Armenian lesbians/gays

[Flamenkita]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

Great story babe. Now get in the kitchen and make me a sandwich.



Before you get your feathers all ruffled, that was a joke .

And that joke begs the response, "What have you done for me lately?"

See? That's exactly how it happens. If you make everything into a transaction, you, too, end up participating in your own demise.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

And that joke begs the response, "What have you done for me lately?"

See? That's exactly how it happens. If you make everything into a transaction, you, too, end up participating in your own demise.

Isn't that the premise of flirting?

[Flamenkita]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

Isn't that the premise of flirting?

My 8 year old daughter already knows that when a boy gives you a hard time it's probably because he likes you and resents it that you make him feel that way...

[KanadaHye]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

My 8 year old daughter already knows that when a boy gives you a hard time it's probably because he likes you and resents it that you make him feel that way...

Well she's close... I give all women a hard time, I've found it brings out the best in them. I can get along with even the stone coldest of b!tches and make them smile because I know deep down inside there used to be a happy little girl.

[Flamenkita]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

Well she's close... I give all women a hard time, I've found it brings out the best in them. I can get along with even the stone coldest of b!tches and make them smile because I know deep down inside there used to be a happy little girl.

And believe it or not, when people meet me in person they have a hard time believing that I'm actually as nice and as funny as I am. It's happened a gazillion times.

Don't lie. Even you thought my Bourdj Hammoud krapar was cute... huh?

[ADandelion]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

America didn't know that women had orgasms until Dr. Ruth the Hrya witch doctor

Wait... women have orgasms?

D8 No way!

[ADandelion]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

Well she's close... I give all women a hard time, I've found it brings out the best in them. I can get along with even the stone coldest of b!tches and make them smile because I know deep down inside there used to be a happy little girl.

Depends. Some women get broken down, worn away. Others rise to meet the challenge and love doing do. Seen it happen either way, and it mostly depends on the type of person they are, not on what they perceive the intent of the person giving them a hard time to be.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

I was raised in the US. My parents were profoundly restrictive of me until I left for college. And I arrived at college with hardly any experience in the realm of dating or even just friendship with men. And it was as if I was thrown to the wolves. There I was. Young, attractive, intelligent, and absolutely clueless as to how to interpret others' intentions. Of course I fell in with some "bad boys", but mostly I blame my own naivety for that. And for that, I blame my parents who didn't give me adequate preparation for some of the most important things in life. I also didn't have siblings, so no role models. I had to pretty much figure it out on my own. And I did. But it took a long time, and lots of bad choices.

The worst thing parents can do to their children is to shelter them too much and then send them out into the world. The second piece, the going out into the world, is inevitable nowadays. But the first part, the adequate preparation for social and relational things, is part of a parent's job, unless they are living in a tight traditional environment where people have no choice but to fall into step with everyone else. But if you are raising your children in the US and expect them to make lives for themselves in the US, then you have to prepare them for that.

Ok... but... uhm... there are tons of women here in Canada that come from India for school and they seem to have no problems keeping their traditions. They come here for school, get an education and then go back home and get married. It's not like they don't go out to bars either, it's just that they know they aren't supposed to put themselves in the type of situations you describe. Just because you're living in the U.S. doesn't mean you have to subscribe to their poor social habits and culture.

When in Rome do as the Romans?

[ArmSurvival]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

@ArmSurvival. First of all, I think I'm considerably older than you, and second, I am a practicing clinical psychologist. So, even if I haven't seen things or experienced things first hand, I have talked with enough people and worked with enough people to know what the problems are and what potential solutions are.

Then you should know what I’m saying is generally true. The guy who acts nice to the girl usually gets shot down when he asks her on a date. In the rare case he gets the date, he has to wait months and months to have a real physical exchange with her, if at all. Take that same girl and have her go out with a moderately successful athlete, DJ, actor, or just a regular guy who is a jerk to her, and watch how quickly she will go all the way with him. Not every girl is like this, but I’ve seen this story happen a million times.

