Turkey's challenge to the Armenians

[Tongue]

Well, there are graves of many murdered Turkish citizens though. They were murdered by the Armenians, and Turkish Government holds and shares those documents (archives) with all the the nations who want to know the real TRUTH...

So no nation in the world is interested in your TRUTH? Why is that? ahhh Armenian lobbying groups!! Why did I even ask.

First of all, anything that happens between two countries happen for economic interests. Let's say that Turkiye accepts the so-called genocide claims: then there is a big peace of cake for the Armenian government. Turkiye will have to pay a huge amount of compensation money to the Armenian govt'. That is not fair!!! Not fair to Turkish people, and not fair to Armenian citizens who deserve to know the truth of history. Money is the evil in between.

A person fould guilty for murder pays the price. A person who steals someone's property pays it back + a penalty. Why should this be any different?

Ottomans always had treated Armenians fairly, and this fact is well known by Turkish and Armenian historians.

riiiiiiight... fairly.

Why is all this anger and hostility?

I wonder why...

PLEASE DO NOT BECOME THE TOYS OF THE WEST...

Please don't become a parrot and repeat what the rest of your people are taught to repeat. "Toys of the west". hahaha

We have lived together for hundreds of years,

yes, so??

and we will live for many thousands to come.

Is that why your country closed its border with Armenian and put economic blockade on Armenian??

Be open minded, literate and welcoming.

Funny how a person who referred to the genocide as "the so-called genocide" knows the meaning of the term "open minded".

Vengance is not always the best path to take. If it was, then the Turks have lot of revenge on many countries. Millions of Turks were killed brutally during WWI, and why don't we claim for genocide? Because it was done by more than one nation (oh, they dont have a name for that???)? Or because it all happened by the heat of the war?

You don't claim genocide, because no one decided to end the presense of the Turkish race from their lands.

Please consider the fact that we can live in peace no matter what happened a century ago.

You mean after you recognize the truth? Sure we'll try...

If we can forgive what was done to us

enlighten us... what was done to you?

then the Armenians should also be able to forgive and move forward. Being forgiving is not a privilage; it is a virtue.

How can we prevent future genocides if we forgive and forget the ones from the past? There is no forgive and forget... not until justice is served.

Let's get compassionate about peace and the beautiful sides of our lives; not with hostility and endless anger.

YOU have to take the first step.

[UKTurk]

To be honest I think the Armenians on this forum are generally supprisingly very tolerent towards the Turks.

I say this because I know what it can be like. Not to the same scale the Armenians suffered. If I was a Armenian I might be extremely hostile to all Turks.

[Hovik]

Anatoliandream,
Please also refer to Peter Balakians book "The Burning Tigris: The Armenian Genocide and America's response" which further documents the existance of mass graves in both text and some very powerful pictures...

By they way I agree that there probably have been Turkish graves discovered... who may have been killed by Armenians. Did it ever occur to you that these could be Turkish soldiers who were killed by Armenian defenders while executing orders to massacre Armenians?

Don't be so naive, don't be a regurgitative tool of your governments propaganda - don't let them use you like this... it's sad.

[Reincarnated Am]

Are you saying my grandparents and all of other's grandparents or grand grandparents, every eyewitness who survived the massacres are liars?
You guys don’t realize what an insult it is to an Armenian every time one of you say it’s a lie, or it never happened, it’s like insulting our dead Grandparents over and over again. Do you know how much I respected and honored them just because they wanted to survive just so they can tell about the hardship and the massacres that they have to endure? Every time someone says it’s all lies my blood just boils!!!!!

Take a very good look at this photo, these were Fathers, Brothers, Cousins, Sons, Friends or a relatives of someone or somebody, see how were they killed and how humiliatingly they were exposed, as they were trophies. Have some respect, how much proof you need to respect what we were saying since 90 something years????

