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Originally posted by RUDO
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I suppose we all are going to sort it out such problems as we get more determined about what sort of Turkey we envisage for ourselves and for our children. -
Yes we should be determined not to give these provacators trying to make chaos in our country,any chance to accomplish their goal.Originally posted by ScythianVizier
We want a better country for our children.And it will.Comment
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The issue is related to cultural and of course some economic problems. They used to talk about GAP for ages, but they did fail to invest as much as they could. Instead, the governments acted like thiefs and the country almost got bankrupt due irrational monetary policies, and due to defence procurements tranferred to abroad.Originally posted by RUDO
Neither the Turks nor the Kurds did benefit in the end. This is what we have to focus on since we can not resolve any problem by dictating some remote policies from the top. Cultural freedom and maintaining high level of human rights, encouraging investment in industries that would employ more people, providing equal level of access for education, communication, health and public transportation services are the major plots that we should focus.
If I were the prime minister, I would have set up my office in Diyarbakir, and would refuse to leave my post until all problems would be sorted out in the whole region. I want to vote for people who would establish such mindset, not for the ones who would leave the problems behind after a few hours.Comment
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Yes you are right.Especially economic problems trigger terrorism.Of course also some cultural problems.The issue is related to cultural and of course some economic problems.Comment
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Yeah - how could I have missed Dadrian's most critically aclaimed book - "Jews and the Armenian Genocide" ...yeah thats it - thats the ticket...notComment
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Is that your best argument, loooooooozer!Originally posted by 1.5 million
Special Reports
French Rothschild Branch Behind the Planned Genocide Of Armenians
By Jack Manuelian
Were the plans of the 1915-23 Armenian Genocide actually drawn up and were in place by the year 1910 or 1912? According to some sources, definitely yes.
There is the book Inner Folds of the Ottoman Revolution written by Mevlan Zadeh Rifat and published in 1929, the author, a pro-sultan Turk, claims that the "Armenian genocide was decided in August 1910 and October 1911, by a Young Turk committee composed entirely of displaced Balkan Jews in the format of a syncretist Jewish-Muslim sect which included Talaat, Enver, Behaeddin Shakir, Jemal, and Nizam posting as Muslims. It met in the Rothschild-funded Grand Orient loge/hotel of Salonika." Syncretism means a combination of different forms of belief or practice; masonism fits that description.
A 1994 conference paper/lecture by Joseph Brewda of Schiller Institute entitled Palmerson launches Young Turks to permanently control Middle East claims the founder of the Young Turks to be a certain Jew by the name of Emmanuel Carasso. He states: "Carasso set up the Young Turk secret society in the 1890s in Salonika, then part of Turkey, and now part of Greece. Carasso was also the grand master of an Italian masonic lodge there, called 'Macedonia Resurrected.' The lodge was the headquarters of the Young Turks, and all the top Young Turk leadership were members."
Further on Mr. Brewda says: "During the Young Turk regime, Carasso continued to play a leading role. He met with the sultan, to tell him that he was overthrown. He was in charge of putting the sultan under house arrest. He ran the Young Turk intelligence network in the Balkans. And he was in charge of all food supplies in the empire during World War I." It is ironic that five centuries after the Turkish sultans welcomed the expelled European Jews into Turkey, certain Jews belonging to secret societies and to Zionism will kick the sultans out of power early in 20th century, destroy the Ottoman Empire, and celebrate their victory by massacring by proxy almost the whole Christian Armenian people, one million and half Armenians; half million Greeks; and half million Christian Assyrians & Arameans.
Mr. Brewda writes: "Another important area was the press. While in power, the Young Turks ran several newspapers, including 'The Young Turk,' whose editor was none other than the Russian Zionist leader Vladimir Jabotinsky. Jabotinsky had been educated as a young man in Italy."
