What should Turkey be proud of?

[Sako]

Re: What should Turkey be proud of?

Why does every nationalist think others aren't getting the message out or that they're getting the WRONG message out? You think anyone listens to you people? You think anyone cares when you stick your toy pistols at them, cursing every last Turk for what happened to us? I can't cease to laugh. A new aproach is required, one that isn't racist, one that doesn't threaten anyone, one that doesn't make Armenians look like fools.

And this thread seems to be turning into a family reunion for our nationalist breathren so happy reunion !

[gmd]

Re: What should Turkey be proud of?

Why does every nationalist think others aren't getting the message out or that they're getting the WRONG message out? You think anyone listens to you people? You think anyone cares when you stick your toy pistols at them, cursing every last Turk for what happened to us? I can't cease to laugh. A new aproach is required, one that isn't racist, one that doesn't threaten anyone, one that doesn't make Armenians look like fools.

And this thread seems to be turning into a family reunion for our nationalist breathren so happy reunion !

Saco, you come off sounding idealistic and naive at times. At least to me. If you want to have dialogue with individual Turks or Martians that is fine and great but the issues between our cultures have a long and dark history. None of it will be resolved by sitting around the camp fire and singing spiritual hymns.
You seem to be willing and eager to accommodate those people who some of us blame for crimes that have gone unpunished. I am sure the objection will be that none of these Turks today were responsible. Regardless they have no problems benefiting from the fruits of the crime, therefore they share at least some guilt.

[Hellektor]

Re: What should Turkey be proud of?

Hellektor i see that you are back to the forum that's really great to see. I see you are also getting warnings for insulting Turks. I see what you mean about Saco and you were right last time and I think you'll be right this time. And a good start at the forum.

ps be carefull don't get your self banned we need to get the message out to the people, what has happened, what is happening. So they don't forget.

Thanks Karo jan but I don't intend to stay. I can't write on this board because of the impossibility of communication between me and the mod. You saw that jack sparrow was MUSTANG 65 was ZAYRAVAASTOV. They all had the same nonsensical style and started threads with misleading subjects. The last “two” appeared on the same threads, patting “one another”, giving the impression that a real discussion was going on and gave a distorted image of Armenians. The new reincarnation does the same thing, in the same style and as a fully harmonious “duo”, always agreeing which amplifies and gives weight to “their” anti-Armenian dangerous nonsense, creating a false picture of our reality.

I only reply to assure you I didn't insult the Turk. The Turk constantly insulted and threatened me (from behind his PC monitor). Both posts are removed and I’m still accused, with the evidence destroyed, of insulting. Here's a sample of the Turk's insolent rant for which he never got a warning:

And to top it off, they think all Armenians think the same so get the hell off this thread.

I got angry when you said a bunch of terrible things against Turkey and Turks not because you stated Genocidal facts loser.

You went so low, retard.

I can tell you things about Armenia that would make you want to kill all Armenians

And I still can. You might not kill all Armenians (I'd kill you first),

In response, I did NOT use any insults but told him to drop the mask if he had a grain of decency, otherwise he could crawl back to Mongolia, the hell he crept from and the hell he belonged.

I think my post was removed because I used the emphatic term fucking, NOT directed at the Turk but describing “the hell where he came from”, i.e. “fucking hell”. You be the judge if you get to read this before it's removed.

*****

And just a reminder, this thread wasn't meant to get responses from Armenians, it was supposed to get posts from Turks and for a reason you can't begin to understand.

Note that I didn't intend to post on this asinine thread. I accidentally saw that I was called a racist by the evil twin of this Turk so I reacted.

[KarotheGreat]

Re: What should Turkey be proud of?

@ Anon, why is Hellektor the only one getting warnings in this thread and Saco goes free, he's treating him. If I should do that, and I've done that hell would break lose. I've done that and got a warning, when is he getting his warning.

@Hellektor, my friend stay there are better threads than this one, were we can discuss real issue like the military. Read all the awesome stuff ZORAVAR has written. Don't mind some of the people here, this place has been going down the drain. It isn't the place that once was back in the days.

[seruven]

Re: What should Turkey be proud of?

