Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

[ashot24]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Azerbaijan Demonstrates Weekend Bluff and Double Standards

In a rare show of disrespect the president of Azerbaijan bluffed Russian president Dmitri Medvedev by leaving the St. Peteresburg Economic Summit and displaying a double standard. Ilham Alyiev participated in a peace summit initiated by the Russian president, confirmed his commitment to peace and withing hours his armed forces attacked Nagorno Karabakh defense lines in an attempt to resume the armed conflict, which if not contained will grow beyond its region.

The Fourteenth International Economic Forum in Saint-Petersburg was held last week. Among the guests and participants were leaders of many countries, including Serge Sargsyan, President of Armenia, and Ilham Aliyev, the President of Azerbaijan. Their Russian colleague Dmitry Medvedev performed as a mediator again to organize one more meeting between the Presidents of the two conflicting Caucasian countries. As a result of the meeting, the three leaders made a statement about their resolution to solve the Nagorno Karabakh problem in an exclusively peaceful way.

President of Azerbaijan Slams Russian President's Peace Effort

According to the official information of the Azerbaijani media, the primary goal of Aliyev’s visit to Saint-Petersburg was his participation in the Forum. However, right after the above-mentioned meeting, he hastily returned to Baku. The following events uncovered the reason for such a precipitation. The Armenian news agencies reported about deadly clashes that happened at the border of Azerbaijan and Nagorno Karabakh called Artsakh in Armenian. They led to four Armenian and one Azeri victims. It turned out a raiding detachment from Azerbaijan had broken into the territory of the breakaway region and attacked the Karabakh watch post during the patrol change. At the cost of human lives, the invaders were thrown away to their line.

It is clearly obvious that Aliyev was disappointed by the result of the negotiations with Sargsyan and Medvedev and hurried back home to demonstrate a power game. No doubt that such a serious clash had been thoroughly planned by the Azerbaijani government and that Aliyev controlled the operation. Such a conclusion suggests itself after even slight review of the Azerbaijani media Russian language reports. Apparently, trying to keep the image of a victim in the war and dove in politics before the world, in their English language sources, they omit the threats addressed to Nagorno Karabakh and Armenia and anti-Armenian fascist propaganda in general that has long since become their traditional style of the news presentation in Russian.

It is worth noting the fact that the Azerbaijani representatives got surprised at the honest coverage of the events by the Armenian media and officials that informed of the incident and number of victims. They must have been accustomed to the way they tell their people tall tales and seemed to find out the updates from the Armenian sources. Then, they hopefully focused on the warning from the Ministry of Defense of Nagorno Karabakh that “reiterates and warns Baku that Azerbaijan's any attempt to violate the NKR's security and destabilize the situation at the contact line will be retaliated.”

In this regard, it is impossible to disagree with the Armenian Parliament’s Vice-Speaker Samvel Nikoyan who thinks that under the conditions of Azerbaijan’s escalation, it is senseless to continue the negotiations with this country. More importantly, this could be the most opportune moment for Armenia to officially recognize Nagorno Karabakh Republic and to enter into a political, economic, and military alliance with it to legally save its population harmless from Azerbaijan’s feeble claims. This can prove the gravity of the situation for the international community.

Written by Ashot Vardanyan
Mr. Vardanyan is a fellow at the University of Iowa

Submitted by Armen Hareyan on 2010-06-19

http://www.huliq.com/1/2010-azerbaijan-demonstrates-weekend-bluff-and-double-standards

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President of Azerbaijan Slams Russian President's Peace Effort

Just hours after the trilateral meeting between the presidents of Armenia and Azerbaijan hosted by the Russian president, the army of Azerbaijan intruded the defense positions of Nagorno Karabakh and was repelled by the NKR armed forces.

Less than twenty four hours before the attack the president of Azerbaijan Mr. Ilham Aliyev was confirming hits commitment to the peace process and in a meeting with the Russian and Armenian presidents in St. Peteresburg. The official press release from Russian president's website informed that Armenia and Azerbaijan had registered a certain progress in the negotiations hosted by President Medvedev and "bridged" their positions in regard to the document known as Mardid Basic Principles.

