The Ottomans

[lampron]

Re: The Ottomans

Armenians (generally speaking)are not good at working together. I have plenty of personal experience with this aspect of my people. Petty jealousies etc.. stand in the way of well organized anything and this is perhaps our biggest downfall as a nation. Armenians are more of a 1v1 type of people vs the Turck who are more of a pack mentality. To succeed as a nation you must have strong organizational structures and the people have to have faith in these structures..such a scenario has never existed for us Armenians.

In the Ottoman empire and Russian empire the Turks and Tatars were usually suspicious of foreigners but they trusted each other. The Armenians were the opposite

[Eddo211]

Re: The Ottomans

for 300 or 400 years after the Seljuk Turks showed up, Armenians were a majority in the traditional areas. If they fought hard (as you believe) then the Seljuks, then the ottomans should have lost

Are you talking about the general population of Armenians in the Ottoman Empire? Armenians had no surviving strong leadership anymore at that time and the pockets of resistance could only do so much. Armenian men of fighting age were not free to organize.
There is a reason why Armenian military unites were never dismantled after Armenia was conquered by Empires, because they were good at it....in Ottoman they served the Ottoman military.

Armenia was not little. the ottomans invested vast amount of organization, energy, money, human effort in administration, military campaigns, trade, diplomacy over many centuries!

what did Armenians do during this time?

What did they do? they built the Ottoman empire for them.

Also Armenia was not that big.....Turks had bigger problems to the West.

The result? Turkey is sitting on one of the best real estates in the world!

Turkey is sitting on lands taken from others......little do they know these strategic lands are cursed and soaked with the blood of peasants and innocent.

[Haykakan]

Re: The Ottomans

Armenians (generally speaking)are not good at working together. I have plenty of personal experience with this aspect of my people. Petty jealousies etc.. stand in the way of well organized anything and this is perhaps our biggest downfall as a nation. Armenians are more of a 1v1 type of people vs the Turck who are more of a pack mentality. To succeed as a nation you must have strong organizational structures and the people have to have faith in these structures..such a scenario has never existed for us Armenians.

[lampron]

Re: The Ottomans

Like I said, in an equal battle (1 Armenian vs 3 Turks)....I didn't mean when Armenians were overwhelmed.....also as hard as it for them you must remember Armenians had already fought many ancient battles of survival, conquered, slaved, fought for freedom, lost many warrior blood lines before Turks ever showed up at our doorsteps.

for 300 or 400 years after the Seljuk Turks showed up, Armenians were a majority in the traditional areas. If they fought hard (as you believe) then the Seljuks, then the ottomans should have lost

Ottoman dreams have been crushed and will never return, other Turkic countries do not support it....and little Armenia as always stands in the way.
.

Armenia was not little. the ottomans invested vast amount of organization, energy, money, human effort in administration, military campaigns, trade, diplomacy over many centuries!

what did Armenians do during this time?

The result? Turkey is sitting on one of the best real estates in the world!

[Eddo211]

Re: The Ottomans

you are mistaken! Armenians lost battles against Seljuks, Turkmens, Ottomans 900, 800, 700, 600 years ago, or they just didn't fight any more. Many joined the ottomans. Human beings are attracted to successful empires! Why did Armenians lose? No Armenian has written a book about this subject!

Like I said, in an equal battle (1 Armenian vs 3 Turks)....I didn't mean when Armenians were overwhelmed.....also as hard as it for them you must remember Armenians had already fought many ancient battles of survival, conquered, slaved, fought for freedom, lost many warrior blood lines before Turks ever showed up at our doorsteps.

Monte was highly exceptional. How many diaspora Armenians went to battle? Maybe 20. Out of 2 million!

Monte was an Armenian....diaspora has nothing to do with it.

In the early periods, yes. Mehmed the conqueror invited Armenians to Constantinople after he captured the city. Many Armenians became Muslims, not all by force. Armenians do not trust each other and do not respect one another. The ottomans (and Muslims in general) are very welcoming to people from other religions who convert into Islam. Human beings like to be treated with respect! This is normal

Empire builders are cunning. Aggression has been around since the beginning of time. If you are united, you can fight back.The ottomans had a big dream - to take Europe. What was the Armenian dream? Does anyone know?

Ottoman dreams have been crushed and will never return, other Turkic countries do not support it....and little Armenia as always stands in the way.
What were Armenians dreams?....live and respect for other nations however location made that into a battle of survival, long before Turks were hatched from the belly of Shewolf Adena.