Mr. Brewda, ignoring the possibility that Talaat could have been a secret infiltrated Jew, writes: "Of course, there were also some Turks who helped lead the Young Turk movement. For example, Talaat Pasha. Talaat was the interior minister and dictator of the regime during World war I. He had been a member of Carasso's Italian masonic lodge in Salonika. One year prior to the 1908 coup, Talaat became the grand master of the Scottish Rite Masons in the Ottoman Empire. If you go to the [archives of] Scottish Rite headquarters in Washington, D.C., you can find that most of the Young Turk leaders were officials in the Scottish Rite."
Mr. Brewda also mentions the novel Greenmantle, whose hero is a British spy who led the Young Turks, and that the book's author, John Buchan, later identified the novel's hero as the English nobleman Aubrey Herbert, who was the top British spy master in the Middle East during WW I. And that Lawrence of Arabia later identified Herbert as having been, at one time, the head of the Young Turks. According to Mr. Brewda, Carasso also appears in that novel under the name Carusso.
By 1916 the British and French, overpowered by greed, already had a secret agreement to divide the Ottoman Empire between themselves. Presently Hitler's Mien Kempt anti-semitic book is a best-seller in Turkey, it is published by various Turkish publishers by the thousands and thousands. Are the Turks finally waking up and realizing that their Sultan's refusal to grant Palestine to the Zionist Jews as a homeland had cost them their centuries- old empire?
Talaat was a living witness to the Genocide and history. He should not have been assassinated. His silencing for good by hot-tempered Armenians only served those who planned and executed the Genocide. Had he been left alone, who knows he might have confessed everything at his old age or at his deathbed.
Another conspiratorial source is the lengthy article The Armenian & Jewish Genocide Project: Eliminating Ethnic Conflict Along the Oil Route From Baku to the Suez Canal Region written by Clifford Shack and posted in his web-site.
Mr. Shack writes: "In the 1880's, the French branch of the Rothschild family acquired interests in Russia's Baku oil fields in an effort to supply their refinery on the Adriatic with cheap Russian oil. In exchange for these interests they built a railroad linking Baku to the newly acquired Black Sea port of Batum. This opened up the Baku oil, a major world supply, to the world. With the success of the new railroad, the Rothschilds had more oil than they could actually sell. Overcoming their fear of competing with the giant Standard oil [of USA], they sought out the huge [Far East] markets east of Suez."
Further on Mr. Shack makes his point: "The decision by the shrewd French Rothschild branch to diversify into other areas of oil exploitation was, presumably, a calculated one. Three years after they joined Royal Dutch, production at Baku would come to an abrupt halt in 1905. Although shaken by political activity, the principal disruption was due to the violence of the ethnic conflict between the region's Muslims and the minority population of Armenians who are Christians. This ethnic conflict caused the first interruption of oil distribution to the world market. Standard oil was quick to supplant the needs of the effected markets as its source was operating under the blanket of peace. The Royal/Dutch/Shell Group (and the Nobles) watched their Baku investments go up in flames. Ethnic conflict was at the root of the matter. It could be safely assumed that they were taking measures to eliminate the possibility of that happening in the future." Oil corporations seem to have learned their lessons from history because before the construction of present-day Baku-Ceyhan pipeline has began, someone has made sure that no Armenians were left in Baku anymore. Although the Armenian threat to that pipeline has been neutralized, yet there is still A Turkish ultra-nationalist revival threat, and a threat from Iran if Iran comes under attack from USA or Israel. There is a very clean prophecy of Nostradamus stating: "By firepower of armies, not far from the Black Sea, he will come from Persia/Iran to occupy Trebizond." Trebizond is located at the shore of the Black Sea and its occupation will virtually cut the Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan pipeline in half. Another prophecy of Nostradamus reads: "Toward Persia/Iran a sizable army of a million. The serpent Satan invading Byzantium and Egypt." Byzantium & Egypt could be a mystical name for modern Istanbul asSodom & Egypt is the mystical name given for Jerusalem in the book Revelation 11:8.