Yet, there was something wrong. The leader of Azerbaijan who had earlier announced that the goal of his visit to St. Peteresburg was to take part in the Economic Forum and not the meeting with the Armenian president, abruptly left St. Peteresburg right after the meeting and did not attend even the opening ceremony of St. Peteresburg Economic Forum. This was already seen as something gone very wrong as it highlights the ignorance and the lack of respect toward the host country and its president by a neighboring country.

Then yesterday morning Azerbaijan's Foreign Ministry released a lukewarm statement about the meeting, which basically said that they "believe any meeting at the presidential level, especially with the Russian leader's participation, is important to find a solution to the Nagorno Karabakh conflict." Russia is one of the co-chair countries mediating the conflict over Nagorno Karabakh.

Withing hours of that statement, the armed forces of Azerbaijan attacked the Nagorno Karabakh position and intruded the defense lined, which is the result of a ceasefire signed in 1994. Facing a strong resistance they retreated. The armed intrusion left four Armenian and one Azeri soldiers dead.

This morning Azerbaijan confirmed the armed intrusion and announced the opposite of what its president announced yesterday in Russia in the pretense of the Russian and Armenian presidents. Azeri foreign ministry's spokesperson Elkhan Polukhov said any armed incidents in the conflict zone is a reminder that this conflict is not resolved yet and the war is not over. Never mind the fact that Azerbaijan has signed a ceasefire and also committed itself to only a peaceful resolution to the conflict when joining the Council of Europe and signing the Maendorf Statement near Moscow few years ago. Few minutes ago the press secretary of Azerbaijan's Defense Ministry Eldar Cabiroglu also confirmed the armed intrusion of the Nagorno Karabakh defense line and said if Armenia does not retreat from those territories it will receive a stronger and more forceful attack.

The situation looks like this. In Russia the leadership of Azerbaijan and its president commit themselves to the peaceful resolution of Karabakh conflict and once they return to Azerbaijan they start threats and in this case it ended with an intrusion and killing of 5 human lives. This is nothing less than spitting in the face of the Co-Chair countries and their presidents who actively support the peace process between Azerbaijan and Armenia.

When Azerbaijan demonstrates force and wants to speak with the people of Nagorno Karabakh from the point of view of war, how does one expect the people of Nagorno Karabakh to ever want to live with Azerbaijan in one country? Was it possible for Kosovo to live with Serbia in one country? It was equally not possible for Abkhazia and South Ossetia to live in one country after Georgia attacked South Ossetia in 2008 resulting their recognition as independent states by Russia and several other countries.

The president and the foreign minister of Armenia condemned nightly attack of the armed forces of Azerbaijan calling it a "treacherous attack in the veil of night typical to Azerbaijan." The foreign minister of Nalbandian said doing this Baku is trying to fail the peace talks as Madrid Principles lead to Nagorno Karabakh independence and Baku does not want to see Karabakh out of its control.

It is hard to determine where the negotiations will go from this point. Azerbaijan just made another move to completely destroy any trust between the people of Nagorno Karabakh and itself. Considering this fact, the quick resolution is to follow the path of Kosovo and recognize Nagorno Karabakh as an independent state as Azerbaijan shows no interest in real peace acting like an aggressor a day after committing itself to the peaceful resolution of the conflict. When Azerbaijan recognizes that too, then Armenia can consider returning the territories surrounding to Nagorno Karabakh and keeping the land access to it.

Written by Armen Hareyan
HULIQ.com

Submitted by Armen Hareyan on 2010-06-19

http://www.huliq.com/1/2010-president-azerbaijan-spits-face-russian-counterpart

[ashot24]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Strategy Defense of Azerbaijan. Hide that corpse among the dead
BY TIMES.AM AT 19 JUNE, 2010, 11:50 PM

BY Levon-Melik-Shahnazaryan
Ministry of Defence of the Republic of Armenia has spread information that is reported about the intrusion into the territory of Nagorno Karabakh sabotage and intelligence group of the armed forces of Azerbaijan. According to information received from the NKR Defense Army, “June 18 at 23.30 in the vicinity of the village Chily from Azerbaijan to the territory of Nagorno Karabakh infiltrated armed reconnaissance.” As a result of measures taken by the armed forces of the NKR Defense Army, the enemy advance was stopped. The enemy was removed, carried with them the dead and wounded, but leaving the territory controlled by Armenian soldiers destroyed one team member and ammunition. The Armenian side also has losses – four soldiers of Armenian lives covered up their homeland. Four of our men were wounded.