With odar girls I don’t hold back on treating them like crap, simply because they come from completely different circles so there is no risk of having a negative reputation. At the same time, I’ve tried to be nice to Armenian girls even though it goes against my better judgment, partly because we will usually have mutual acquaintances and I don’t want to ruffle any feathers. You wouldn’t believe how many times I’ve played nice with these Armenian girls because they came from good families and good circles, and were generally intelligent women. I never got anywhere treating them nice, not with a single one of them. And not only did I get nowhere with them, they were the ones who ended up treating me like crap.

In fact just recently, the last “nice” Armenian girl I was seeing actually went on a date with another guy while she and I were already going out for over a month, and I know this because she told me about it shortly after it happened. She even admitted to kissing him (who knows what else happened). To top it off, every couple of weeks she would give me indirect threats in the form of casually telling me that some guy asked her out and she had to turn him down because she was going out with me. She was acting like she was doing me such a big favor

She treated me like this despite the fact I would drive nearly an hour to pick her up after my work ended, paid for dinners & drinks (its not cheap and I don’t make tons of money), and offered to take her to a bunch of fun places, which in her defense she never really took advantage of because she was a mellow type of girl. She isn’t some stiletto-wearing, fake nails Armenian party girl. She lives a relatively quiet life. She graduated as a straight-A student from one of the top 10 universities in the country. She lived on her campus for a couple years and had been thoroughly exposed to the outside world. We had many great conversations and we made each other laugh frequently. She’s great with children. I know a lot of her friends and they’re normal people, and she comes from a functional family. So you see, when you act nice to girls, even the good, normal Armenian girls will lay these types of indirect threats on you. The threat is basically - Don’t make any mistakes because I have 10 guys lined up to take your place. It’s the power of choice that makes these regular girls get drunk with power and act stupid.

After I found out about her going out with the other guy I pretty much lost enthusiasm for the relationship even though I didn’t make a big deal out of it (gotta keep the tough persona). Shortly afterwards she broke off the relationship without even giving me a reason, although the reason is obvious. She told me, you’re such a great guy that you don’t deserve to be with someone who doesn’t feel 100% for you. Haha… I’m better off without her bullsh*t in my life. What a waste though, she had all the characteristics of being a great wife and mother, except for the fact that she also acts like a typical American tr*mp. We were very friendly about the break-up because of our mutual acquaintances, but obviously I have no respect for her.

After that ordeal, just a couple of months back, I met another cute, smart Armenian girl who I had a lot of mutual acquaintances with. We spontaneously ended up going out in a big group, and she and I somehow gravitated towards each other (more like I was enjoying myself and she kept coming by me). We talked, we laughed, and so on. I was being interesting enough without knocking down her self-esteem. Towards the end she hinted that she wanted my phone number to meet up sometime, so I thought great. A few days later I sent her a very casual text, no response. A few days after that I sent another text, again I got no response. I sent a third text, no response. Yup, that’s the last time I’m playing nice with Americanized Armenian girls, I don’t care if it’s a Der Hayr’s daughter who spends her free time helping blind old ladies change their messy diapers. These were just my recent experiences; you don’t even want to hear my prior experiences which were 10X worse than what I just described. The common theme I realized was the nicer I treated them, the worse they treated me. And all these girls had one thing in common, which was having a lot of male friends and male options.

But somehow when I treat odar girls like crap, there is very little resistance, very little work, they show me a lot of respect and I get maximum results with minimum effort. Must be just a coincidence, right doc? It has nothing to do with f*cked up American female mentality, right?

You can't simply reduce it to "a nice guy who gets screwed by party girls". I know just as many women who have been "forced into celibacy" because of a lack of decent men. In fact, it is kind of surprising to me to hear you say that women have all the control. That just simply is not true.

I’m not denying there are many decent women who are frustrated from lack of good options. The difference is that those women still have SOME options while guys in the same situation usually have NO options. Those women who you claim are forced into celibacy could still have sex if they weren’t being so picky. The guys who are forced into celibacy don’t have the luxury of being picky; they can set their standards as low as possible and they still wouldn’t get anything. That’s the difference I’m trying to highlight.

If you don’t believe what I’m saying just try a simple experiment. Sign up on a dating site. Create a profile of a handsome guy and put some good information about him in there. It will take you months just to get 1 or 2 inquiries. Then create a profile of a fat woman who has 3 kids. You will get a lot more action being the fat woman.

