Please Sign This Petition: Özür diliyoruz

[lal]

No, although i am a mathematician, dead bodies are not calculated and counted.

What i mean is there is no direct connection between ASALA and Armenian state. Thus, if somebody will apologize, this has to be ASALA, if still exists.

But Genocide proceeded by Ittihadist state and Kemalist Turkish Republic is the successor of it. So, if somebody will apologize, it is Turkey Republic.

I think it is clear enough.

no it is not clear enough.

armenians or armenia not need to apologise for anything. they only need to declare that they did not support asala terrorizm whatever the reason was.

ı mean if armenians say that it was nice to kill 55 AG deniers and this terror helped the world to hear them, ı dont think they can expect anything from turkey.

[Gavur]

Your putting words in my mouth again.

[ardakilic]

no it is not clear enough.

armenians or armenia not need to apologise for anything. they only need to declare that they did not support asala terrorizm whatever the reason was.

ı mean if armenians say that it was nice to kill 55 AG deniers and this terror helped the world to hear them, ı dont think they can expect anything from turkey.

Dont you compare different things?

I wish i could explain something in Turkish; it would be easier. Anyway, as you know very well, there is a "testimonial culture" in Turkey. What do i mean?

For example, if you start speaking in Turkish state's crimes in Kurdistan, you have to start speaking like "I also condemn PKK terror but ....". This is testimonial culture. You dont have to mention PKK to condemn Turkish state's crimes in Kurd cities. These are totally different things. This is not legalization of terror.

Now, could i tell my point?

[lal]

Dont you compare different things?

I wish i could explain something in Turkish; it would be easier. Anyway, as you know very well, there is a "testimonial culture" in Turkey. What do i mean?

For example, if you start speaking in Turkish state's crimes in Kurdistan, you have to start speaking like "I also condemn PKK terror but ....". This is testimonial culture. You dont have to mention PKK to condemn Turkish state's crimes in Kurd cities. These are totally different things. This is not legalization of terror.

Now, could i tell my point?

yes ı understand you this time. but again , dont you think that some positive messeges must come from the other side. ı mean not for you and me,but for the rest great majority of turkey. wouldnt that help a little? you know ı love armenians, ı only want to be friends again.

[ardakilic]

yes ı understand you this time. but again , dont you think that some positive messeges must come from the other side. ı mean not for you and me,but for the rest great majority of turkey. wouldnt that help a little? you know ı love armenians, ı only want to be friends again.

I have no doubt about your good feelings, i got your point.

Of course it can help. But if you are not ready to take the message, there will be nothing to do.

And important remark, at least for me: This is not a case of equaliztion. This is not mathematic.

[ardakilic]

You deserve a kiss in the mouth for that consice comparison.

You made me embarassed

i have become red. thanks a lot...

[chinchilla]

What do you all think about what Ayşe Hür has said about the petition? I think she might be right.

According to “Zaman,” some Turkish civil society representatives were quick to object to the campaign. “For me, all these events [of 1915] were the fault of Turkish nationalism flourishing at that time, and personally I don’t identify with it,” historian Ayse Hur told the paper. “So I do not feel the need to apologize personally.”

Link - http://www.huliq.com/1/74137/intelle...great-disaster

[bell-the-cat]

ı mean if armenians say that it was nice to kill 55 AG deniers and this terror helped the world to hear them, ı dont think they can expect anything from turkey.

However, their killers did not kill them because they were AG deniers (or even because they were Turks), but because they were representatives of the Turkish state. ASALA considered itself to be at war with Turkey, a state which had committeed genocide and was occupying the Armenian homeland, and so it considered Turkish diplomats to be legitimate targets. I'm not sure how much of it even had to do with AG recognition.

[bell-the-cat]

What do you all think about what Ayşe Hür has said about the petition? I think she might be right.

