The Ottomans

[ArmSurvival]

Re: The Ottomans

But I didn't mentioned human rights by saying they are weak.... I mentioned " In Ottoman and Seljuk age, they were weak-military,economy etc"

You said Persia was always weak. But thats fine.

As for the Seljuk age, sure the Persians were politically weak, but they had so much cultural influence over Arabs and Turks by influencing Islamic doctrines and culture.

I agree there are many cases of Armenian bravery. But collectively, if we just take the Ottoman seige and conquest of Cyprus in 1570-71, an army of 200,000 ottoman troops was assembled and shipped across the sea. An 11-month seige followed. The defenders were 7,000 strong and isolated. More than 50,000 ottoman military were killed until they conquered the island (let's leave the incredible bravery of the defenders to one side).

Just in that seige the Ottomans probably struggled more than Armenians did from 1375 to 1918.

You cannot use Ottoman military incompetance of the 16th century to justify the Ottomans' massacre of their own Armenian citizens during WWI.

You say it was a miracle that Cilicia survived that long. Instead of thinking about survival, isn't it better to think how much more powerful Cilicia could have become? The Ottomans when they crossed into the Balkans were surrounded by Bulgarians, Macedonians, Serbians, Albanians, Byzantines. Not only they 'survived', they ended up nearly taking Vienna.How did they do it?

Turks arrived on the scene when all the major powers were weakened through centuries of fighting. Most of the nations you named were small ones (Macedonians, Serbs, Albanians) or severely declining (Bulgarians and Byzantines). Its not as difficult to dominate nations when you almost always have numerical superiority through a steady migration of people from the Asian Steppes, and when all your enemies have ancient, bitter feuds and are divided as a result and are in decline. The fact that Turks were Muslims didn't hurt their relations with the entire Middle East and North Africa, either.

I don't see how you can compare Cilicia's situation with that of the Turks. Can you even name some similarities?

[xcelr8Armo]

Re: The Ottomans

thats great to hear, i didn't know that. They are much better of living in Europe or the US.

[Anoush]

Re: The Ottomans

There are Armenian organizations in the US that try to gather as many Armenians as possible from the Eastern part of Turkey to bring them over to Istanbul, then to bring them over to the US. Now that's a good thing. I'd prefer to see all the Armenians leaving Turkey and perhaps go to the Middle East, to Europe or to the US.

[xcelr8Armo]

Re: The Ottomans

If I was an Armenian living in Turkey, I wouldn't stay there for one more hour. I don't know why the hell there are so many Armenians still living in there. I know, I know they have buildings and businesses; but I would prefer to leave my things and go anywhere else in the world than stay there.

yeah i agree, sell everything and get out of there.

you never know you could pick up any sort of disease while living in Turkey

[Anoush]

Re: The Ottomans

argh now thats horrible. i feel sorry for those children

If I was an Armenian living in Turkey, I wouldn't stay there for one more hour. I don't know why the hell there are so many Armenians still living in there. I know, I know they have buildings and businesses; but I would prefer to leave my things and go anywhere else in the world than stay there.

[xcelr8Armo]

Re: The Ottomans

I am not kidding. I have heard about 2-3 months ago from a good source on another Armenian Forum. Someone posted it. It's not a joke, it's very sad but apparently it's true.

argh now thats horrible. i feel sorry for those children

[Anoush]

Re: The Ottomans

Really??? where from because thats just horrible

I am not kidding. I have heard about 2-3 months ago from a good source on another Armenian Forum. Someone posted it. It's not a joke, yes it's very sad and horrible; but apparently it's true.

[xcelr8Armo]

Re: The Ottomans

Jack, the problem is that they are mixed with their dna's that's true, but their mentality is very turkish. Meaning mostly they are of moslem religion and they are quite fanatic about it and they still have no tolerance or liking towards Christians. I am not saying that all are like that; but they've been ruled by and brought up that way by their government. Btw; in their schools, etc. etc.

I have heard from sources that they teach Armenian boys and girls that the Armenians committed genocide towards the turks and they make Armenian children feel very inferior and guilty. Now how much more inhuman that can be???? It's unheard of and very turkish like.
Armenian may enlighten me if he knows any better; but through the websites for several years now, that's what I have become to learn and know.

Really??? where from because thats just horrible

[Anoush]

Re: The Ottomans

no one says the turks are racist,in fact they couldnt be racist since they are mixed up various gens, less no one can say that a turk in gheneral bad or good it depends how he handles the armenian reality

Jack, the problem is that they are mixed with their dna's that's true, but their mentality is very turkish. Meaning mostly they are of moslem religion and they are quite fanatic about it and they still have no tolerance or liking towards Christians. I am not saying that all are like that; but they've been ruled by and brought up that way by their government. Btw; in their schools, etc. etc.

I have heard from sources that they teach Armenian boys and girls that the Armenians committed genocide towards the turks and they make Armenian children feel very inferior and guilty. Now how much more inhuman that can be???? It's unheard of and very turkish like.

Armenian may enlighten me if he knows any better; but through the websites for several years now, that's what I have become to learn and know.

[TXMENIAN]

Re: The Ottomans

Ben bişey atmıyorum canım, Türklerin Orta Asyalı olduğunu sende gayet iyi biliyorsun. Tanrı aşkına tüm Türkler kötü mü ??? Burada genelleme yapıyorlar.Bu apaçık ırkçılık değil mi her Türk Irkçı mı sanki



Turkish people don't support Hrant Dink's stupid racist murders. You can not generalize for all Turks.

bah dont be harsh, shes only trying to get her point across.

but yeah Anoush is right. I believe the turkish government did kill him

She needs to have respect for this place and stop speaking barbarian. This is the second time.