[lampron]

Re: The Ottomans

Armenians won the war against all odds, that is what matters.....another thing that matters is that Armenians have always won against Turks in fair battle.

you are mistaken! Armenians lost battles against Seljuks, Turkmens, Ottomans 900, 800, 700, 600 years ago, or they just didn't fight any more. Many joined the ottomans. Human beings are attracted to successful empires! Why did Armenians lose? No Armenian has written a book about this subject!

Armenians won because of men like Monte....Azerbaijan had all the external supports.

Monte was highly exceptional. How many diaspora Armenians went to battle? Maybe 20. Out of 2 million!

Armenians were slautered in large numbers in Ottoman Empire....Christianity and their strong culture maintained their identity.

In the early periods, yes. Mehmed the conqueror invited Armenians to Constantinople after he captured the city. Many Armenians became Muslims, not all by force. Armenians do not trust each other and do not respect one another. The ottomans (and Muslims in general) are very welcoming to people from other religions who convert into Islam. Human beings like to be treated with respect! This is normal

Yes, Turks are more cunning than any other race.....after all, they beat us with stolen Christian babies raised as Muslim warriors. Even though outnumbered and facing hoards of Borgs, they manage to maintain a Kingdom up to 14th century in a sea of evil.

Empire builders are cunning. Aggression has been around since the beginning of time. If you are united, you can fight back.The ottomans had a big dream - to take Europe. What was the Armenian dream? Does anyone know?

[Eddo211]

Re: The Ottomans

Armenians nearly lost the war in 1992 when some elements in Russia started supporting Baku.

Armenians won the war against all odds, that is what matters.....another thing that matters is that Armenians have always won against Turks in fair battle.

In 1992 how did the Armenian diaspora stop a potential disaster in Karabakh ?

One word....Will

Slaves don't believe in themselves. They are reliant on external support!

Armenians won because of men like Monte....Azerbaijan had all the external supports.

The Turks say they are 7,000 years old, more ancient than Armenians!

I believe them.....however it wasn't until Adena that raped a man that they were hatched into xxxkurts.

Armenians assimilated in large numbers during the Ottoman empire.

Armenians were slautered in large numbers in Ottoman Empire....Christianity and their strong culture maintained their identity.

Slaves have a very low opinion of other slaves. In the Ottoman empire Armenians were very disrespectful of other Armenians
Ottomans welcomed anyone who joined them and become Muslims. That is how they became stronger and stronger!

Yes, Turks are more cunning than any other race.....after all, they beat us with stolen Christian babies raised as Muslim warriors. Even though outnumbered and facing hoards of Borgs, they manage to maintain a Kingdom up to 14th century in a sea of evil.

[lampron]

Re: The Ottomans

Turks still think in two dimensions.....Armenian diaspora and their mentality is the real threat to Turkey. Armenia has also regained its independence and won a war against the Turks in recent history. Time its not on Turkish side.

Armenians nearly lost the war in 1992 when some elements in Russia started supporting Baku. In 1992 how did the Armenian diaspora stop a potential disaster in Karabakh ?
Slaves don't believe in themselves. They are reliant on external support!

Time is of no factor for ancient people who can never be assimilated or destroyed.....Turks should know this.

The Turks say they are 7,000 years old, more ancient than Armenians!
Armenians assimilated in large numbers during the Ottoman empire.
Slaves have a very low opinion of other slaves. In the Ottoman empire Armenians were very disrespectful of other Armenians
Ottomans welcomed anyone who joined them and become Muslims. That is how they became stronger and stronger!

[Eddo211]

Re: The Ottomans

how? Armenian self-confidence is connected to membership of the CSTO. Ottoman slave mentality does not change overnight

Turks still think in two dimensions.....Armenian diaspora and their mentality is the real threat to Turkey. Armenia has also regained its independence and won a war against the Turks in recent history. Time its not on Turkish side.

The Seljuk Turks arrived in the 11th century. Turks are unlike others, they have for some time had an absolute majority in Anatolia (even allowing for Kurds and others)- yes, through genocide, assimilation, conversion, but this is the result today . 900 years is a long time

Time is of no factor for ancient people who can never be assimilated or destroyed.....Turks should know this.

[lampron]

Re: The Ottomans

We were warriors who became slaves

correct

.....not anymore.

how? Armenian self-confidence is connected to membership of the CSTO. Ottoman slave mentality does not change overnight

Turkey's time will come, we have seen this many times with other invaders of our lands.

The Seljuk Turks arrived in the 11th century. Turks are unlike others, they have for some time had an absolute majority in Anatolia (even allowing for Kurds and others)- yes, through genocide, assimilation, conversion, but this is the result today . 900 years is a long time