologize? Apologize to my ass.

          Comment


          • #35
            Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

            Originally posted by Palavra View Post
            My friend, If there are people, So there is cultures. Culture is not a car which should be produced by intelligent nations like armenians.
            In order for there to be culture, there must be people. How can culture exist if there are no people to create it? Culture reflects people, not the other way around. There are high cultures and low cultures just like there are creators and bearers. On the whole, Turks fall more on the spectrum of bearers.

            Originally posted by Palavra View Post
            I hope you wont waste my time to show your culture is superior or Turks have no cultures.Do you realy think, before We see armenians, we are liking as dogs?
            No one talked about Armenian culture being superior or inferior or Turkish culture being superior or inferior. Often times, I think you Turks come in here with a chip on your shoulders and start to have these fantastic imaginations.

            Originally posted by Palavra View Post
            Absorbed? If there is dolma or baklava at all older ottomans land, It looks like It is not only Turks who absorbed other cultures.. Oh, We absorbed more than other nations thanks to our empire. It happened to all empires.
            You say "Absorbed?" as if doubting my assertion that you have absorbed other peoples and cultures and then in the end of this paragraph you admit that you have. Thank you for validating my point in the most roundabout of ways.

            Originally posted by Palavra View Post
            who took from whom is a little unknown. Ofcourse, for an armenian, It should be Turks who took from other nations.. May dolma comes from balkain, arabic lands or armenia. It is unknown..
            This is irrelevant since your forefathers were not native to the lands, they could only absorb what was there. Thus, Assyrians, Greeks, Armenians, Arabs, Slavs, etc., were all absorbed into your empire and along with those peoples foods and customs, regardless of where those peoples foods and customs originated. Remember, this isn't about dolma, but about your people as culture bearers.


            Originally posted by Palavra View Post
            Also, It is absurd to claim, Turks did not produce any culture at last 2000 year. So what are the turks? Animals?
            No one claims Turks did not produce culture. They were mostly relying on the customs, cultures and ideas of the conquered peoples than anything of their own ingenuity beyond their language. The Mongolian tribes were excellent military minded peoples and Turks being no exception were formidable militarily. But culturally, they absorbed and took on their conquered peoples cultures. And out of that melange emerged what is now modernly called Turkey. Everything from your architecture, to your script, to your religion belonged to the conquered peoples.



            Originally posted by Palavra View Post
            First of all, we were never mongols. You are talking about Turkish culture but You dont even know who are Turks. Funny..

            Secondly, Central asians are not mongols too..

            Thirdly, half of your people have turkish surnames and you are talking about absorb?
            I never claimed you are Mongols. Your ancestors were of Mongoloid origin. People in Central Asia for the most part are of Mongolian stock. When we claim Chinese, Korean and Japanese are morphologically 'Mongoloid' we do not mean they are Mongols as in the people, but with regard to classification of phenotype.






            Originally posted by Palavra View Post
            You think that Turks did not create a culture and You apologize? Apologize to my ass.
            If I were you I wouldn't open my mouth unless it made sense. I was apologizing to the claims many Armenians throw at Turks about superiority or inferiority. This isn't about that. What I was claiming is that historically, Turks are a reflection more so of the peoples they conquered than their actual Mongoloid origins. All peoples have culture creating and culture bearing tendencies and in any given people one weighs more than the other.

            This is reflected in your dress, your language script which is of Latin origin and previously relied heavily on Arabic and Persian loanwords, and even your religion. I am not claiming you are inferior. I am claiming that Turkish identity is not about blood because it cannot be for it is too diluted and a result of an amalgamation of many absorbed cultures and peoples. And on a grand scale, Turkish culture has relied more heavily on bearing culture of its conquered peoples than producing its own. You don't have to like it, but that is the way it is.
            Achkerov kute.

            Comment


            • #36
              Re: Discussion on Armenia's nation/culture/civilization/race

              In order for there to be culture, there must be people. How can culture exist if there are no people to create it? Culture reflects people, not the other way around. There are high cultures and low cultures just like there are creators and bearers. On the whole, Turks fall more on the spectrum of bearers.
              Peh peh, repeating youself do not prove anything. No matter how many time you do..

              No one talked about Armenian culture being superior or inferior or Turkish culture being superior or inferior. Often times, I think you Turks come in here with a chip on your shoulders and start to have these fantastic imaginations.
              Noone? where am I?

              You say "Absorbed?" as if doubting my assertion that you have absorbed other peoples and cultures and then in the end of this paragraph you admit that you have. Thank you for validating my point in the most roundabout of ways.
              You did not absorbed your surnames? So what was your point?