Mr. Shack notes that "the mere elimination of the Armenian population of Baku would not solve the problem of ethnic conflict in that region. The surrounding areas would provide reservoir effect in resupplying the conflicting minority element." And he asks: "was the removal [in 1915-23] of a small minority like the Armenians [from historical Armenia] a fair price to pay for the peace in a region so crucial to the development and investment of the Far East?" Apparently Mr. Shack ignores the factor of revenge raging in the heart of human beasts.
Mr. Shacks answers his own question by stating in his article about the big business or big corporations: "It would be fair to say that the genocide of a group of a million or so, to serve the benefit of a billion or so [in the Far East], is less of a question of should it be done, than how it could be done. So as not to reveal any plausible motive which could link the actual planners to the genocide, the scheme involved a proxy party [namely the muslim Turks, Kurds & Azeris] , which was manipulated through layers of influence, providing sufficient cover for the planners."
The fool said in his ignorance, "There was no planned and organized and executed genocide of the Armenians."
In chapter 30 of the book of Isaiah, we read God speaking by His prophet: "Woe to the rebellious children, who execute a plan, but not Mine, and make an alliance, but not of My Spirit, in order to add sin to sin;...For this is a rebellious people, false sons, sons who refuse to listen to the instruction of the Lord."
March 27, 2005
Jack Manuelian
[email protected]
Note - this article is NOT copyrighted. Anyone can duplicate in any form. - Jack Manuelian)
Article from: http://www.rense.com/general63/armen.htm
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Palmerston launches Young Turks to permanently control Middle East
By Joseph Brewda
Chorus: It is clear that the B'nai B'rith is an abject tool of British intelligence, run and directed to serve the interests of British imperial policy, and not the interests of Jews, nor even of B'nai B'rith members. The one peculiarity of B'nai B'rith in comparison to the other organizations launched by Palmerston and his three stooges, is that B'nai B'rith will be used for a wider variety of tasks in various countries and epochs. Therefore, the B'nai B'rith will be more permanent in its continuous organization than its Mazzinian counterparts, among which it stands out as the most specialized.
At the end of this century, one of the tasks assigned to the B'nai B'rith will be to direct, with the help of other Mazzinian agents, the dismemberment and partition of the Ottoman Empire. This is the state the British will call "the sick man of Europe." Historically, the Ottoman Empire offers surprising tolerance to its ethnic minorities. In order to blow up the empire, that will have to be changed into brutal racial oppression on the Mazzini model.
In 1862, during the time of the American Civil War, Mazzini will call on all his agents anywhere near Russia to foment revolt as a way of causing trouble for Alexander II. A bit later, with the help of Young Poland, Mazzini will start a Young Ottoman movement out of an Adam Smith translation project in Paris. In 1876, the Young Ottomans will briefly seize power in Constantinople. They will end a debt moratorium, pay off the British, declare free trade, and bring in Anglo-French bankers. They will be quickly overthrown; but the same network will soon make a comeback as the Young Turks, whose rule will finally destroy the Ottoman Empire.
In 1908, the Committee for Union and Progress, better known as the Young Turks, carried out a military coup, overthrew the sultan, and took power in the Ottoman Turkish empire. Once in power, they carried out a racist campaign of suppressing all non-Turkish minorities. Within four years, their anti-minority campaigns provoked the Balkan wars of 1912-13, among Turkey, Greece, Bulgaria, and Serbia. By 1914, these wars had triggered World War I, with Turkey becoming an ally of Germany.
Within seven years of coming into power, the Young Turks destroyed the Ottoman Empire. British intelligence had manipulated every nationalist group in the Empire, both the Young Turks, and their opponents.
When the Young Turks took power, the Ottoman Empire still included Syria, Iraq, Jordan, Palestine, and the Arabian Peninsula. The empire still included much of the Balkans: half of Greece, half of Bulgaria, half of Serbia, and all of Albania. Its land area was much bigger than present-day Turkey.
Although most of the population of the Ottoman empire were Turks, there were also large numbers of Slavs, Greeks, Arabs, Armenians, and Kurds. The Ottoman empire was a multi-ethnic empire, as were the nearby Austrian and Russian empires.
