Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

[Haykakan]

Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

Turkey's turn to the east is a result of its faliure in the west. It failed to become a EU state after many years of trying thus it gave up on it and decided to look to the east (unfortunatly for us) for opportunities.

[Hyreniq]

Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

Turkey's turn to the east is a result of its faliure in the west. It failed to become a EU state after many years of trying thus it gave up on it and decided to look to the east (unfortunatly for us) for opportunities.

Turkey's turn to the east: do you mean to the Islamic world? If hat's what you mean; in my opinion this is all a political game that turkey is playing by wearing a mask on the face but with the same soul and the same blood. You can see their true colors buy how they're reacting to Syria's affairs. And after all who really runs Turkey?

[Artashes]

Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

TURKEY, FRANCE TO MEND TIES AFTER GENOCIDE ROW JUNE 22, 2012 01:28 AM

The Daily Star
June 22 2012
Lebanon

ANKARA: Turkey has agreed to restore all ties with France, Foreign
Minister Ahmet Davutoglu said Thursday, following a breakdown in
relations last year prompted by a simmering dispute over the 1915
mass killing of Armenians by Ottoman Turks.

Ankara canceled all economic, political and military meetings with
Paris in December after France's lower house of parliament voted
overwhelmingly in favor of a draft law to make it illegal to deny
that the killings amounted to genocide.

France's highest court overturned the law two months later but the
Turkish measures taken against France, which included restrictions on
French military aircraft and ships landing or docking on its territory,
have remained in place.

Speaking live on Turkish television, Davutoglu said Turkey's Prime
Minister Tayyip Erdogan had ordered the sanctions to be lifted after
a positive meeting with France's new President Francois Hollande at
a world summit in Brazil.

"The prime minister gave the necessary instructions after meeting with
Hollande. Because of this new attitude from France, these sanctions
will be dropped," he said during an interview with news broadcaster
CNN Turk.

Davutoglu said he would travel to Paris on July 5 for bilateral
meetings where they would discuss taking additional "positive steps"
in the future.

Relations between the countries became strained under former French
President Nicolas Sarkozy and his election defeat earlier this year
was viewed in Ankara as a chance to start a new phase.

Muslim Turkey accused the former French president, whose UMP party
put forward the bill, of trying to win the votes of 500,000 ethnic
Armenians in the two-round presidential vote on April 22 and May 6.

Sarkozy had also been one of the most vocal opponents of Turkish
European Union membership.

Armenia, backed by many historians and parliaments, says about 1.5
million Christian Armenians were killed in what is now eastern Turkey
during World War One in a deliberate policy of genocide ordered by
the Ottoman government.

Turkey says there was a heavy loss of life on both sides during the
fighting in which Armenian partisans supported invading Russian forces.

The Ottoman Empire collapsed after the end of the war, but successive
Turkish governments and the vast majority of Turks feel the charge
of genocide is a direct insult to their nation.

Exactly what I feared. This is why I and others have said : it is only us(Hay) that's going to remember,it is only us that's going to do the right thing.
A message to the entire fuxking world --- you cannot stop the truth ---
Artashes

[Artashes]

Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

Does anyone remember the discription of the words that come out of Gods mouth?
Try telling Him to shut up you worthless pieces of shxt.
Artashes

[Antifascist]

Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

Artashes and Mos,

Your ideology is not much different from Grey Wolves of Turkey. Full of discrimination and just based on nationalist/ethnic brotherhood.

You are even against me, someone who always speaks out against Turkish nationalism. You are against me just because I am Turkish.

For extreme right-winger people like you 'Only Armenians can be real 'brothers' of Armenians'. Just like the extreme right-wing Grey Wolves who say 'Only Turks can be 'brothers' of Turks.'

Why do you live your life based on discrimination ? Sad.

I spoke clearly. Turkey should apologise and accept the genocide. Compensation can be discussed. But border change ? Don't be crazy. So, if you think like that, how far back to the past does the whole world have to go ? So many borders would have to change then !!! I am not saying this from a 'Turkish perspective'. I am saying this as a realist.

So difficult to talk to a nationalist....Turkish, Bulgarian, Armenian, English, Zambian or whatever.

[Mos]

Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

Artashes and Mos,

Your ideology is not much different from Grey Wolves of Turkey. Full of discrimination and just based on nationalist/ethnic brotherhood.

You are even against me, someone who always speaks out against Turkish nationalism. You are against me just because I am Turkish.

For extreme right-winger people like you 'Only Armenians can be real 'brothers' of Armenians'. Just like the extreme right-wing Grey Wolves who say 'Only Turks can be 'brothers' of Turks.'

Why do you live your life based on discrimination ? Sad.

