Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

Do you guys seriously not get it? Keeping women out of the clubs isn't going to protect them because these situations are wide-spread.
You can see a woman's body in everything but a sack much like a burka. It's societal attitudes and tolerance of this kind of thing that is the problem. Take yourselves as an example.
You have a woman telling you that we get harassed in other settings too and you've both made jokes and/or dismissed it.

You who claim to care, to be one of the good guys, to want protect women... Perhaps your behaviors should reflect the attitudes you express.
Otherwise, I'm more inclined to believe how you act more accurately reflects your true beliefs and so far, you're mocking a pretty serious issue.

This sort of thing (http://unwinona.tumblr.com/post/3086...are-this-story) happens far more than you know...

We make jokes because there are more men who would stand up to another man mistreating a woman in public than there are those that would mistreat a woman. Who do you think creates policies about harassment at the work place? There are so many laws to protect women that the things you insist happen are most likely rare or propaganda by the media. Probably the reason why so many guys in big cities are gay and so many women walk about like they rule the streets.

[Siggie]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

If you are getting groped at work and feel uncomfortable then maybe you shouldn't be an exotic dancer. Public transportation? You know those japanese groping and porn videos aren't real right?

Well more it's because they know their parents wouldn't let them go to such a place, and the punishment for doing it would be pretty severe. I wouldn't my daughter to go to such a club because I know what's going to happen to her there. She might be naive and think that she'll always be in control, but can tragically be wrong. Women need to be examples of modesty and elegance, their purity and values cherished, they respected for who they are, rather than respected for having good legs or being tools that every other guy uses. It's a differing mindset from the mindset of women that freely go to dance clubs, freely get used by other men, and so forth.

Do you guys seriously not get it? Keeping women out of the clubs isn't going to protect them because these situations are wide-spread.
You can see a woman's body in everything but a sack much like a burka. It's societal attitudes and tolerance of this kind of thing that is the problem. Take yourselves as an example.
You have a woman telling you that we get harassed in other settings too and you've both made jokes and/or dismissed it.

You who claim to care, to be one of the good guys, to want protect women... Perhaps your behaviors should reflect the attitudes you express.
Otherwise, I'm more inclined to believe how you act more accurately reflects your true beliefs and so far, you're mocking a pretty serious issue.

This sort of thing (http://unwinona.tumblr.com/post/3086...are-this-story) happens far more than you know...

If I stop reading the book I enjoy to talk to you, random stranger, you hit on me or just stay way too close to me. If I tell you to leave me alone, you get mad at me. Because I somehow, as a woman, owe you conversation.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

I think the above is as clear a confirmation as you can get that Mos is a fundamentalist Muslim. Every word he has posted on this thread, and most of what he has posted over the years on this forum would agree with that conclusion. Of course he will deny it - but we have to remember that Muslims believe that it is permisable to lie and be deceitful if it advances the cause of Islam.

Joey: What are... What are you wearing?
Lacey: Shorts.
Joey: Shorts? That's... That's a Maxi Pad.
Lacey: Dad, they're designer shorts. They're French. Goodbye.

Joey: With what you are wearing, you are attracting guys who wear their pants around their ass.

Joey: Please take the bikini pictures off of your facebook page.

Joey: When you're living in my house, you're a Taliban! Okay? You keep your body a secret. Except you get to, you know, go to school and read books.

[Mos]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

Great example of how living next to islamic countries for so long has rubbed off on armenians. Just mark my words these guys who are against women going to night clubs today will be the same ones to institutionilize hijab for armenian women. It is a slippery slope with these guys if you give them an inch they will take a mile and pretty soon things like education, driving a car, being in public wo husband .. will not be allowed for women. Everything wrong will be blamed on women and more of their rights will be taken away. If you do not stand up for your rights then you will lose them - just look at America and the passing of NDAA. Ironically enough it is a woman judge who is blocking the NDAA from taking effect by declaring it unconstitutional which it is. Most of the problems with women today revolve around the fact that materialism has taken a firm grip over them as well as males not because of anything else. Materialism is the western quality (capitalist actually) that i do dislike but there are good qualities coming from the west to which is why villifying it the way you guys do is wrong. Materialism effects both men and women yet you guys only focus on the problems relating to women. To put it mildly it is naive to blame everything on the west or women and to think that keeping her home will fix any of these problems. If you want to live the way you describe then guys please move to Saudi Arabia and you will be in the land of female repression you have been dreaming about all along.

No one here is talking about institutionalizing hijab. Actually many decent Armenians parents will not let their daughter go to a dance club, because we all know what happens there. I don't understand why looking after your daughter would be considered a bad thing. Make sure she dresses well, she doesn't go to places where she'll be under danger, all are routine things in my view. Materialism is also an issue, I will give you that, though it comes naturally with capitalism, though that being said, communist economic model is quite horrible also. Materialism in the West has gotten to the point of where it can be compared to Paganism. We can never get rid of materialism all together, neither practical or possible, but by emphasizing the values of God, values of family, emphasizing your nation's culture and patriotism, you can balance that materialism. Since I don't want communist economics. Economically I tend to favour a freer approach though that's a whole different discussion.

I think the above is as clear a confirmation as you can get that Mos is a fundamentalist Muslim. Every word he has posted on this thread, and most of what he has posted over the years on this forum would agree with that conclusion. Of course he will deny it - but we have to remember that Muslims believe that it is permisable to lie and be deceitful if it advances the cause of Islam.

So only fundamentalist Muslims don't allow their daughters to go to dance clubs? I guess most decent Armenian families are fundamentalist Muslim according to you? We have a conservative, Christian society, so we are not going to be as liberal and open as Western European, but we're certainly not fundamentalist Muslims, that's a whole different level that I never talked about.