The Young Turks came to power waving the banner of democracy, but they soon picked up the banner of pan-Turkism. The idea was to form a state that included all the Turkic peoples of Asia. Since half of these people lived in Russia, this policy meant a collision with Russia.
But pan-Turkism was not created by the Young Turks or even in Turkey. It was first called for in the 1860s by a Hungarian Zionist named Arminius Vambery, who had become an adviser to the sultan, but who secretly worked for Lord Palmerston and the British Foreign Office. Vambery later tried to broker a deal between the Zionist leader Theodor Herzl and the sultan, over the creation of Israel.
The Young Turks also raised the banner of a pan-Islamic state. The idea was to bring all the Muslim peoples of the world into one empire, whether or not they were Turkish. This was another goal that meant conflict with Russia.
This idea was also not created by the Young Turks or in Turkey. It was first called for in the 1870s by an English nobleman named Wilfred Blunt, whose family had created the Bank of England. Blunt was a top British intelligence official who advocated using Islam to destroy Russia. Blunt's family later patronized the British KGB spy "Kim" Philby.
While the Young Turks were pushing the pan-Turkic and pan-Islamic movements, the British were also boosting all the anti-Turkish independence movements within the empire. They were supporting Arab nationalism, led by Lawrence of Arabia. They were supporting Serbian nationalism, led by the British agent Seton-Watson; Albanian nationalism, led by Lady Dunham; and Bulgarian nationalism, led by Noel Buxton. All of these peoples wanted to break free from the Ottoman Empire; but they also claimed the land of their neighbors.
For example, the British supported the idea of carving a "Greater Armenia" out of Turkey, Iran, and Russia. This "Greater Armenia" had no possibility of existing. None of the Great Powers, including Britain, really wanted it. The Kurds, who lived in the same area, didn't want it. But the British told the Armenians they supported their plans.
At the same time, the British were also telling the Kurds they supported the idea of "Greater Kurdistan." As the map shows, the proposed territories of "Greater Kurdistan" and "Greater Armenia" were almost identical.
In 1915, during World War I, the Kurds killed about 1 million Armenians. The Young Turks, who had been put in power by the British, used the Kurds (who thought they had the support of the British) to slaughter the Armenians (who also thought they had the support of the British). The British then used this genocide as a justification for trying to eliminate Turkey.
In fact, the next year, the British and French got together to plan the division of the Ottoman Empire between themselves. According to the plan, which only partially worked, Turkey itself would be reduced to a tiny area on the Black Sea. The rest of the empire would go to Britain and France.
B'nai B'rith and the Young Turks
But who were these "Young Turks," who so efficiently destroyed the empire?
The founder of the Young Turks was an Italian B'nai B'rith official named Emmanuel Carasso. Carasso set up the Young Turk secret society in the 1890s in Salonika, then part of Turkey, and now part of Greece. Carasso was also the grand master of an Italian masonic lodge there, called "Macedonia Resurrected." The lodge was the headquarters of the Young Turks, and all the top Young Turk leadership were members.
The Italian masonic lodges in the Ottoman Empire had been set up by a follower of Giuseppe Mazzini named Emmanuel Veneziano, who was also a leader of B'nai B'rith's European affiliate, the Universal Israelite Alliance.
During the Young Turk regime, Carasso continued to play a leading role. He met with the sultan, to tell him that he was overthrown. He was in charge of putting the sultan under house arrest. He ran the Young Turk intelligence network in the Balkans. And he was in charge of all food supplies in the empire during World War I.
Another important area was the press. While in power, the Young Turks ran several newspapers, including The Young Turk, whose editor was none other than the Russian Zionist leader Vladimir Jabotinsky. Jabotinsky had been educated as a young man in Italy. He later described Mazzini's ideas as the basis for the Zionist movement.