              No one claims Turks did not produce culture. They were mostly relying on the customs, cultures and ideas of the conquered peoples than anything of their own ingenuity beyond their language
              are you sure what are you talking? mostly relying others? how do you know it? Infact, none of us know who take from whom.

              The Mongolian tribes were excellent military minded peoples and Turks being no exception were formidable militarily.
              so what? germans were also military minded. romans are too. Infact, every nation who built an empire is military minded. This is totally unrelated with topic.

              But culturally, they absorbed and took on their conquered peoples cultures.
              So all people did. Still these does not show, They had no cultures or they did not built anything after their conquests..

              And out of that melange emerged what is now modernly called Turkey. Everything from your architecture, to your script, to your religion belonged to the conquered peoples.
              Blah blah. So you think, Ottomans only know to take from others but not built any thing at last 600 year. My friend, because you give us lahmacun(If It was armenian food.), That does not mean We stop to produce anything and only eat lahmacun.

              never claimed you are Mongols. Your ancestors were of Mongoloid origin. People in Central Asia for the most part are of Mongolian stock.
              are you talking about face and body or cultures? In Both way, Turks are not mongoloid now. We have no common thing with them except a past.

              If I were you I wouldn't open my mouth unless it made sense.
              If I were you, I would to same too.

              What I was claiming is that historically, Turks are a reflection more so of the peoples they conquered than their actual Mongoloid origins.
              our origins are as mongoloid as your origin is persian.. We are neighbor with mongols 1500 year before. I am sure, 1500 years reason some changes too. It is funny to hope, mongols and Turks would have still cultural similary after 1500 years.

              All peoples have culture creating and culture bearing tendencies and in any given people one weighs more than the other.
              So empires take more from other nations because They have more connections with others but that does not mean, They produce less than other people.

              For exp, at last 1000 year, Turks produced much more than armenians..

              This is reflected in your dress, your language script which is of Latin origin and previously relied heavily on Arabic and Persian loanwords, and even your religion.
              do you think, we should stay like 1500 year before? English had more loan word than us. Wanna call them as german-latin bla bla bla.


              I am claiming that Turkish identity is not about blood because it cannot be for it is too diluted and a result of an amalgamation of many absorbed cultures and peoples
              Not only Amalgamation. USA is an amalgamation too but she produce cultures too..

              And on a grand scale, Turkish culture has relied more heavily on bearing culture of its conquered peoples than producing its own. You don't have to like it, but that is the way it is.
              Blah blah. Having a lot contact with other cultures does not mean, we did not produce our cultures.

              We were bridge to a lot culture. We carried a lot thing from one part of empire to another part(So ofcourse we are effected more and this is a good thing.) but we produce our things too.

              Blue mosque is not greek because Greeks partly effected our architect.

              Comment


              • #37
                Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

                Originally posted by Sero View Post
                Not Turkish blood thats for sure.
                There is no race. They did studies. The difference between races is less than 1% which is almost negligible. There are just different cultures. That's what an anthropologist told me.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Re: Discussion on Armenia's nation/culture/civilization/race

                  A dandy answer, well I'm satisfied... there is no race. Lets all go home boys.

                  p.s. that 1% difference in DNA could mean the difference between looking like a chimpanzee or not, but alas, there is no race

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: Discussion on Armenia's nation/culture/civilization/race

                    Originally posted by jgk3 View Post
                    ... p.s. that 1% difference in DNA could mean the difference between looking like a chimpanzee or not, but alas, there is no race
                    Excellent reply, young comrade. Due to forum mismanagement there has been an influx of idiots in this place lately. Since the defeat of nationalism on the battlefields of Europe and Asia during the Second World War, the globalist elite in the West has been working diligently to destroy religion (particularly Christianity), nationalism, the family and the very notion of race. The reason this is being done is obvious - control. With a weak family structure, no spirituality and no racialism/nationalism, the masses can be directly and efficiently exploited and manipulated with the minimum of effort, without the threat of revolutions and/or organized uprisings. There definitely is such a thing as race. Idiots who discount racial differences are the same ones that would talk about the vast differences between different breeds of dogs. Like human beings are genetically related to each other, likewise all dogs are related to each other. Like there are vast differences between the main human races, there are vast differences between dog breeds. Needless to say, even with less than 1% genetic differences between human races there is a great amount of difference between a Scandinavian and an Aboriginal Australian, between an African and an Asian. Likewise, there are great differences between a German Sheppard and a Chiwawa, although genetically speaking there are virtually no differences between the two breeds of dogs.