[1.5 million]

Very nice response Tongue. I imagine that we could take a few of these Turkey's posts and reassemble the Armenain Genocide denial lesson plan - grades 1-12 that they have been pushing over there - most sad.

Yeah UK Turk....next time you consider things as you stated perhaps you will hold yoru trap shut more...and perhaps - if you think about it - you might understand that wwhile most Armenians do not and did not support ASALA - we might be lying just a bit if we said that we didn't feel perhaps just a wee bit of satisfaction for every denialist Turkish Government bastard that they brought down...

[UKTurk]

Yeah UK Turk....next time you consider things as you stated perhaps you will hold yoru trap shut more...and perhaps - if you think about it - you might understand that wwhile most Armenians do not and did not support ASALA - we might be lying just a bit if we said that we didn't feel perhaps just a wee bit of satisfaction for every denialist Turkish Government bastard that they brought down...

So according to the fact that you "claim" that if you deny Genocide you are basically commiting the Genocide. I guess that means if you are happy by the actions of Terrorists YOU ARE A TERRORIST.

[Hovik]

Whoever was the uninformed esh that is clueless about Armenian Mass Graves, why don't you consider this quote from Henry Rigg's memoirs(DAYS OF TRAGEDY IN ARMENIA: Personal Experiences in Harpoot 1915-1917). He was an AMERICAN doctor in Kharbert (Turkish: Elizag), this is what his book has to say:

"Riggs heard the firsthand reports of several reliable eyewitnesses who observed mass graves of Armenians outside Harpoot. These included the local American consul Leslie A. Davis and his colleague Dr. Henry Atkinson. He concluded that the abuses and murder of Armenians were too persistent to be dismissed as simple aberrations of a purportedly benign policy of population transfer. "

Get the FULL TEXT HERE

Since you don't trust Armenian sources, why don't you at least READ 3rd party eyewitness accounts that describe these things. I can't believe this society is so tunnel-visioned by it's government. Even if the Genocide didn't happen (and I know it did) Turks could NEVER prove their point because they never study the accounts of eyewitnesses (particularly non-Armenian, non-Turkish eyewitnesses). That is your biggest mistake. But it isn't really a mistake because we all know WHY you don't study (and actively IGNORE) these accounts: They prove the Armenian Genocide occurred.

[1.5 million]

So according to the fact that you "claim" that if you deny Genocide you are basically commiting the Genocide. I guess that means if you are happy by the actions of Terrorists YOU ARE A TERRORIST.

Sorry bud - but actively denying genocide is properly understood to be perpetuating it as part of genocide is erasing the culture and the facts concerning the eradication of it - which is exactly what you are doing - it is an active component of genocide. I and others who may feel as I do - do not condone these acts (as ASALA had done) - as such violent acts are unregulated - may harm others and are not carried out lawfully - even if we might just get the smallest amount of satisfaction that indeed a blow has been struck against a fundementally evil establishment that is actively engaged in perpetuation of Genocide of our people and who sheilds and protects those - the reputations of those etc - who were responsible for the murders of my family members.

Now think again why I moght have cause to hate you - even if just a little....

[UKTurk]

If you hate me its because your hate all Turks regardless of who they are. Oh by the way I am not denying the Genocide as I have repeated several times on this forum. You have basically wrongfully accused me of Genocide denial. Also you contradict yourself by saying that you dont condone Terrorist attacks but at the same time you get satisfaction by the results of their(the terrorists) actions....you basically do support them if not actively, you show at least tacit support.

[1.5 million]

I don't condone terrorist attacks and I don't hate Turks - OK - not even you. I only asked might you not understand why I (or Armenians in general) might have cause to hate you. I am and always have been an opponent of ASALA and their tactics - however I make a distinction that is an admission of an occasional degree of emotional satisfaction over some of the results - in the context of my frustration over Turkish government denial and its shameful efforts to squelch the truth. And I shoudl also add that while I never condone terrorism I can understand when factions resort to its use for a variety of reasons...