The information was immediately picked up by the Azerbaijani media. They tried to present it as a success of the Azerbaijani armed forces. In this case there is an interesting fact: the Ministry of Defence of Azerbaijan refuses to confirm the incident and could not comment on the Armenian side.

It might be expected that after the promulgation of the name of the Azerbaijani soldier, whose body remained on the Armenian side, Azerbaijan will comment this information. But normally talkative Head of Press Center of the Ministry of Defence of Azerbaijan Eldar Sabiroglu this time was like if the water in the mouth scored. They kept silence even after they received the message: the name of dead Azerbaijani soldier, who was called up for compulsory military service from Bilasuvar region of Azerbaijan, was Mubariz Agakerim oglu Ibragimov.

Azerbaijani news agency APA took the functions of the press center of Azerbaijan Defense Ministry reporting that Ibragimov was killed “repelling the attack with the armed forces of Armenia in the direction of the village Borsunlu Terter. In this APA combined, at least two absurd things: the political and logical. However, if the political absurdity – in the Martakert region, as well as all other areas of the NKR Defense Army servicemen are NKR – is a consequence of the political order, then the logical absurdity is an indicator of the level of thinking members of this agency. In her short information APA is telling about the “attack” NKR Defense Army detachment, and reporting about dead Azerbaijanis, whose body “remains controlled by the Armenians of the line of contact”!?

But let’s leave the journalists and try to understand the causes and consequences of the incident.

June 18 Azerbaijani newspaper “Bizim Yol” (“Our Road”) informed about the incident between the armed forces of Azerbaijan, stationed on the border with Nagorno Karabakh. According to the publication, in one of the units of Azerbaijan between Azerbaijani soldiers “there was the massacre, which resulted in killing seven soldiers. Almost immediately after the publication the Ministry of Defence of Azerbaijan has filed a lawsuit against the newspaper, accusing her of defaming the armed forces of Azerbaijan.

Practice shows, however, that such information is not born from nothing, and usually, after a day or two there are reports about the death of Azerbaijani soldiers “in the shelling from the Armenian side.” Years of conflict with Azerbaijan, have provided plenty of opportunities to explore the habits of an enemy. But this time in Baku decided to try a more sophisticated plan: hide the bodies among the corpses. And an armed raid was made whose only purpose was to create a buzz about the next collision.

The purpose of this “operation” is clear: the leadership of Azerbaijan, which is already experiencing serious difficulties in the appeal to youth, tries to hide from the public place of the republic in the armed forces of the crime. And they provoked armed clashes, as a result of which Azerbaijan is failing; we need to do just that. That was in early March 2008, when in the same area Martakert Armenian Azeri soldiers killed 12 Askerov, attempted to have his defensive post NKR Defense Army, so it was on March 4 this year, when soldiers of the Armenian Army, killed a group of six Azerbaijani commandos in the area of the Armenian Koti village of Tavush marz. Thus, in all probability, will be more than once, because the number of murders and suicides in the armed forces of Azerbaijan is steadily growing. I am sure that after each such incident in the armed forces of Azerbaijan, the Armenian side should be brought into a heightened state of alert.

However, the last violent incident is one more component, does not take into account that simply can not. Less than a day before the incident in the northern capital of Russia met the presidents of Russia, Armenia and Azerbaijan, which discussed the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict. Aliyev, in view of recent developments in the Middle East place in this meeting special hopes, left St. Petersburg disappointed. Dmitry Medvedev is clearly not succumbed to blackmail and Azerbaijan confirmed the strong position of Russia, as an impartial mediator in the conflict. This fact is so “upset” Ilham Aliyev that he left Russia, did not participate in the Economic Forum, who were the official reason for his visit to Russia. And the current conflict logically be regarded as blackmail of Azerbaijan, aimed not only against Russia but against the other two co-chairs of OSCE Minsk Group on Nagorno-Karabakh conflict.

The latest incident in the Martakert region was marked by the way, another feature supporting version of blackmail: the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Azerbaijan made his comments. An official spokesman Elkhan Polukhov said that the cause of the latest incident “lies in the continuing occupation of Azerbaijani lands.” Such an “explanation” of the administration of Azerbaijani soldiers to inevitable death could be attributed to the lack of intelligence and knowledge of geography at Polukhov, if not for his further comments. “This fact once again confirms that the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict is not frozen, as I would like to think the Armenian side,” said Polukhov clearly voicing instructions above.