According to “Zaman,” some Turkish civil society representatives were quick to object to the campaign. “For me, all these events [of 1915] were the fault of Turkish nationalism flourishing at that time, and personally I don’t identify with it,” historian Ayse Hur told the paper. “So I do not feel the need to apologize personally.”

Link - http://www.huliq.com/1/74137/intelle...great-disaster

Perhaps she should identify with the deniers of "all these events", her fellow "historians", and apologise personally for the behaviour of her chosen profession.

[Alexandros]

Campaigners React To Prime Minister's Words About Apologizing To The Armenians


The Prime Minister criticizes those who campaign to apologize to the Armenians about the Great Catastrophe of 1915 by describing the whole thing as irrational. The campaigners react to Prime Minister’s words.

Bia news center - İstanbul

17-12-2008

Bawer ÇAKIR

The very first signatories of the “I apologize” campaign replied to Prime Minister’s words about the campaign.

The campaign was organized with the support of the 200 academicians, journalists, jurists and activists and it intends to apologize to the Armenians for the Great Catastrophe their ancestors, the Ottoman Armenians, had experienced in 1915. The text of the campaign says the following:

“My conscience does not accept the insensitivity shown to and the denial of the ‘Great Catastrophe’ that the Ottoman Armenians were subjected to in 1915. I reject this injustice and for my share, I empathize with the feelings and pain of my Armenian brothers and sisters, I apologize to them.”

The number of the signatures has reached 12341.

Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdoğan described the campaign as irrational and said, “One who committed the crime should apologize. It is not us. I do not accept it, I do not support it.”

Ağaoğlu: The Prime Minister should not discuss this, but the mentality that killed Hrant Dink

Writer Adalet Ağaoğlu: “What is expressed here is our shame. Erdoğan should tell us why Hrant Dink was killed, instead of this.”

“Racism and Turkism still continue. Since Dink was killed for the same reason and while everyone was aware about the murder plan, these are not the sentences to be uttered. The campaign is the expression of the shame we feel about the mentality that has been alive since the Ottomans.”

Aslım: Erdoğan is acting like an adolescent

Musician Aylin Aslım: “When it suits him he claims the 800 year old heritage, and when it does not suit him he says he did not do it. This is how an adolescent would act and his words about the campaign make as much sense as this kind of behavior does.”

Bora: We apologize for having ignored it

Aksu Bora: “Committing a crime does not always require an act. We are apologizing here for the crime, but for having ignored it, having forgotten it.”

Kardaş: The campaign will open the way to facing the past, to confronting it. This is a matter of conscience. These people are following it their consciences. This will ease Turkey’s position as well. I believe that this will contribute to the job of facing the past.”

Contepe: Prime Minister’s ideology is obvious, his attitude is normal

Co-chairperson of the Greens Party Bilge Contepe: “We have nothing to do with the state. The head of the state may not apologize. We know what kind of ideology and the mistake they are following.”

“I insist that apologizing is very important. We want to live in a democratic country and under equality. Those who live together with many different cultures will eventually have democracy. The Armenians are one of the essential/founding elements of this land. This is why I apologize to them for this injustice they had to endure.”

Ali Nesin: “I apologize to the Prime Minister for the inconvenience I caused.”

Prof. Dr. Ayhan Aktar: “This is Prime Minister’s opinion. That is all I will say.”

Mansur: This reaction indicates how important this campaign is

Actress Lale Mansur: “If the Prime Minister does not want to apologize, it is fine. We apologize for ourselves.”

“These reactions show how right this campaign is. It shows how taboo this subject is. This apology has nothing to do with Armenia, the political parties, the politicians.”

Elçi: I was not surprised

Lawyer Tahir Elçi: “Neither the Kurdish problem nor the other existing problems can be solved before Turkey faces the Armenian problem. The state has so far not taken any steps in connection with this problem.”

“It is not possible to understand Prime Minister’s attitude. He has shown his intent. I do not expect democratic steps from a Prime Minister who tells his citizens to leave if they do not like the way things are. I am not surprised.” (BÇ/TK/TB)

Link