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"White People"

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  • #151
    I actually find it a bit sick when I come accross Armenians who get caught up in this whole "white Pride" racial thing...haven't they learned that this - in part - is the type of xenophobia that caused the Turks to turn on us - Pan Turanism and such...yet these people can't figure it out - its this binning of "us" and "them" that is at the root of the problem...and for a people who have suffered far to long being "thems" - you woudl think that perhaps we have learned a lesson or two (and not - let us jump on the "superior" bandwagon and put others down....no - not quite the correct conclusion to the lesson...

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    • #152
      Aww would you look at that, an egalitarian tea party.
      Last edited by Anonymouse; 03-07-2005, 12:48 PM.
      Achkerov kute.

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      • #153
        George W. Gill
        Professor of Anthropology, University of Wyoming

        Why do we feel we should be able to study Kennewick Man? Ancient human skeletal remains are a valuable source of scientific information and are protected as archeological resources under federal law (the Archaeological Resources Protection Act). As a trained physical anthropologist at a state institution, I have the legal and ethical responsibility to curate, study, protect, and sometimes repatriate the human skeletons that come to my laboratory. From human skeletons, we can derive information relating to human diseases, injury, warfare, origins, migrations, and gene flow. The more ancient skeletons as well as the better preserved ones tend to be more important skeletons scientifically because of the vast amount of new information that they can provide.

        Kennewick Man may be one of the most important skeletons ever unearthed in North America. It is a very ancient skeleton and therefore not a close relative of any human alive today. Thus, claims of cultural or biological affinity by any group existing today are so tenuous that they should not be allowed to prevent scientific study of this important find. The skeleton should remain in the domain of all humanity and not be claimed by any single federal agency or any single religious or cultural group. It should be studied by all qualified scientists whose research might be able to provide new knowledge from the secrets that these ancient bones contain.

        What do I personally expect to learn from studying the Kennewick skeleton? I am a forensic anthropologist with a research focus on skeletal race attribution (learning ancestry from bone traits). Most of the successful methods that I have developed and published in leading journals relate to distinguishing American Indians from whites skeletally. Certain single approaches are over 90 percent accurate in separating modern whites from modern American Indians. Interestingly, traits of both of these populations are found among individuals of the early Archaic and Paleo-Indian period. Certainly the Kennewick skeleton should be assessed with regard to these trait occurrences.

        These are not the multivariate, cranial-measurement approaches used by most other physical anthropologists who study ancestry. They constitute a somewhat independent approach. My approach would provide another independent means of determining ancestry through a combination of different kinds of trait evaluations. In short, my approach will hopefully provide us with insight to help answer the question of who Kennewick Man's closest relatives were in regard to the major racial elements of today.
        Achkerov kute.

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        • #154
          we are a people as old as time, however we are still too savage (generally) to understand this. if we were like the europeans, we would not have a country that is living under poverty... we would have PAVED ROADS! we would have water and electricity in all parts of Armenia... BUT NOPE! unlike europe, or the US, armenia is FAR FAAAR behind this type of progress, rather the concern of the people in authoritative positions is their own personal life style, and the general public is concerned about how "white" they are or how they are related to europeans... come on people, where those europeans when ARMENIAN EXISTED!

          LOL! i cant imagine a french person tlaking about that... they dont need to, they dont have a confidence problem... niether do the Greeks, they also do not have to prove to others that they are "white"...

          its insane... this has got to stop... stop fighting over something that does NOTHING to progress our nation, our culture, or anything good... its nothing, its a word that is accepted in the 21st century as ebing "superior"... and when its accepted to be mexican what are we going to say, "we are aztec"?

          come on people... grow up, shape up, and lets move our people into the 21st century, lets help armenia have paved roads, lets bring back the water and electricity to our viligas, which the governt has sold to other nations...

          being white doesnt make you a better person, being white jsut reminds us of how ignorant the population of this world is... we are a culture that is slowly disintegrating, we are not a lot, and this nonesence about white/black is an American thing, not an Armenian thing...