If you want to have dialogue with individual Turks or Martians that is fine and great but the issues between our cultures have a long and dark history. None of it will be resolved by sitting around the camp fire and singing spiritual hymns.

I try to avoid from the discussions going on in this thread. However, I want to state I believe that it's important for Turks and Armenians to "sit around the camp fire". We can't expect any problem to be solved while there is no dialogue between those two nations. I don't want Armenians to think that Turks are bloody monsters or vice versa. This is what will happen in absence of dialogue. Just, do not belittle "camp fires" so easily gmd.
Regards,
S.

[gmd]

Re: What should Turkey be proud of?

I try to avoid from the discussions going on in this thread. However, I want to state I believe that it's important for Turks and Armenians to "sit around the camp fire". We can't expect any problem to be solved while there is no dialogue between those two nations. I don't want Armenians to think that Turks are bloody monsters or vice versa. This is what will happen in absence of dialogue. Just, do not belittle "camp fires" so easily gmd.
Regards,
S.

Not all camp fires you are right, it all depends on what we roast on the spit.

[Eddo211]

Re: What should Turkey be proud of?

Saco, you come off sounding idealistic and naive at times. At least to me. If you want to have dialogue with individual Turks or Martians that is fine and great but the issues between our cultures have a long and dark history. None of it will be resolved by sitting around the camp fire and singing spiritual hymns.
You seem to be willing and eager to accommodate those people who some of us blame for crimes that have gone unpunished. I am sure the objection will be that none of these Turks today were responsible. Regardless they have no problems benefiting from the fruits of the crime, therefore they share at least some guilt.

Regardless of the dark history with Turks nothing can ever be achieved without some type of dialog, even if its lost land that we are talking about. For older Armenian Generation is too late, they have too much hate inside for all that has happened, I understand Hellector but Armenian and Turkish new Generations are a different story. There is a good chance of Dialog that could awaken the Turks to the truth. I don’t know why you would be against something that cannot harm Armenians anymore than they have been. Young Armenians like Saco should be given a chance. (He does not sound like a Turk to me….you guys are so paranoid that you are ready to lynch one of your own)
There is nothing to loose here, older generation can never trust the Turks and most know who Turks really are (As explained eloquently in these discussions) but would it not be an advantage to Armenians if more Turks accepted what happened and started to question their government?

Until Armenia becomes a force that can kick Turkish butt militarily, economically, and politically, you better find another effective weapon to fight with. Exposing the truth is a potent gun against Turkish elites.

[gmd]

Re: What should Turkey be proud of?

Regardless of the dark history with Turks nothing can ever be achieved without some type of dialog, even if its lost land that we are talking about. For older Armenian Generation is too late, they have too much hate inside for all that has happened, I understand Hellector but Armenian and Turkish new Generations are a different story. There is a good chance of Dialog that could awaken the Turks to the truth. I don’t know why you would be against something that cannot harm Armenians anymore than they have been. Young Armenians like Saco should be given a chance. (He does not sound like a Turk to me….you guys are so paranoid that you are ready to lynch one of your own)
There is nothing to loose here, older generation can never trust the Turks and most know who Turks really are (As explained eloquently in these discussions) but would it not be an advantage to Armenians if more Turks accepted what happened and started to question their government?

Until Armenia becomes a force that can kick Turkish butt militarily, economically, and politically, you better find another effective weapon to fight with. Exposing the truth is a potent gun against Turkish elites.

I do not agree with the accommodating tone but I agree we must bide our time and not forget what we are dealing with.
The problem with Turks and those willing to overlook history is that trust cannot exist where dealings have always been one sided and dishonest. Armenian/Turk relations have been detrimental for Armenians. In that light without some significant show of trust from Turks why should Armenians open their arms and say the past is the past we believe everything you say to us? The exceptions in Turkish society exist today as they did in the past. All Turks are not fire breathing demons, but the nation as a whole has been a demon to Armenians. How can/should we trust them if they have not shown us anything to feel confident about?
At this point the kind words from Turkey sound very familiar.
If some Armenians want to forget history then they should not complain the next time there is a massacre or worst!

[Sako]

Re: What should Turkey be proud of?