I don't go to clubs so I wouldn't know, but I imagine it's the same reason we don't see convicts there either -- they lack the freedom to choose to go.

Well more it's because they know their parents wouldn't let them go to such a place, and the punishment for doing it would be pretty severe. I wouldn't my daughter to go to such a club because I know what's going to happen to her there. She might be naive and think that she'll always be in control, but can tragically be wrong. Women need to be examples of modesty and elegance, their purity and values cherished, they respected for who they are, rather than respected for having good legs or being tools that every other guy uses. It's a differing mindset from the mindset of women that freely go to dance clubs, freely get used by other men, and so forth.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

Yeah, it's very clear and putting a winkie at the end doesn't make it cute.

You're correcting me? Women get groped at work, school, taking public transportation,etc.; you think it doesn't happen anywhere but the clubs?
No, clearly you know better what it is to be a woman, so by all means educate me as to the dangers of being a woman.

If you are getting groped at work and feel uncomfortable then maybe you shouldn't be an exotic dancer. Public transportation? You know those japanese groping and porn videos aren't real right?

[Siggie]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

So G strings dont cause global warming?
I am rich i am rich i am rich....

I have tried this very strategy with "I will not feed the trolls. I will not feed the trolls. I will not feed the trolls. I will not feed the trolls..."

[Haykakan]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

So G strings dont cause global warming?
I am rich i am rich i am rich....

Amen. Thank you.

I advanced my guess that it's probably more to do with materialism and consumerism, but Mos sidestepped and kept right on laying the blame exclusively at women's feet and attributing it to immodest dress and claiming there is a causal relationship when he hasn't a shred of evidence except his word to back that up. If a scientist tried to propose what he is, he would be laughed out of every professional meeting. You can't just say "X is causing Y" and expect not be asked to provide the evidence to support that. Evidence isn't repeating the conclusion X causes Y or using a synonym to say the same thing "X leads to Y." Repeating something doesn't magically make it fact.

[Siggie]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

Great example of how living next to islamic countries for so long has rubbed off on armenians. Just mark my words these guys who are against women going to night clubs today will be the same ones to institutionilize hijab for armenian women. It is a slippery slope with these guys if you give them an inch they will take a mile and pretty soon things like education, driving a car, being in public wo husband .. will not be allowed for women. Everything wrong will be blamed on women and more of their rights will be taken away. If you do not stand up for your rights then you will lose them - just look at America and the passing of NDAA. Ironically enough it is a woman judge who is blocking the NDAA from taking effect by declaring it unconstitutional which it is. Most of the problems with women today revolve around the fact that materialism has taken a firm grip over them as well as males not because of anything else. Materialism is the western quality (capitalist actually) that i do dislike but there are good qualities coming from the west to which is why villifying it the way you guys do is wrong. Materialism effects both men and women yet you guys only focus on the problems relating to women. To put it mildly it is naive to blame everything on the west or women and to think that keeping her home will fix any of these problems. If you want to live the way you describe then guys please move to Saudi Arabia and you will be in the land of female repression you have been dreaming about all along.

Amen. Thank you.

I advanced my guess that it's probably more to do with materialism and consumerism, but Mos sidestepped and kept right on laying the blame exclusively at women's feet and attributing it to immodest dress and claiming there is a causal relationship when he hasn't a shred of evidence except his word to back that up. If a scientist tried to propose what he is, he would be laughed out of every professional meeting. You can't just say "X is causing Y" and expect not be asked to provide the evidence to support that. Evidence isn't repeating the conclusion X causes Y or using a synonym to say the same thing "X leads to Y." Repeating something doesn't magically make it fact.

[Haykakan]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

Great example of how living next to islamic countries for so long has rubbed off on armenians. Just mark my words these guys who are against women going to night clubs today will be the same ones to institutionilize hijab for armenian women. It is a slippery slope with these guys if you give them an inch they will take a mile and pretty soon things like education, driving a car, being in public wo husband .. will not be allowed for women. Everything wrong will be blamed on women and more of their rights will be taken away. If you do not stand up for your rights then you will lose them - just look at America and the passing of NDAA. Ironically enough it is a woman judge who is blocking the NDAA from taking effect by declaring it unconstitutional which it is. Most of the problems with women today revolve around the fact that materialism has taken a firm grip over them as well as males not because of anything else. Materialism is the western quality (capitalist actually) that i do dislike but there are good qualities coming from the west to which is why villifying it the way you guys do is wrong. Materialism effects both men and women yet you guys only focus on the problems relating to women. To put it mildly it is naive to blame everything on the west or women and to think that keeping her home will fix any of these problems. If you want to live the way you describe then guys please move to Saudi Arabia and you will be in the land of female repression you have been dreaming about all along.

It's caused by a prevalent Western, liberal mindset which leads to immodesty, improper lifestyle, anti-family values etc. People with that mindset will go dance in clubs with guys, drink, and do other regretful things. Tell me why don't any practising Muslim women go to such places? Have you ever seen a woman with hijab in a dance club?

[bell-the-cat]

Re: Who is the Armenian girl that our guys strive to marry.

It's caused by a prevalent Western, liberal mindset which leads to immodesty, improper lifestyle, anti-family values etc. People with that mindset will go dance in clubs with guys, drink, and do other regretful things. Tell me why don't any practising Muslim women go to such places? Have you ever seen a woman with hijab in a dance club?

I think the above is as clear a confirmation as you can get that Mos is a fundamentalist Muslim. Every word he has posted on this thread, and most of what he has posted over the years on this forum would agree with that conclusion. Of course he will deny it - but we have to remember that Muslims believe that it is permisable to lie and be deceitful if it advances the cause of Islam.