I was raised in the US. My parents were profoundly restrictive of me until I left for college. And I arrived at college with hardly any experience in the realm of dating or even just friendship with men. And it was as if I was thrown to the wolves. There I was. Young, attractive, intelligent, and absolutely clueless as to how to interpret others' intentions. Of course I fell in with some "bad boys", but mostly I blame my own naivety for that. And for that, I blame my parents who didn't give me adequate preparation for some of the most important things in life. I also didn't have siblings, so no role models. I had to pretty much figure it out on my own. And I did. But it took a long time, and lots of bad choices.

Now tell me: During that entire time, weren’t you also approached by guys you knew for a fact were good, responsible guys, but you rejected them because you thought they were not as exciting as the bad boys? I bet you knew the risks involved with going out with a certain type of personality and yet you took the risk, had your fun and then got burned. I’m 99% sure that was the case, and if it wasn’t then you’re in the minority of women. Plus, you're from a different generation so your experience is rather irrelevant to what I'm talking about. It wasn't so bad in your time. Its gotten a lot worse.

The worst thing parents can do to their children is to shelter them too much and then send them out into the world. The second piece, the going out into the world, is inevitable nowadays. But the first part, the adequate preparation for social and relational things, is part of a parent's job, unless they are living in a tight traditional environment where people have no choice but to fall into step with everyone else. But if you are raising your children in the US and expect them to make lives for themselves in the US, then you have to prepare them for that.

I think Armenian parents need to be way more open with their children than they have been, with boys as well as with girls. I know many guys who are under the impression that earning enough money for luxuries is adequate for securing a satisfying relationship with a woman. And when this doesn't come to pass, they are angry at the women rather than at their own parents who failed to prepare them for life in the real world. Consequently, Armenian mothers give their daughters mixed messages all the time. On the one hand, they tell them that it's important to be independent and get an education, and then turn around and tell them that it's important to marry a man with a lucrative job. So, women go to school and acquire higher levels of education. On the other hand, they are looking to "marry well". But then, they realize that the amount of material comfort that might have satisfied their mothers isn't going to satisfy them. In fact, no amount of material wealth can be satisfactory, but they don't seem to ever come to that conclusion. So, they go looking for more, bigger, better, brighter, shinier, newer, faster. None of it keeps its meaning. And it's a shame because at the same time, the men are being taught that if they can provide these material things to their women, they can be assured of a happy life, a happy marriage, and sex on a regular basis. But this doesn't work out because the women are never impressed, never satisfied. And, the really horrible thing that happens among Armenian women is the competition they are in with each other. Siranoush has a new Mercedes. Maralig wants one. Hagop took Mariam to Cancun for her birthday. Nazeli is upset and won't have sex with Garo because he just started a new business and doesn't have the money just now for a vacation. But none of it is meaningful because the foundation is wrong.

I actually agree with most of what you’re saying here. I think the focus on getting money & material goods comes from the fact that the last 2 generations of Armenians lived in abject poverty and had very little opportunities to improve their lives. So when they come to a place like America they want to make sure their kids take advantage of every opportunity.

I think the tendency to shelter their kids comes from the fact that they’re not familiar with western societies. The typical Armenian parents’ mentality seems to be “better safe than sorry”.

Maybe it's going to take another generation or two. But the problem is systemic and everybody plays a part in it. And when people like me come in and say, hold on, look at the part you play in the crisis and then look at other people's contributions, I end up being vilified. I know what the crisis is. I understand it from a personal level, and intellectual level, a cultural level, and a professional level. And I know that the solutions are not going to come easily and without every single individual doing their own self-examination.

I agree with a lot of what you have to say about Armenian family dynamics. Not necessarily everything, but most things. I mainly disagree with your opinions on male-female dynamics and about females getting a free pass on their stupid behavior.

[KanadaHye]

Re: Armenian lesbians/gays

My suggestion is don't waste your time with Americanized women. They aren't even worth 5% of the effort. It's like going fishing with a tackle box full of fancy lures and bait expecting to feed the village then putting your rod in a lake full of crappie. Save your money, travel, invest in yourself and most importantly.... don't fall prey to the chase.

My suggestion for Americanized women is best of luck. If you're training men to be dogs, don't expect them to turn out to be men.