Jabotinsky arrived in Turkey shortly after the Young Turks seized power, to take over the paper. The paper was owned by a member of the Turkish cabinet, but it was funded by the Russian Zionist federation, and managed by B'nai B'rith. The editorial policy of the paper was overseen by a Dutch Zionist named Jacob Kann, who was the personal banker of the king and queen of the Netherlands.
Jabotinsky later created the most anti-Arab of all the Zionist organizations, the Irgun. His followers in Israel today are the ones most violently opposed to the Peres-Arafat peace accords.
Another associate of Carasso was Alexander Helphand, better known as Parvus, the financier of the 1905 and 1917 Russian revolutions. Shortly after 1905, Parvus moved to Turkey, where he became the economics editor of another Young Turk newspaper called The Turkish Homeland. Parvus became a business partner of Carasso in the grain trade, and an arms supplier to the Turkish army during the Balkan wars. He later returned to Europe, to arrange the secret train that took Lenin back to Russia, in 1917.
Of course, there were also some Turks who helped lead the Young Turk movement. For example, Talaat Pasha. Talaat was the interior minister and dictator of the regime during World War I. He had been a member of Carasso's Italian masonic lodge in Salonika. One year prior to the 1908 coup, Talaat became the grand master of the Scottish Rite Masons in the Ottoman Empire. If you go to the Scottish Rite headquarters in Washington, D.C., you can find that most of the Young Turk leaders were officials in the Scottish Rite.
But who founded the Scottish Rite in Turkey? One of the founders was the grand master of the Scottish Rite in France, Adolph Cremieux, who also happened to be the head of the B'nai B'rith's European affiliate. Cremieux had been a leader of Mazzini's Young France, and helped put the British stooge Napoleon III into power.
The British controller: Aubrey Herbert
You can find the story of the Young Turks in the B'nai B'rith and Scottish Rite archives, but you cannot find it in history books. The best public account is found in the novel Greenmantle, whose hero is a British spy who led the Young Turks. Carasso appears in the novel under the name Carusso. The author, John Buchan, who was a British intelligence official in World War I, later identified the novel's hero as Aubrey Herbert.
In real life, Herbert was from one of the most powerful noble families in England. The family held no fewer than four earldoms. His repeated contact with Carasso and other Young Turk leaders is a matter of public record. Herbert's grandfather had been a patron of Mazzini and died leading revolutionary mobs in Italy in 1848. His father was in charge of British Masonry in the 1880s and 1890s. His uncle was the British ambassador to the United States. During World War I, Herbert was the top British spymaster in the Middle East. Lawrence of Arabia later identified Herbert as having been, at one time, the head of the Young Turks.
The U.S. State Department also played a role in the conspiracy. From 1890 through World War I, there were three U.S. ambassadors to Turkey: Oscar Straus, Abraham Elkin, and Henry Morgenthau. All three were friends of Simon Wolf. And all three were officials of B'nai B'rith.
Article from: http://www.schillerinstitute.org/con...94_brewda.html
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How typical, Joobian the Nazi is slandering Jews again like Nazis always do.
1.5 Million I think we would agree that the reason Excommunication was first invented was to Excommunicate people like Joobian.Comment
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Originally posted by Gondorian
Once again, gondo-liar the turk is talking xxxx. Do prove that what Jooboian posted was slander. Again, Jooboian did not write the posted articles so you attack and SLANDER the messenger, an Armenian, because you cannot attack the message and there is nothing you won't do to defend jews. All you can do is come up with the devastating name calling. HA HA HA HO HO HO HE HE HE
What a LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOSER.
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What a low life loser coward you have to be, to post someone’s name in a forum where there are savages lingering around (such ramil safarov), are you sure if that person is who you claim he is? Or are you sure there’s no one else with the same name? you coward Zionist snake? Mark my words you piece of xxxx, if ever any harm comes to an Armenian with a Name “Arto” or with a family name “Vartanian” we are going to find you and nail your ass to that star of david that you warship you M/F piece of xxxx….!!!!!Originally posted by 1.5 millionComment
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