I spoke clearly. Turkey should apologise and accept the genocide. Compensation can be discussed. But border change ? Don't be crazy. So, if you think like that, how far back to the past does the whole world have to go ? So many borders would have to change then !!! I am not saying this from a 'Turkish perspective'. I am saying this as a realist.

So difficult to talk to a nationalist....Turkish, Bulgarian, Armenian, English, Zambian or whatever.

Where did you see my ideology being based on discrimination? Just Because I don't view Turks as "brothers" I'm using discrimination?

I think the first step would be an official apology from Turkish State and afterwards there to be some dialogue for opening some ties, opening border, and so forth. I don't think getting back all of Western Armenia is realistic either at this point, but what is realistic and very justified is compensation, though of course no sort of compensation can undo what the genocide did. Or you can choose the path of denial, create tension and hatred in the region, and have to face pressure from all different directions.

[davidoga]

Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

Where did you see my ideology being based on discrimination? Just Because I don't view Turks as "brothers" I'm using discrimination?

I think the first step would be an official apology from Turkish State and afterwards there to be some dialogue for opening some ties, opening border, and so forth. I don't think getting back all of Western Armenia is realistic either at this point, but what is realistic and very justified is compensation, though of course no sort of compensation can undo what the genocide did. Or you can choose the path of denial, create tension and hatred in the region, and have to face pressure from all different directions.

Mos,

Land compensation, IMO, is the only appropriate kind of compensation. Armenia is (or at least it should be) too proud to take money from Turkey. However, asking for sites literally on the border, such as Ararat and Ani, is reasonable. There are no Turks living here, so the concept of self-determination cannot be used. These sights mean nothing to Turkey, but everything to us.

However, this is only a reality if Turkey stops seeing Armenia as an enemy state. Therefore, opening of border and establishment of relations should a priority.

[Mos]

Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

Mos,

Land compensation, IMO, is the only appropriate kind of compensation. Armenia is (or at least it should be) too proud to take money from Turkey. However, asking for sites literally on the border, such as Ararat and Ani, is reasonable. There are no Turks living here, so the concept of self-determination cannot be used. These sights mean nothing to Turkey, but everything to us.

However, this is only a reality if Turkey stops seeing Armenia as an enemy state. Therefore, opening of border and establishment of relations should a priority.

The apology and border opening is the first priority. Of course, I would want land compensation and I think it's fully justified because we were cleansed and killed from our historic homeland. I just don't know how realistic land concessions would be at the current point given political situation.

A good amount of Turks want to eliminate Armenia and finish "off the job". We have to be very careful in dealing with Turks even when it comes to border opening (which isn't a concession from them, but an international obligation).

[hrai]

Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

The apology and border opening is the first priority. We have to be very careful in dealing with Turks even when it comes to border opening (which isn't a concession from them, but an international obligation).

This false border should remain closed until land reparations are made and even then the new border should be kept closed until a time when Armenia would be secure enough to allow it open.
I see no benefits from opening especially if land reparations improve Armenia's position.

[Artashes]

Re: Do you think Turkey has become a regional Leader?

Artashes and Mos,

Your ideology is not much different from Grey Wolves of Turkey. Full of discrimination and just based on nationalist/ethnic brotherhood.

You are even against me, someone who always speaks out against Turkish nationalism. You are against me just because I am Turkish.

For extreme right-winger people like you 'Only Armenians can be real 'brothers' of Armenians'. Just like the extreme right-wing Grey Wolves who say 'Only Turks can be 'brothers' of Turks.'

Why do you live your life based on discrimination ? Sad.

I spoke clearly. Turkey should apologise and accept the genocide. Compensation can be discussed. But border change ? Don't be crazy. So, if you think like that, how far back to the past does the whole world have to go ? So many borders would have to change then !!! I am not saying this from a 'Turkish perspective'. I am saying this as a realist.

So difficult to talk to a nationalist....Turkish, Bulgarian, Armenian, English, Zambian or whatever.

Once again you are wrong. It is you that spews nationalist turk crap under the guise of being friendly.
You have come to an Armenian site with the primary goal of pointing out that you are (?human?). Like all turks you say let's talk but no --- STOLEN --- land shall be given back. So it's not turkish national crap when you say : but we(turk) get to keep all that we've stolen by --- MURDERING --- the indigenous people's but I'm a far right wing nationalist by saying that was my families land not --- any --- turk. Standard turk crap subterfuge. You say you are all for recognition of AG in this post but in previous post you use words like maybe should and might be. Like all but one turk I've heard you claim no relation to the inhuman turks that committed these horrendous atrocities. You say you are going to tell us how you became more sensitive to Armenians (turkish atrocities) but you don't have time now but you have plenty of time to spew turk garbage.
I'm still waiting for how you became more sensitive.
You do not need to address me any more. I'm not interested in your plea to be recognized as a human or your phony crap or accusations .
An Armenian