What do think the Armenian side – not Polukhov a matter of mind. But that’s what they think, Baku visionaries Polukhov spoke quite frankly. And for this it is only to thank. Azerbaijan, at least in the near future, will not give up hope to occupy the Nagorno-Karabakh Republic. And our government and military policy should be designed with this in mind.

However, the Azerbaijani Foreign Ministry statement in no small measure unleashes the Armenian soldiers. Henceforth, the NKR Defense Army soldiers are moral and, more importantly, the legal right to shoot anything that moves in the immediate vicinity of the border Nagorno Karabakh. From the field mice and foxes, to soldiers and commanders of the armed forces of Azerbaijan. And already the case Abiyev and Mammadyarov explain to their populations causes many deaths among the Azerbaijani military.

Levon Melik-Shahnazaryan

P.S. But what has become known about the reaction of the Ministry of Defence of Azerbaijan on the clashes in the Martakert region of Nagorno Karabakh. Repeating the stupidity of the APA – The firing lasted for a long time, and the Armenians, having suffered losses, and went back – E. Sabiroglu immediately refuted himself and repeated the ideas contained in the statement of the Azerbaijani Foreign Ministry: “If Armenia does not depart from the occupied territories, and if you go to these provocation, it can get even more telling blows. Hereditary nomad Sabiroglu, for all his life only once approached to 8 km. to the boundary of Nagorno-Karabakh Republic, apparently believes that the attacking side takes the corpses as trophies. However, Sabiroglu indirectly admitted that the victims of Azerbaijanis in the latest incident, more than one M. Ibragimov. It is also an old “tradition” of the military Azerbaijan: it used to “count” the number of deaths of Armenians on the basis of its own losses. Sabiroglu phrase “Armenian side has reduced its losses” with absolute certainty indicates that perished from the Azerbaijani side is not less than five people, plus, the seven that were killed in the internal squabbles in the armed forces of Azerbaijan.

/Times.am/

http://times.am/2010/06/19/strategy-defense-of-azerbaijan-hide-that-corpse-among-the-dead/

[KarotheGreat]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

I was affected by this. All my support goes to the families of our heroes.

What's alarming here it's not the fact they attacked, it's the fact that we have so many loses. As well alarming, is the fact the it is I think obvious the only reason the Azeries attacked is to test our army's response and action, and if we compare this incident with the one back in March 2008, where heavy losses were inflicted on Azerbaijan and we got only two wounded, this incident results can be considered a success by the Azeri side, not because they managed to break our defense lines, but because they inflicted big losses on us.

However, information in this is too little. I am waiting for a more wide report on the incident, there must be a really good reason to why we had 4 dead soldiers, and even though we made the Azeries retreat with our strong resistance, they only have one dead soldier. It just doesn't sound logic to me

I think the problem is that this happened in the middle of the night and the soldiers weren't expecting to encounter the enemy. And I wonder how many soldiers have died on the Azeri side. The only thing we know is that they have abandoned one body.

I think we should put more snipers and now shoot to kill, over each one of our men we should kill at least 10 of them.

[ninetoyadome]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

azeris keep contradicting themselves.

Armenia, Azerbaijan clashes kill at least four
Sunday, June 20, 2010
YEREVAN - Agence France-Presse

Armenian and Azerbaijani troops have clashed in the heaviest fighting in months over the disputed Nagorno-Karabakh region, leaving at least four Armenian soldiers dead, officials said Saturday.

With tensions rising between the rival nations, Armenia’s defense ministry said in a statement that four soldiers had been killed and four wounded after Azerbaijani forces attacked late Friday. The ministry also claimed an Azerbaijani soldier had been killed.

Azerbaijani defense ministry spokesman Eldar Sabıroğlu confirmed the fighting had taken place but blamed Armenian forces for the attack and said Yerevan was understating its losses. “Armenian armed forces breached the cease-fire. They have lost even more soldiers than they admit,” he said, refusing to comment on casualties among Azerbaijani soldiers.