          Comment

          • #155
            Physical anthropologists have amazingly ingenius techniques for telling a skeleton's racial background. You guys really seem to be talking past each other. One party is simply stating that races exist and that they are biologically determined, and the other is warning of the placing of value judgements on this fact. Both of you are right in these regards.

            Comment

            • #156
              Originally posted by nunechka
              we are a people as old as time, however we are still too savage (generally) to understand this. if we were like the europeans, we would not have a country that is living under poverty... we would have PAVED ROADS! we would have water and electricity in all parts of Armenia... BUT NOPE! unlike europe, or the US, armenia is FAR FAAAR behind this type of progress, rather the concern of the people in authoritative positions is their own personal life style, and the general public is concerned about how "white" they are or how they are related to europeans... come on people, where those europeans when ARMENIAN EXISTED!

              LOL! i cant imagine a french person tlaking about that... they dont need to, they dont have a confidence problem... niether do the Greeks, they also do not have to prove to others that they are "white"...

              its insane... this has got to stop... stop fighting over something that does NOTHING to progress our nation, our culture, or anything good... its nothing, its a word that is accepted in the 21st century as ebing "superior"... and when its accepted to be mexican what are we going to say, "we are aztec"?

              come on people... grow up, shape up, and lets move our people into the 21st century, lets help armenia have paved roads, lets bring back the water and electricity to our viligas, which the governt has sold to other nations...

              being white doesnt make you a better person, being white jsut reminds us of how ignorant the population of this world is... we are a culture that is slowly disintegrating, we are not a lot, and this nonesence about white/black is an American thing, not an Armenian thing...
              Another five paragraph post which doesn't say anything again. This isn't about who is better. It's not, contrary to your preconceived notions of what you have been taught since birth from every orifice of communication. It's about acknowledging the reality of differences, which you would like to ignore, but which doesn't change the fact of a world of differences.
              Achkerov kute.

              Comment

              • #157
                Originally posted by loseyourname
                Physical anthropologists have amazingly ingenius techniques for telling a skeleton's racial background. You guys really seem to be talking past each other. One party is simply stating that races exist and that they are biologically determined, and the other is warning of the placing of value judgements on this fact. Both of you are right in these regards.
                No one is saying one is better than another. I am at least saying that there are differences that cannot be ignored.
                Achkerov kute.

                Comment

                • #158
                  So there may be skeletal differences - and other differences (I've never denied that there are differences among different populations -and neither do Anthros) - but where we (? Europeans? whoever...) and various Indian groups differ in certain areas - we are similarin others - and this is repeated willy nilly accorss the globle sith different groups - to the point that you cannot bin 3 groups (or what have you) and say - all these are like this - and all those are like that - etc - just doesn't work....that is the point...

                  Comment

                  • #159
                    Originally posted by Anonymouse
                    No one is saying one is better than another. I am at least saying that there are differences that cannot be ignored.
                    Again - please list for us all the determining characteristics of the "white" (or whatever) genotype....you can't do so without there being reams of exceptions - to the extent that the exceptions absolutly break the rule - and that is the point - so go ahead show us....

                    Comment

                    • #160
                      Originally posted by winoman
                      Again - please list for us all the determining characteristics of the "white" (or whatever) genotype....you can't do so without there being reams of exceptions - to the extent that the exceptions absolutly break the rule - and that is the point - so go ahead show us....
                      Aww, don't you look cute? I already said I'm not a geneticist. I'm sure I can be like you and try to find some article that supports my claim, and there are alot, and post it. But I will not. In fact, if you go to the race thread, that is all the proof you will need. Genetic differences are the underlying language like the programming language of a computer, but we see it in physiological and morphological differences, in intelligence, in susceptibility to disease.
                      Achkerov kute.

                      Comment

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