                    Regarding why they want you to forget racialism/nationalism/religion:

                    Bolshevism (its early stages) proved to be the greatest evil of the 20th century. Artificially placed in Russia by western interests with the sole purpose of destroying the much coveted Russian Empire, Bolshevism is responsible for the murder of over ten million Christian Slavs, as well as tens of thousands of Armenians. Bolshevism is a dark page in human history. Bolshevism was actually one of the major geopolitical/socioeconomic factors that gave rise to Nazi Germany and made the deaths of tens of millions during the Second World War inevitable. Having said that, I ask you to look at the list below. One can write volumes upon volumes of political discourse and analysis based on the following list of Bolshevik operatives soon after the fall of the Russian Czar. Actually, one can rewrite history merely based upon this list. However, without religious and/or nationalistic fervor, reading the following list would 'not' have any impact upon the reader. Thus, the agenda to eliminate nationalistic and religious sentiments in people is an agenda to cover up certain crimes of the past and prepare the field for further crimes in the future...

                    Do a simple test with yourself. Train yourself to look at the following list as a liberal, Godless globalist within no political, religious or racial/nationalist views - in other words, your typical westerner today.

                    And then switch on your Armenian (or Russian) nationalist/Orthodox Christian mode and reread the list...

                    How do you feel with each approach? Do you see why they would like you to forget race, nationalism and religion?


                    Jews and Bolshevism

                    The most detailed description of xxxish influence in the Bolshevik 'revolution comes from Robert Wilton, the Russian correspondent of The Times. In 1920 he published a book in French, Les Derniers Jours des Romanofs, which gave the racial background of all the members of the Soviet government. (This does not appear in the later English translation, for some odd reason.) After the publication of this monumental work, Wilton was ostracised by the press, and he died in poverty in 1925. He reported that the Central Committee of the Bolshevik Party was made up as follows:

                    NAME NATIONALITY
                    Bronstein (Trotsky) xxx
                    Apfelbaum (Zinovief) xxx
                    Lourie (Larine) xxx
                    Ouritski xxx
                    Volodarski xxx
                    Rosenfeldt (Kamanef) xxx
                    Smidovitch xxx
                    Sverdlof (Yankel) xxx
                    Nakhamkes (Steklof) xxx
                    Ulyanov (Lenin) Russian
                    Krylenko Russian
                    Lounatcharski Russian

                    "The Council of the People's Commissars comprises the following:

                    MINISTRY NAME NATIONALITY
                    President Ulyanov (Lenin) Russian
                    Foreign Affairs Tchitcherine Russian
                    Nationalities Djugashvili (Stalin) Georgian
                    Agriculture Protian Armenian
                    Economic Council Lourie (Larine) xxx
                    Food Schlichter xxx
                    Army & Navy Bronstein (Trotsky) xxx
                    State Control Lander xxx
                    State Lands Kauffman xxx
                    Works V. Schmidt xxx
                    Social Relief E. Lelina (Knigissen) xxxess
                    Public Instruction Lounatcharsky Russian
                    Religions Spitzberg xxx
                    Interior Apfelbaum (Zinovief) xxx
                    Hygiene Anvelt xxx
                    Finance Isidore Goukovski xxx
                    Press Volodarski xxx
                    Elections Ouritski xxx
                    Justice I. Steinberg xxx
                    Refugees Fenigstein xxx
                    Refugees (assist.) Savitch xxx
                    Refugees (assist.) Zaslovski xxx

                    "The following is the list of members of the Central Executive Committee:

                    NAME NATIONALITY
                    Sverdlov (president) xxx
                    Avanessof (sec.) Armenian
                    Bruno Lett
                    Babtchinski xxx
                    Bukharin Russian
                    Weinberg xxx
                    Gailiss xxx
                    Ganzburg xxx
                    Danichevski xxx
                    Starck German
                    Sachs xxx
                    Scheinmann xxx
                    Erdling xxx
                    Landauer xxx
                    Linder xxx
                    Wolach Czech
                    Dimanstein xxx
                    Encukidze Georgian
                    Ermann xxx
                    Joffe xxx
                    Karkline xxx
                    Knigissen xxx
                    Rosenfeldt (Kamenef) xxx
                    Apfelbaum (Zinovief) xxx
                    Krylenko Russian
                    KrassikofSachs xxx
                    Kaprik xxx
                    Kaoul Lett
                    Ulyanov (lenin) Russian
                    Latsis xxx
                    Lander xxx
                    Lounatcharski Russian
                    Peterson Lett
                    Peters Lett
                    Roudzoutas xxx
                    Rosine xxx
                    Smidovitch xxx
                    Stoutchka Lett
                    Nakhamkes (Steklof) xxx
                    Sosnovski xxx
                    Skrytnik xxx
                    Bronstein (Trotsky) xxx
                    Teodorovitch xxx
                    Terian Armenian
                    Ouritski xxx
                    Telechkine Russian
                    Feldmann xxx
                    Froumkine xxx
                    Souriupa Ukranian
                    Tchavtchevadze Georgian
                    Scheikmann xxx
                    Rosental xxx
                    Achkinazi Imeretian
                    Karakhane Karaim (xxx)
                    Rose xxx
                    Sobelson (Radek) xxx
                    Sclichter xxx
                    Schikolini xxx
                    Chklianski xxx
                    Levine (Pravdine) xxx