In response, I did NOT use any insults but told him to drop the mask if he had a grain of decency, otherwise he could crawl back to Mongolia, the hell he crept from and the hell he belonged.

No brains…

Saco, you come off sounding idealistic and naive at times. At least to me. If you want to have dialogue with individual Turks or Martians that is fine and great but the issues between our cultures have a long and dark history. None of it will be resolved by sitting around the camp fire and singing spiritual hymns.

And neither will it be dealt with guns and blood. For some reason, you think you’re the only one that knows about Armenian history and the pains of the Armenian people. I also take the Armenian flag in my hands and introduce my country and face these difficult issues, talking about them like a human being but I don’t stick it in people’s eyes because they might become blind and never see what I’m saying. You think anyone listens to YOUR hymns? Look at the signatures flying around that there is only one Turk, a DEAD Turk, Armenian freedom will come only with guns and whatnot. You might be talking about only the racist Turks but all Turks won’t understand you the way you want them to. I am talking about something very subtle, something that is only ruining our current state. They simply laugh and you people allow everyone to laugh at my country. Your motives aren’t wrong, your way of saying everything is wrong. Come to Armenia and get a better look at what’s going on. So many Armenians are moving on, harnessing their anger, realizing who their real enemies are, ready to move on. It’s just the nationalists in the Diaspora that have to rush in and ruin everything. And you of all people talk about not insulting, Hellektor, when you have been insulting terribly the second you came into this thread. Perhaps you didn’t notice your racist words, your extreme anger and hate, how you threw an entire nation with its entire people into the dirt. Who will respect you after talking this way? Who will listen to my country, to its people, to people really trying to get something done (instead of waving flags crazily) after hearing all you’ve said. And although you guys insist that you aren’t talking about ALL the Turks …. YOU DO SO, unintentionally perhaps, and that is what I’m against. You disregard the little progress we have made so far and think you can do a better job with your toy pistols. Your words would make any sane person feel threatened and go against you AUTOMATICALLY. You think I care? The problem is that those people go against ARMENIA, not you alone. So take your toys and find another thread to continue your ramble. If we had bad chances of getting this issue cleared, you are making them worse. Instead of seeing what I’m saying, you have been turning me into my own countries enemy and the hilarious part is you think I take jackasses seriously. Get a life.

We can't expect any problem to be solved while there is no dialogue between those two nations. I don't want Armenians to think that Turks are bloody monsters or vice versa. This is what will happen in absence of dialogue.

Exactly my point … nothing more, nothing less…

[Eddo211]

Re: What should Turkey be proud of?

I do not agree with the accommodating tone but I agree we must bide our time and not forget what we are dealing with.
The problem with Turks and those willing to overlook history is that trust cannot exist where dealings have always been one sided and dishonest. Armenian/Turk relations have been detrimental for Armenians. In that light without some significant show of trust from Turks why should Armenians open their arms and say the past is the past we believe everything you say to us? The exceptions in Turkish society exist today as they did in the past. All Turks are not fire breathing demons, but the nation as a whole has been a demon to Armenians. How can/should we trust them if they have not shown us anything to feel confident about?
At this point the kind words from Turkey sound very familiar.
If some Armenians want to forget history then they should not complain the next time there is a massacre or worst!

The past will never be just the past and nothing will ever be forgotten, I have a feeling that Saco knows this very well.

I say Armenians must feel the duty to enforced Hrant Dink’s message to Turks when he said in an interview “…Turks must have an awakening from within…”
I don’t know about the rest of you but I happen to believe this theory.
You cannot expect anything from Turks like the things you mentioned until this freaking enlightenment happens and starts raining down on their leaders.
Our young generation like Saco and our Mexican friend Pedro can fight the important part of the battle effectively on Internet (with a good chance of success)…and they can use all the help they can get from cool collective heads with a clear mission without prejudice or malice. This is no easy task they face and they are well aware of the Turkish lies, tricks, and attacks. One cannot take this task personally and yet one cannot force it down the Turkish throat. They must make them understand that this is not just an Armenian problem but a Turkish Problem that must be solved.

This is not opening your arms to Turks as you say but an attempt to help open the young Turkish generation’s minds before it is fully corrupt by the Turkish Propaganda Machine…or at least make them question.