Armenian President Serge Sarkisian condemned the incident as a “cowardly provocation,” noting that it occurred almost immediately after he met Thursday with Azerbaijani President Ilham Aliyev for talks in St. Petersburg mediated by Russian President Dmitry Medvedev.

“Provocations are unacceptable, and the recent cowardly provocation is even more unacceptable as it came just hours after the meeting held under Russia’s mediation,” Sarkisian said in a statement.

Nagorno-Karabakh is an enclave in Azerbaijan that has been under Armenian control since the end of a six-year conflict that left some 30,000 people dead and displaced approximately 1 million prior to a 1994 truce. The territory’s unilateral independence is not recognized by the international community.

International mediators have been pushing since 2007 for the two sides to agree to the Madrid principles, a deal that would see Armenian forces withdraw from areas surrounding Nagorno-Karabakh, international peacekeepers deployed in the region, refugees granted the right to return and an eventual vote on the region’s status.

Aliyev earlier this month threatened to withdraw from foreign-backed peace talks after he accused Armenia of stalling the negotiations.

Azerbaijan’s foreign ministry accused Armenia of provoking the recent violence by delaying negotiations. “There is a fairly simple way to avoid armed conflict. It is to sit down at the negotiating table and continue working on the basis of the updated Madrid principles,” Azerbaijani foreign ministry spokesman Elkhan Polukhov said.

“Azerbaijan will never reconcile itself with the occupation of its territories,” Polukhov added. “The Armenian-Azerbaijani conflict over Nagorno-Karabakh is not frozen, as the Armenian side would like to think.”



and then yesterday

Azerbaijani MFA representative Elhan Polukhov made a statement on Azerbaijani and Karabakh armed forces conflict on the contact line, thus unveiling the real aims of Azerbaijani side’s attack last night.

“Such incidents are evidence that the Nagorno Karabakh conflict is not frozen as the Armenian side wanted. Today there is a possibility to put an end to such armed conflicts if the Armenian side sits at the negotiations table and continues constructive work to carry out principles reflected in the updated variant of Madrid principles,” Polukhov said.

[KarotheGreat]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Russia regrets Karabakh incident

“We express our deep regret over the incident. A particularly regrettable fact is that people were killed in the incident,” Spokesman for the RF Foreign Ministry Andrei Nesterenko told NEWS.am.

He noted that Russia will give a comprehensive assessment of the incident within a day. “The incident is a serious one, I have seen the statement of Mr. Nalbadian but I do not have details yet,” he said.

On June 18, at 11:30 p.m. an Azerbaijani reconnaissance detachment intruded into Nagorno-Karabakh from Azerbaijan, an NKR Defense Army operational report says. The trespasser Azerbaijanis could intrude into the north-eastern section of the NKR-Azerbaijani contact line, killing 4 Armenian soldiers and wounding 4 others, the NKR Defense Army press service reports. The enemy retreated, leaving one soldier killed and ammunition.

On June17, an Armenian-Azerbaijani-Russian presidential meeting was held in Saint Petersburg.
source: http://news.am/eng/news/22810.html

It seems that the Russian aren't happy at all and I want to see how the rest will react.

[UrMistake]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Hope Russia and Europe see more clearly what is going on.. i w8 to see what and how they will express them selves..for what they are letting to happen closing there eyes.

[ashot24]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

I found this interesting picture:

From left to right: Robert Qocharyan, Monte Melqonyan, Bako Sahakyan, Samvel Babayan

[AstalaVist]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

Azerbaijan, Baku, June 21 / Trend K.Zarbaliyeva /

The Armenian armed forces attacked the Azerbaijani troops today.

The Armenian armed forces once again violated the ceasefire near the Ashaghi Abdulrahmanli village in the Fizuli region and went on the offensive June 21 at 1:45 a.m., the Azerbaijani Defense Ministry reported.

Nineteen-year-old Azerbaijani soldier Elgun Shukurov, who was enlisted to military service in January 2009 from the Jalilabad Military Commissariat, was killed in the crossfire.

trend.az

[Haykakan]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

I was hoping for bigger losses then that but i am glad they did something in retaliation for the azeri offencive the other night. This is from the azeri news source though so who knows what the facts are.

[ArmeniaR]

Re: Nagorno-Karabagh: Military Balance Between Armenia & Azerbaijan

This is from the azeri news source though so who knows what the facts are.

Indeed. I know almost for sure they got more losses....