                    "The following is the list of members of the Extraordinary Commission of Moscow:

                    NAME NATIONALITY
                    Dzerjinski (president) Pole
                    Peters (vice-president) Lett
                    Chklovski xxx
                    Kheifiss xxx
                    Zeistine xxx
                    Razmirovitch xxx
                    Kronberg xxx
                    Khaikina xxxess
                    Karlson Lett
                    Schaumann xxx
                    Leontovitch xxx
                    Jacob Goldine xxx
                    Glaperstein xxx
                    Kniggisen xxx
                    Latzis Lett
                    Schillenkuss xxx
                    Janson Lett
                    Rivkine xxx
                    Antonof Russian
                    Delafabre xxx
                    Tsitkine xxx
                    Roskirovitch xxx
                    G. Sverdlof xxx
                    Biesenski xxx
                    Blioumkine xxx
                    Alexandrevitch Russian
                    I. Model xxx
                    Routenberg xxx
                    Pines xxx
                    Sachs xxx
                    Daybol Lett
                    Saissoune Armenian
                    Deylkenen Lett
                    Liebert xxx
                    Vogel German
                    Zakiss Lett

                    Source: http://www.heretical.com/miscellx/bolshies.html
                    Մեր ժողովուրդն արանց հայրենասիրութեան այն է, ինչ որ մի մարմին' առանց հոգու:

                    Նժդեհ


                    Please visit me at my Heralding the Rise of Russia blog: http://theriseofrussia.blogspot.com/

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Re: Discussion on Armenia's nation/culture/civilization/race

                      Originally posted by Armenian View Post
                      Bolshevism (its early stages) proved to be the greatest evil of the 20th century. Artificially placed in Russia by western interests with the sole purpose of destroying the much coveted Russian Empire, Bolshevism is responsible for the murder of over ten million Christian Slavs, as well as tens of thousands of Armenians. Bolshevism is a dark page in human history. Bolshevism was actually one of the major geopolitical/socioeconomic factors that gave rise to Nazi Germany and made the deaths of tens of millions during the Second World War inevitable. Having said that, I ask you to look at the list below. One can write volumes upon volumes of political discourse and analysis based on the following list of Bolshevik operatives soon after the fall of the Russian Czar. Actually, one can rewrite history merely based upon this list. However, without religious and/or nationalistic fervor, reading the following list would 'not' have any impact upon the reader. Thus, the agenda to eliminate nationalistic and religious sentiments in people is an agenda to cover up certain crimes of the past and prepare the field for further crimes in the future...

                      Do a simple test with yourself. Train yourself to look at the following list as a liberal, Godless globalist within no political, religious or racial/nationalist views - in other words, your typical westerner today.

                      And then switch on your Armenian (or Russian) nationalist/Orthodox Christian mode and reread the list...

                      How do you feel with each approach? Do you see why they would like you to forget race, nationalism and religion?


                      Jews and Bolshevism

                      The most detailed description of xxxish influence in the Bolshevik 'revolution comes from Robert Wilton, the Russian correspondent of The Times. In 1920 he published a book in French, Les Derniers Jours des Romanofs, which gave the racial background of all the members of the Soviet government. (This does not appear in the later English translation, for some odd reason.) After the publication of this monumental work, Wilton was ostracised by the press, and he died in poverty in 1925. He reported that the Central Committee of the Bolshevik Party was made up as follows:

                      NAME NATIONALITY
                      Bronstein (Trotsky) xxx
                      Apfelbaum (Zinovief) xxx
                      Lourie (Larine) xxx
                      Ouritski xxx
                      Volodarski xxx
                      Rosenfeldt (Kamanef) xxx
                      Smidovitch xxx
                      Sverdlof (Yankel) xxx
                      Nakhamkes (Steklof) xxx
                      Ulyanov (Lenin) Russian
                      Krylenko Russian
                      Lounatcharski Russian

                      "The Council of the People's Commissars comprises the following:

                      MINISTRY NAME NATIONALITY
                      President Ulyanov (Lenin) Russian
                      Foreign Affairs Tchitcherine Russian
                      Nationalities Djugashvili (Stalin) Georgian
                      Agriculture Protian Armenian
                      Economic Council Lourie (Larine) xxx
                      Food Schlichter xxx
                      Army & Navy Bronstein (Trotsky) xxx
                      State Control Lander xxx
                      State Lands Kauffman xxx
                      Works V. Schmidt xxx
                      Social Relief E. Lelina (Knigissen) xxxess
                      Public Instruction Lounatcharsky Russian
                      Religions Spitzberg xxx
                      Interior Apfelbaum (Zinovief) xxx
                      Hygiene Anvelt xxx
                      Finance Isidore Goukovski xxx
                      Press Volodarski xxx
                      Elections Ouritski xxx
                      Justice I. Steinberg xxx
                      Refugees Fenigstein xxx
                      Refugees (assist.) Savitch xxx
                      Refugees (assist.) Zaslovski xxx

                      "The following is the list of members of the Central Executive Committee:

                      NAME NATIONALITY
                      Sverdlov (president) xxx
                      Avanessof (sec.) Armenian
                      Bruno Lett
                      Babtchinski xxx
                      Bukharin Russian
                      Weinberg xxx
                      Gailiss xxx
                      Ganzburg xxx
                      Danichevski xxx
                      Starck German
                      Sachs xxx
                      Scheinmann xxx
                      Erdling xxx
                      Landauer xxx
                      Linder xxx
                      Wolach Czech
                      Dimanstein xxx
                      Encukidze Georgian
                      Ermann xxx
                      Joffe xxx
                      Karkline xxx
                      Knigissen xxx
                      Rosenfeldt (Kamenef) xxx
                      Apfelbaum (Zinovief) xxx
                      Krylenko Russian
                      KrassikofSachs xxx
                      Kaprik xxx
                      Kaoul Lett
                      Ulyanov (lenin) Russian
                      Latsis xxx
                      Lander xxx
                      Lounatcharski Russian
                      Peterson Lett
                      Peters Lett
                      Roudzoutas xxx
                      Rosine xxx
                      Smidovitch xxx
                      Stoutchka Lett
                      Nakhamkes (Steklof) xxx
                      Sosnovski xxx
                      Skrytnik xxx
                      Bronstein (Trotsky) xxx
                      Teodorovitch xxx
                      Terian Armenian
                      Ouritski xxx
                      Telechkine Russian
                      Feldmann xxx
                      Froumkine xxx
                      Souriupa Ukranian
                      Tchavtchevadze Georgian
                      Scheikmann xxx
                      Rosental xxx
                      Achkinazi Imeretian
                      Karakhane Karaim (xxx)
                      Rose xxx
                      Sobelson (Radek) xxx
                      Sclichter xxx
                      Schikolini xxx
                      Chklianski xxx
                      Levine (Pravdine) xxx

                      "The following is the list of members of the Extraordinary Commission of Moscow:

                      NAME NATIONALITY
                      Dzerjinski (president) Pole
                      Peters (vice-president) Lett
                      Chklovski xxx
                      Kheifiss xxx
                      Zeistine xxx
                      Razmirovitch xxx
                      Kronberg xxx
                      Khaikina xxxess
                      Karlson Lett
                      Schaumann xxx
                      Leontovitch xxx
                      Jacob Goldine xxx
                      Glaperstein xxx
                      Kniggisen xxx
                      Latzis Lett
                      Schillenkuss xxx
                      Janson Lett
                      Rivkine xxx
                      Antonof Russian
                      Delafabre xxx
                      Tsitkine xxx
                      Roskirovitch xxx
                      G. Sverdlof xxx
                      Biesenski xxx
                      Blioumkine xxx
                      Alexandrevitch Russian
                      I. Model xxx
                      Routenberg xxx
                      Pines xxx
                      Sachs xxx
                      Daybol Lett
                      Saissoune Armenian
                      Deylkenen Lett
                      Liebert xxx
                      Vogel German
                      Zakiss Lett

                      Source: http://www.heretical.com/miscellx/bolshies.html
                      So do you see similarities between the Jewish infestation in the Bolshevik movement and that of the Young Turks? With that said, can't the Turks shift the blame easily on the Jews for their atrocities??
                      Last edited by Lucin; 01-12-2009, 09:55 AM.

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